Israel-Palestinaen Conflict

As we all know Israel has started attacking Lebnon over their capture of 3 Israeli soldiers, which raises a very religious and ethnic issue of the Israel-Palestinaen conflict which has been seiging on before we all on LPF were born (I know this cos I've deeply studied this topic in Modern History).

 

But what do you think? Who do you think has the right motive to their ownership of their holy land?

 

I personally think that it's 2 kids fighting over a toy. It's been and still is so bloody, and it can be resolved, but either sides refuse to co-operate with each other.

Well If you believe in God then it belongs to the Jews because God promised that land to Abraham. But I don't believe in god so I think that they should share the land and stop all the bloodshed.

Thats sucks, I hate that stuff...

I just think it's a bad idea when you decide to formulate a country when there is already one on the place where you formulate it...

the conflic over the sacret land has been going on for years n years n years and was made worse during the reign of the British Empire where they kicked one nation out for the other and did it again.......... and again and then left them to decide.

Highlight to read if you don't care about getting religion into this:

 

As a Christian, I'm supposed to be okay with war, and let it happen, because the Bible says that wars happen. I suppose that's why they're mostly Republican, because the Republicans are war-mongerers, like Bush. But, personally, I want peace between all nations. I don't want anyone to die, no matter what religion, or belief system they come from.

 

But, aside from that, don't you think it's kind of stupid how anyone (that is to say, any country) that attacks a United Nations country, is automatically a terrorist, but when we attack back, or start an uninstigated war, it's fighting for freedom?

 

America and Iraq? Please. Bush was getting less and less popular, so he used a tragedy (that he might have had a hand in) to get approval, by sticking that on Saddam Hussein.

 

The real reason why Saddam Hussein and Iraq were attacked? Easy. Impress Daddy, by taking out daddy's enemy.

 

I'm sorry? Did I miss something here?

 

Was Saddam sending people to attack the United States?

Was Saddam sending videos of threats to the United States?

No.

 

It's the same thing with Israel and Palestine. Exact same thing.

 

America and Iraq? Please. Bush was getting less and less popular, so he used a tragedy (that he might have had a hand in) to get approval, by sticking that on Saddam Hussein.

 

The real reason why Saddam Hussein and Iraq were attacked? Easy. Impress Daddy, by taking out daddy's enemy.

 

You made really excellent points in your post and I agree with you almost completly. I think Bush started the was because it was a way to get a 2nd term in office because the American masses don't want to change presidents in the middle of a war. That's just me though.

i don't everyone in middel east is crazy....

I hate this, sooo much. Like 3/4 of my family lives where its getting bombed[israel]. They have been in bomb shelters since wed. I dont care whos fault it is or what, I just want them to get out alive.

 

 

Sorry, it just feels bad.

But what do you think? Who do you think has the right motive to their ownership of their holy land?

 

I personally think that it's 2 kids fighting over a toy. It's been and still is so bloody, and it can be resolved, but either sides refuse to co-operate with each other.

a toy? Israel a toy? What are you talking about? It's nothing like that. Without Israel, where are the Jews? No home land, nothing, no place of true unity. It's their holy land, they have a right to defend their country. It's the ultimate dream of every Jew to visit Israel one day, even live there. We gave the palestinians Gaza, and now they want more? They won't stop until the whole State of Israel is distroyed, they want Jerusalem, but like that's ever going to happen peacefully. It is such a holy place for all religions. Peace is not going to work, they've tried it several times, everytime its broken. War was inevitable, it can only get worse. For me, I hate the wars, but I agree that they have to be carried out. I have family and friends that live in Israel and I hope and pray that they get through all the unrest. But Israel can't just lay down and let palestine walk all over them. BTW THIS IS MY OPINION SO DON'T EAT ME

Let's tie up some loose end here real quick.

 

Number One

Bush did not go to Iraq to impress Poppa Bush.(aimed at Reflectionist) He was more or less going at what he felt was a breathing ground for Radical Islamists and Terrorists. Comparing Afaghanistan to Iraq was like comparing Hawaii to New York City. Come on we all know Iraq was a powder keg. They had potential to start chemical warfare. If we allowed them to procede who knows what would have happened. Bush had to find a way to get at them first. So I would agree he probably molded the truth to fit his plan. Not exactly an honest thing to do, but we all have done it to get what we want. His aim was to slowly get rid of all the shelters for terrorist organizations in the middle east section. Especially in non-democratic countries. After Iraq it was obvious he was going to go to other countries. The only issue he didn't think about was difficulty. How we would be stuck in Iraq for a good while. Which is essentially is dumb, becuase in general wars are long.

 

So a recap for the people who don't understand logic and English. Twin Towers got hit. Terrorism becomes key topic. Some how Bush has to get rid of the majority of middle eastern terror groups in the middle east. He figures attack the stronger non-democratic countries first flush out any issues in there then move on to the next.

 

Hell I bet he was thinking shit I could possibly get some free oil when I do this anyway. But that wasn't what was on his mind. Anyone could have understood the side-effects of what would happen once he established war. He took a gamble. Some say it was for the better some say it was for the worse. Your opinion there bub. Just put two and two together. Listen to his speeches. Analyze shit. It's slowly falls together. He was essentially going for a (eh I don't wanna say this but I rekon I have to in order to fit the metaphor/similie situation) Hitler-like theme where he tries to eliminate as much terrorism as possible.

 

 

AS FOR THE WHOLE ISRAEL V IT'S SURROUNDINGs THING! Israel has a right to fight back. Everyone keeps attempting to walk over them and shit and I understand they are tired of it. The strategically want to make more of a name for themselves by saying "Hey don't fuck with us." This is just one of the instances. Unfortunately religion has to play a major role and all of these things and seeing as Israel is a Jewish country sourounded by Muslims...they are essentially screwed for a while. I don't liek this whole war thing, but this shit has been going on forever. What we need is for America to hurry up and finish in Iraq. Then they can go to that section and say hey "Calm the fuck down!" and it'll happen (im hoping).

 

And isn't it funny how now some of the other countries are waiting for America to start doing something now. After they just got done dissing us about Iraq?

Why don't people just stop shit like that? War and stuff like this is so unnecessary

Why don't people just stop shit like that? War and stuff like this is so unnecessary

 

 

Lol well lets put it like this. If you have a bro or sister you can relate.

 

You know how when a little sister(bro) or older one like pushes you and your like hey wtf. But you let it slide. So they do it again. And again becuase they can do it and you wont do anything becuase you don't want any problems and you rather show love. Until one day your like fuck this shit and just steal em right in the face? same premise.

Lol well lets put it like this. If you have a bro or sister you can relate.

 

You know how when a little sister(bro) or older one like pushes you and your like hey wtf. But you let it slide. So they do it again. And again becuase they can do it and you wont do anything becuase you don't want any problems and you rather show love. Until one day your like fuck this shit and just steal em right in the face? same premise.

 

Yeah, but it's a difference if I smack somebody or if I kill a thousand people...

Bush did not go to Iraq to impress Poppa Bush.(aimed at Reflectionist) He was more or less going at what he felt was a breathing ground for Radical Islamists and Terrorists. Comparing Afaghanistan to Iraq was like comparing Hawaii to New York City. Come on we all know Iraq was a powder keg. They had potential to start chemical warfare. If we allowed them to procede who knows what would have happened. Bush had to find a way to get at them first. So I would agree he probably molded the truth to fit his plan. Not exactly an honest thing to do, but we all have done it to get what we want. His aim was to slowly get rid of all the shelters for terrorist organizations in the middle east section. Especially in non-democratic countries. After Iraq it was obvious he was going to go to other countries. The only issue he didn't think about was difficulty. How we would be stuck in Iraq for a good while. Which is essentially is dumb, becuase in general wars are long.

 

I agree that all terrorists need to be taken into justice. But it's when you start bending the rules about what defines a terrorist. Maybe my problem isn't Bush himself, but he definitely (wether he meant to or not) started the sterotyping of Muslims = Terrorists. And that is not true. Has it ever occured to you that WE might be the terrorists to them, and that they are just doing what they feel is right? The United States is doing what it feels is right, but in the process they are terrorising other countries. Countries that don't even have anything to do with what pissed us off.

 

It's like the conversation went like this:

 

"Excuse me, Mr. President. We just recieved intel about September 11th, sir. It looks like Osama Bin Laden is behind the attacks."

"And, where is he?"

"Afghanistan, sir."

"Well... Let's attack Iraq. There's a dictator there about as dumb as I am, and it'd settle a score with my dad. And there's more Oil there. That's three reasons. How many do we have to go for Afghanistan?"

"Freedom and Justice, sir?"

"Freedom and Justice? Nah. We don't need that. We need Oil, and to kill muslims. Let's see... how shall we go about justifying Iraq?"

"Let's say that Iraq's got weapons! The American people are conceited enough to fall for that."

"Alright, let's do that."

 

Actually, I wouldn't be suprised one bit if that's how it went.

 

Bush doesn't write his own speeches.

 

He was essentially going for a (eh I don't wanna say this but I rekon I have to in order to fit the metaphor/similie situation) Hitler-like theme where he tries to eliminate as much terrorism as possible.

 

You mean, kinda like using a tragedy [Reichstag / 9/11] that he caused to pin the blame on a religious group / race [Jews / Muslims (Arabs)] that doesn't deserve it in a country that has nothing to do with anything [Poland / Iraq ]to put them in a prison [Dachau / Guantanimo] for an indefinite amount of time, all while making them feel humiliated by making sure they're self conscious about their race / religion [Yellow patches on clothes / pissing on the qu'ran]?

 

And I haven't even mentioned http://www.iraqbodycount.net

Why don't people just stop shit like that? War and stuff like this is so unnecessary

Because it's not that easy to just "stop". They have tried peace, many, many, many times, each time it hasn't worked. In this case, war is a necessity IMO, because peace hasn't worked (and believe me both sides have tried) and this continual battle has been going on for years over Israel + land etc, and either side won't give up. Israel have fought hard for an independant state, they arn't going to give it up that easily. Palestine wants more land (despite the fact they got Gaza), they won't give up easily either. so...

 

You mean, kinda like using a tragedy [Reichstag / 9/11] that he caused to pin the blame on a religious group / race [Jews / Muslims (Arabs)] that doesn't deserve it in a country that has nothing to do with anything [Poland / Iraq ]to put them in a prison [Dachau / Guantanimo] for an indefinite amount of time, all while making them feel humiliated by making sure they're self conscious about their race / religion [Yellow patches on clothes / pissing on the qu'ran]?

 

And I haven't even mentioned http://www.iraqbodycount.net

 

kind of but not in a persay negative connotation

Im surprised the British hasn't got involved. They did in the 1930s with the Balfour Declarations and other documents, and then they screwed up big time and handed the situation over to the United Nations. Now, I'm just waiting for Bush to give a damn.

kind of but not in a persay negative connotation

because that's what Bush means to do. It can't possibly have negative connocations if it's purposeful.

 

[/sarcasm]

 

I think we should split this off into a different thread, in all seriousness. This thread is about Israel / Palestine, not about Bush and Hitler. We could discuss that in a different thread, yes?

 

I'm just waiting for Bush to give a damn.

He does. Not what you want though.

 

When he said "The terrorists never stop thinking about ways to harm our country, and neither do we," it was stated that that was a Freudian Slip. The White House was depending on America's less than profound knowledge of psychological terms to save their ass.

 

What they want us to assume a F. Slip is: an accident.

 

What a F. Slip really is: The unconscious part of your brain peeking it's ugly little head out. So, like, if I accidentally said the word "boob" while talking to a girl, what do you think is on my mind? Boobs, perhaps?

 

I'm just waiting for Bush to pull a Mr. Krabs. When there's something serious to be done, Mr. Krabs will say "Save Me MONEY!" or something, and it leaves you stupefied that he would say that. I'm waiting for Georgie to leave some troops with "Save Me Oil!" or "Save me ass!"

 

And it's even Bush's native language: improper grammar.

Well if your christian dosen't it say the world will end when there is a war in Isreal (or maybe it says Jursulam not sure).....and lets not start a argument over christians or atheist have wrong belfies I'm just asking.....

Some bitch that talks alot of shit about me went to Lebanon for the summer. So my guess is shes either fucked or already got our of there.

because that's what Bush means to do. It can't possibly have negative connocations if it's purposeful.

 

[/sarcasm]

 

I think we should split this off into a different thread, in all seriousness. This thread is about Israel / Palestine, not about Bush and Hitler. We could discuss that in a different thread, yes?

 

 

He does. Not what you want though.

 

When he said "The terrorists never stop thinking about ways to harm our country, and neither do we," it was stated that that was a Freudian Slip. The White House was depending on America's less than profound knowledge of psychological terms to save their ass.

 

What they want us to assume a F. Slip is: an accident.

 

What a F. Slip really is: The unconscious part of your brain peeking it's ugly little head out. So, like, if I accidentally said the word "boob" while talking to a girl, what do you think is on my mind? Boobs, perhaps?

 

I'm just waiting for Bush to pull a Mr. Krabs. When there's something serious to be done, Mr. Krabs will say "Save Me MONEY!" or something, and it leaves you stupefied that he would say that. I'm waiting for Georgie to leave some troops with "Save Me Oil!" or "Save me ass!"

 

And it's even Bush's native language: improper grammar.

 

 

But he doesn't. He was whispering something to Blair and was caught swearing about the Lebonon, Syrian (cos they've been involved with the whole conflict for ages) other stuff.

 

In fact, I learnt yesterday in history, that (i mean no offense to anyone here but this was told to me yesterday) the whole Middle Eastern world want to kick the Israeli's out and they've been wanting this for ages.

 

The Israelis are stubborn. Because they were dealt a deal from Hizzabala (sp?) the anti-Israelian Palestininan based guerrila group hiding out in Lebonon, about handing back some prisoners of theirs back over to the Palestinians. The Israelis said no, because they only wanted their 2 soldiers back and that was it.

 

Also another thing I would like to add:

 

Does Bush care about what's going on over there? No.

Does Bush care about the fighting that's happening there? No.

Does Bush care about his reputation in his own country? Yes.

Does Bush care about the rich Jews funding him and his state in several ways? Yes.