Holocaust Myth?

Much shit is slung at Iran's president for claiming that the Holocaust was a myth... My question to you is: Is it?

 

And in the case if it being so, why would we be lied to? Who would benefit?

 

It is no secret that I have NO love (Keine Lieb) for the Arabs, but should my hatred of these people cause me to automatically treat all their words as lies? Should my country being allied with Israel warrant a free pass to lies and deceit by my own government?

 

I think it's time for the US, and the western world as a whole, to rethink our policies on who we trust and defend...

 

My position is that Iran should be treated as an enemy to the US, and the western world as a whole... Not for anti-semitism, but for threatening our security, and that of our allies, regardless who they may be... Our allies are ours, and any attack on them should be considered and attack on us!

 

But we must know for sure... We must know without a doubt, just what it is that we are fighting for... As a nation, and as a culture...

 

I have no in trenched love for the Jews either... I am not one, and they are not one of mine... But as of right now, they are our allies, and have been steadfast ones at that for quite some time now... Given that, we must stand by them if given a choice between International Jewry, and Islamofascists...

 

But regardless of who we choose to populate our ranks with, we must have a clear understanding of what they are about, and what the truth of their situation is...

 

Watch this <--- about 1 hour long... but VERY informative...

 

---------- Read after video -------------

 

I think we really need to be a lot more selective about who our allies are in the future... Too many times before, we have backed someone or some group to later find out that they have an ultimate goal of doing in the US even more so then the enemy within we help them conquer!

 

EG: Castro... Agrarian Reformer My ASS ! !

 

Bin Laden... Freedom fighter? the first think he did in power was to limit freedom, and then attack the very nation who power gave him the opportunity to do so...

 

And lastly, the worst choice the US has ever made when choosing sides... Nazi Germany... We chose to fight them, when we should have recognized them as defending their own culture... Instead, we sided with the Soviet Union... A nation that had killed 20 million Xtians in the 'purges'. We sided with them against the Germans, Who at WORST killed only 6 million Jews, and this was all a lie!

 

Once again we found ourselves on the wrong side of our own interests! We chose to fight ourselves! And as our numbers, and culture diminish in size and strength, our foes are gaining in power, and audacity!

 

We need to sever all ties with all but a few nations... We need to start forming our foreign and domestic policies to reflect OUR needs... Both as a nation and a culture... We need to secure a future for OUR people first before we reach out and defend another's...

HAHA, bout time a worthy topic surfaced! Thanks.

 

I'll have to post more later but this is a very interesting video which I seen quite some time ago. What they are presenting is great evidence against the holocaust 'myth'. The only thing to question is the validity of what is being presented. It isn't terribly hard to lie through media but some things, such as the interview with the cremation expert, seem to hold up quite well.

 

Who stands to gain from this? The allies ofcourse. This could perhaps be seen as a better done version of the "WMD" excuse for war. Although the scale on which it is implemented makes such a conspiracy hard to take in, the risk of being found out is certainly worse then the cost of keeping things under wraps. What really bothers me is that the holocaust denial is not only illegal, but illegal internationally! So long as people aren't trying to breed anti-semitism along with their search for anwsers in this matter there is NO reason we should be disallowed from researching and presenting opposition to what has been presented as fact.

 

History is written by the victor indeed, however since the victor in this case is not in total control of the educated world (As it was in pervious centuries) We are able to question the establishment, this however must be done before those who remember the events all die off and the shambles history all belong to 'The Man'

HAHA, bout time a worthy topic surfaced! Thanks.

 

I'll have to post more later but this is a very interesting video which I seen quite some time ago. What they are presenting is great evidence against the holocaust 'myth'. The only thing to question is the validity of what is being presented. It isn't terribly hard to lie through media but some things, such as the interview with the cremation expert, seem to hold up quite well.

 

Who stands to gain from this? The allies of course. This could perhaps be seen as a better done version of the "WMD" excuse for war. Although the scale on which it is implemented makes such a conspiracy hard to take in, the risk of being found out is certainly worse then the cost of keeping things under wraps. What really bothers me is that the holocaust denial is not only illegal, but illegal internationally! So long as people aren't trying to breed anti-Semites along with their search for answers in this matter there is NO reason we should be disallowed from researching and presenting opposition to what has been presented as fact.

 

History is written by the victor indeed, however since the victor in this case is not in total control of the educated world (As it was in previous centuries) We are able to question the establishment, this however must be done before those who remember the events all die off and the shambles history all belong to 'The Man'

 

Question however... Yes, the allies would have justification for going to war, but you have to understand that in 1941, we really didn't need more of a justification to go to war... Did we enter the first world war because of German atrocities? No... We did it in the interest of our allies, (or so we thought)... Turns out, it was in the interest of the Jews...

 

So why did we need the holocaust as a reason to go to war then? And if it was not needed as a reasoning for war against other western nations, then why is the Holocaust unfairly touted as the reason the west went to war with Germany? And with History proving that MANY aspect of what we teach about the Holocaust as untrue, why the lies? Why do we, a western nation, unjustly accuse another western nation, of atrocities that are completely unfounded?

 

We have not, and to this day do not ever benefit from our siding with international Jewry starting back in 1917! Yet we defend them fiercely! Why? I agree that as long as we say we will, we should, and that we should treat any attack on Israel (the country itself) as an attack on both our allies, and our political machismo... but What is it that we are missing that makes this bond of nations so strong? Especially considering just how much our friendship with them cost us both politically and monetarily!

 

Does anything in this situation make any sense?

simple. There has been such a HUGE stigma attached to saying anything derogatory about jewish people that we are willing to go in the opposite direction. It's called guilt. We basically ignored what WAS going on in Germany until it became financial advantageous for us to get our butts in gear.

 

I am not sure ti is all lies, but I am sure there is much fabrication involved. BUT guilt combined with being politically correct will stop the total truth from ever surfacing.

 

So ok, ya you can say that was a complete ramble.

simple. There has been such a HUGE stigma attached to saying anything derogatory about jewish people that we are willing to go in the opposite direction. It's called guilt. We basically ignored what WAS going on in Germany until it became financial advantageous for us to get our butts in gear.

 

I am not sure ti is all lies, but I am sure there is much fabrication involved. BUT guilt combined with being politically correct will stop the total truth from ever surfacing.

 

So ok, ya you can say that was a complete ramble.

 

But what would WE have to feel guilty about?

Well, for one, the western world DID turn a blind eye to what was going on (there WAS some ugly shite there) and we are conditioned to believe that it is a cardinal sin to poke fun at certain groups to the point where one cannot even say they do not like a particular person for fear of being labeled a bigot, prejudice or anti Semite. All these labels have become as dangerous to society as all the derogatory racial slangs. It is not really whether or not we SHOULD feel guilty, it's that if you don't BOY will you face the stigma

I haven't had a chance to watch the video yet and don't like replying to treads uninformed but I have heard some about people claiming the Holocaust was a myth. In fact I think there was a big to do about Mel Gibson's father being one of these people when he made Passion of the Christ. Some people were saying that's why she skewed the outcome as somewhat anti-Semitic. I thought I'd kinda talk a little about the Israel as an ally part of FA's first post.

 

Here is a link to an article about the many times in the past that Israel showed it is less then a trusted ally of the US.

 

http://www.counterpunch.org/husseini08302004.html

 

This included numerous incidences of Israel intelligence spying on the US and also an incident in 1967 when Israel attacked the USS Liberty and killed 34 crew members. This article highlights events going back to 1954.

 

I think we should be cautious to blindly side with Israel.

 

Now, I'm sure we too have intelligence gathering that has been taking place in Israel but I don't think we've ever attacked them or any of their vessels.

I haven't had a chance to watch the video yet and don't like replying to treads uninformed but I have heard some about people claiming the Holocaust was a myth. In fact I think there was a big to do about Mel Gibson's father being one of these people when he made Passion of the Christ. Some people were saying that's why she skewed the outcome as somewhat anti-Semitic. I thought I'd kinda talk a little about the Israel as an ally part of FA's first post.

 

Here is a link to an article about the many times in the past that Israel showed it is less then a trusted ally of the US.

 

http://www.counterpunch.org/husseini08302004.html

 

This included numerous incidences of Israel intelligence spying on the US and also an incident in 1967 when Israel attacked the USS Liberty and killed 34 crew members. This article highlights events going back to 1954.

 

I think we should be cautious to blindly side with Israel.

 

Now, I'm sure we too have intelligence gathering that has been taking place in Israel but I don't think we've ever attacked them or any of their vessels.

 

The USS Liberty was a tragic case of friendly fire.

Now where do I begin? I suppose in thanking Tizz for letting me know about this thread, cheers Tizz.

 

The video posted is a great one, 'Judea Declares War on Germany', there is another, even better in my opinion. Here are the details.

 

 

In a dramatic and unprecedented videotaped interview, Dr. Franciszek Piper, senior curator and director of archives of the Auschwitz State Museum admitted on camera that 'Krema 1,' the alleged 'homicidal gas chamber' shown off to hundreds of thousands of tourists every year at the Auschwitz main camp, was, in fact, fabricated after the war by the Soviet Union -apparently on the direct orders of Josef Stalin.

 

What Piper said - in effect and on camera - was that the explosive 1988 Leuchter Report was correct: no homicidal gassings took place in the buildings designated as 'homicidal gas chambers' at Auschwitz.

 

With this admission by none other than the respected head of the Auschwitz State Museum, one of the most sacred 'facts' of history has been destroyed. This 'gas chamber' is the major historical 'fact' on which much of the foreign and domestic policies of all Western nations since WWII are based.

 

It is the basis for the $100+ billion in foreign aid the United States has poured into the state of Israel since its inception in 1948 - amounting to $16,500 for every man, woman and child in the Jewish state and billions more paid by Germany in 'reparations' - not to mention the constructing of Israel's national telephone, electrical and rail systems...all gifts of the German people. It is the basis for the $10 billion 'loan' (read 'gift') made to Israel for housing its immigrants in the occupied territories...while Americans sleep on the streets and businesses are bankrupted by the thousands. (Note - As of 2004, not a single 'loan' of US tax money made to the state of Israel by Washington has ever been paid back)

 

I'm not sure how to link images here so I'll link a thread or two at Plaza with info on this subject....

 

The Elusive 'Six Million'

 

The UN Decides On A Universal Ban On Revisionism

And a few more interesting articles on the subject....

 

Six reasons why the gas chamber story is a lie

 

How the British Obtained The Confessions Of Rudolf H

Most of the documentation of the holocaust comes from the Nazis, they thought they were going to win ww2 and made films, documentated who was killed and how, keep records of all those who were killed, even though some of these records were burnt in the last days of the war, some remained, they also made films of camps. Also the allies when they came across the camps did the same, they filmed the camps, the mass graves, killing rooms and crematoriums.

Sure some ugly shit happened. I have yet to meet the person who denies that. BUT, it is the extent to which it happened that bothers most. hell, if you were in the SS and jusdged on how you handled the brood you were in charge of with pride being found only in absurd inhumanity, don't you thin a few of them would fudge the numbers a bit? When germany was up, that made them look good, when they were loosing, it mean going on trial for war crimes. it's obvious numbers don't add up.

 

it's not so much whether or not it happened that pisses so many off, it is that to question the numbers and WANT to find accuracey for the sake of history can land you in jail is what is disturbing

Most of the documentation of the holocaust comes from the Nazis, they thought they were going to win ww2 and made films, documentated who was killed and how, keep records of all those who were killed, even though some of these records were burnt in the last days of the war, some remained, they also made films of camps. Also the allies when they came across the camps did the same, they filmed the camps, the mass graves, killing rooms and crematoriums.

 

Evidence please. Links to details and documents, or do you expect people to take your word over ALL the contrary evidence posted so far in this thread?

Most of the documentation of the holocaust comes from the Nazis, they thought they were going to win ww2 and made films, documentated who was killed and how, keep records of all those who were killed, even though some of these records were burnt in the last days of the war, some remained, they also made films of camps. Also the allies when they came across the camps did the same, they filmed the camps, the mass graves, killing rooms and crematoriums.

 

negative... from what I have read, there is not a single piece of Nazi paper that gives any information about state sponsored murder... All of the information we have to go on is what the USSR, and USA has said about the subject, along with prisoner interviews... and as this video shows, many lies/misunderstandings can be pointed out in thier testimony... All of the dead bodies filmed by us and the soviets were documented cases of malnurishment due to 2 factors... typhous, and allied bombing...

 

During many parts of the war, jewish prisoners had more caloric intake than most german civies, and only when food had dried up completely, due to massive allied bombing efforts, did prisoners start to starve...

 

Typhous was a big threat to prisoner health... the germans new that, and constructed large fumigation rooms for just that purpose... The red cross even made comments on how well run Nazi "death camps" were...

 

The last few months of the war saw typhous and the resulting malnutrition of the prisoners due to no food in GERMANY as a whole... remember the film of GERMAN CITIZENS eating garbage of the street when the allies roled in... NO ONE had food... not just the prisoners.. and if they were running 'death camps', why did they never, throughout the WHOLE war, ever have enough coke (coal) or gas on hand to burn more than 16 bodies a day at the largest camp?!

 

With the typhous and starvation rate climbing so rapidly at the end of the war, they had no where near enough coke to cremate them all, and these piles of bodies were the result... They would have buried them (much cheaper and faster... ask sadam), but the camps were built on a high water table, and would have spoiled the water resulting in more typhous deaths! Does that sound like they are running a death camp?! hardly..

Negative again!

 

They did have a lack of food for everybody. But it was also total genocide to the Jews. It can’t be denied! They had fat fuck Nazi's running around.

 

Tizz you can hardly believe the numbers? That’s cus you live in your plush little house with your fucking blinders on!

 

There was a tremendous amount of documentation that went on! Plenty of it! Names, tatto numbers, photos, dates and how they were killed in Nazi records.

Countless records of medical testing on live subjects. FACTS!

 

They also burned a lot of records.

 

We also had smuggled photos from Jews that took them with homemade camera’s. The film was hidden and buried in metal milk containers.

 

We had reconnaissance plane photos of the Jews being shipped to the camps by train and the big ass billowy smoke stacks. Completely identified as crematoriums.

 

They new people would come up with this myth shit and that's why they documented the camps as well as they did at the time.

 

Anybody that doesn’t believe in the holocaust has their head so far up their ass they can see their tonsils!

Negative again!

 

They did have a lack of food for everybody. But it was also total genocide to the Jews. It can

its funny how years after something happens it gets disputed. time erases everything. i imagine that thousands of years from now people will doubt world war 2 ever happened. my great uncle went through those camps. one of them had been left by the germans only days before. but before they left they shot over a quater of the jews. do u need any more evidence then that?

The question remains... Why do we associate the holocaust with Jewish Extermination attempts, when it has already been admitted by at least two European governments (France, England) that no more than 1.1 million jews died in total in those camps, but extimates of Non-Jews killed in those camps remain at approxamately 4 Milliion?

 

By Michael Collins Piper

A thought-provoking new anthology edited by English historian Vivian Bird casts stark new light on what really happened at Auschwitz during World War II. As the evidence shows, the official "facts" just don

OK fullauto I get the jest of the beginning. Reverse discrimination.

 

OK I apologize to tizz for questioning the numbers and for the head up the ass statement. Everybody has their opinion and can believe what they want. He was right up to that point. After that it was total bullshit!!!!

 

 

We know the Jew’s have been persecuted way before Hitler. So what?

I’ve seen first hand the holocaust museum. I've seen the photo's, the glasses, shoes, gold teeth. I believe what I saw.

Could it have been propagandized? Blown out of proposition? NO not in any way shape or form. Can you convince me it didn't happen.

Not in this life time.

Do we quarrel about the numbers and what constitute a Holocaust? OK there's room for debate.

 

The constant “ alleged holocaust” and blown out of historical context remarks through this clip can obviously be call propaganda also. Ya think?

 

If you were being persecuted would you sit on your ass or declare war! I would be holding that news paper too! So would you.

 

This guy has nothing.

I think the real point is, snafu, that the holocaust is just one of many, and it is now old hat. Very old hat. The emotive value is all but gone, but just watch your local cinema for the latest remake or rehash to fire up the hatred again.

 

Fact: Korean war. 1,858,000 to 3,822,000 Chinese and North Koreans dead, wounded or lost in battle. 1,271,244 to 1,818,410 allied casualties total.

 

Now would you prefer to be killed with gas, or get covered in burning petroleum jelly, or step on a land mine and die of gangrene to the legs?

 

It's war. From what I can gather, Hitler actually wanted to deport most of the Jews in the compounds, but nobody wanted them.

 

War is hell. Rehashing it is pointless emotive bullshit.

Using atrocities carried out during wartime for political gain, is tantamount to blackmail.

 

Next.

Evidence please. Links to details and documents, or do you expect people to take your word over ALL the contrary evidence posted so far in this thread?

 

try these

http://www.ushmm.org/

http://www.holocaust-history.org/

http://www.holocaustsurvivors.org/

http://history1900s.about.com/library/holocaust/blholocaust.htm

http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/holocaust/timeline.html

 

I ask you this, if the holocaust didn't happen, how did approx 6 million jews die? Did they all do the lemming dance?

I think the main problem people have with the idea of the holocaust or any act of genoside (the holocaust is not the first time, or last time this type of thing has happened), is that people do not want to admit to themselves that we all have this type of zenophobia within us.

 

Weather you believe in creation or evolution, the fact is that humanity has risen to the top of the food chain because of one simple fact. Humanity is the worlds most efficient killer, and with the right training and motivation, humanity embraces the killer within with ease.

Never debate with idiots. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. The holocaust was real. We still should not give Isreal one damn cent.

 

http://remember.org/History.root.rev.html

Never debate with idiots. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. The holocaust was real. We still should not give Isreal one damn cent.

 

http://remember.org/History.root.rev.html

 

The holocaust DID happen... however, it was not a JEWISH thing alone...

well who else did they make wear the star of david to identify them?