Right or Wrong?

Mother furious after in-school clinic sets up teen's abortion

 

SEATTLE -- The mother of a Ballard High School student is fuming after the health center on campus helped facilitate her daughter's abortion during school hours.

 

The mother, whom KOMO News has chosen to identify only as "Jill," says the clinic kept the information "confidential."

 

When she signed a consent form, Jill figured it meant her 15 year old could go to the Ballard Teen Health Center located inside the high school for an earache, a sports physical, even birth control, but not for help terminating a pregnancy.

 

"She took a pregnancy test at school at the teen health center," she said. "Nowhere in this paperwork does it mention abortion or facilitating abortion."

 

Jill says her daughter, a pro-life advocate, was given a pass, put in a taxi and sent off to have an abortion during school hours all without her family knowing.

 

"We had no idea this was being facilitated on campus," said Jill. "They just told her that if she concealed it from her family, that it would be free of charge and no financial responsibility."

 

The Seattle School District says it doesn't run the health clinics at high schools. Swedish Medical Center runs the clinic at Ballard High and protects the students' privacy.

 

T.J. Cosgrove of the King County Health Department, which administers the school-based programs for the health department, says it's always best if parents are involved in their children's health care, but don't always have a say.

 

"At any age in the state of Washington, an individual can consent to a termination of pregnancy," he said.

 

But Jill says she not only didn't have a say in her daughter's abortion, but also didn't know about it.

 

"Makes me feel like my rights were completely stripped away."

 

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http://www.komonews.com/news/local/88971742.html

This was way over the line. I think giving her all the info. is just fine, but helping her to get one at 15 years old without me knowing is way over the line. What if she dies with complications, what if I said I would help raise the baby? There are so many options I could offer before abortion. I would be horrified that I was not a part of them. If nothing else I want to be there to hold her hand.

This was way over the line. I think giving her all the info. is just fine, but helping her to get one at 15 years old without me knowing is way over the line. What if she dies with complications, what if I said I would help raise the baby? There are so many options I could offer before abortion. I would be horrified that I was not a part of them. If nothing else I want to be there to hold her hand.

I really doubt they "helped her get an abortion" especially since she was a "Pro-Life advocate" as her Mom stated..I smell lawsuit. What I really want to know is "What was way over the line?" A 15 year old having sex without protection...a 15 year old girl who didn't know that sex leads to pregnancy...a 15 year old that couldn't go to her parents and tell them what was happening, or the fact that a 15 year old took it upon herself to make her own decision on how her life was going to go? Which part was over the line...her not thinking like you?

I really doubt they "helped her get an abortion"

 

 

So you decided to ignore the part where the in school clinic, gave her a pass to leave school, called her a taxi and sent her on her way to an abortion clinic, to "doubt they helped her get an abortion"?

 

I haven't decided myself if this is overstepping boundaries, but I don't think any reasonable person could deny that the school clinic "helped" the teen with obtaining an abortion.

I really doubt they "helped her get an abortion" especially since she was a "Pro-Life advocate" as her Mom stated..I smell lawsuit. What I really want to know is "What was way over the line?" A 15 year old having sex without protection...a 15 year old girl who didn't know that sex leads to pregnancy...a 15 year old that couldn't go to her parents and tell them what was happening, or the fact that a 15 year old took it upon herself to make her own decision on how her life was going to go? Which part was over the line...her not thinking like you?

 

Wow Angelica..first couple posts and you come in like a hurricane huh?

 

I have two girls. A 10 year old and an 8 year old. I am pro-choice. I absolutely think they have every right to make their own decisions. If being sexually active is what they want then at 15...I hope they feel comfortable enough to come to me and discuss it. I would help to get the birth control. If they didn't feel comfortable coming to me...mine are well informed enough to know where they can get it...and I'm fine not knowing if that's their choice. The bottom line is teenagers make stupid decisions. I am not condemning them for it, nor do I expect them to make the same choices I would, but you can be damn sure if my 15 year old was taking a trip to the hospital to get an abortion, I want to be there to help her see that I have other options for her if she thinks abortion is the only way. If abortion was ultimately her choice after getting all the info and knowing I would help...then I want to be there for any hospital procedure that can possibly harm my daughter. If a school called a cab and arranged an abortion, that's facilitating one, and that to me is over the line. I have no issue with administering a pregnancy test or birth control, but I damn well want to be informed if they are heading to the hospital.

It should be outside the role of government. If the little tramp wanted an abortion I don't see why taxpayers should pay for it even though, in cases like this, it probably will result in a net gain for the taxpayer.

I hate abortion. I hate it with a vehement passion. I believe it to be a deplorable act and the parties involved will have to pay for it in this life or the next.

 

That said, I am pro-choice. I am pro-choice because some of these fanatical anti-abortion groups urge, poke, prod the federal government to step in and do something about it (we might get that with Obamacare). The issue of abortion, like just about anything, should be left up to the State.

 

My stance is from an anti-big government point of view outweighing and putting responsibility and judgment in the person. It is the woman and all involved that will have to pay the ultimate price in the end. Our final judge should be our reason not to do something horrendous. So, I say let them choose their fate.

 

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The parents should know exactly what is going on in their teenage little girl's life outside the home; it is the parent's duty. Yet, I don't think most parents care... they rush their kids off to school ASAP and let the government babysit the kid. As long as the parent is not inconvenienced, it is perfectly fine for their children to run a muck. Thus... government education.

 

The girl is a minor according to the law and the parents should have been notified from the get-go. There is NO margin of error or a "my bad" in this situation, it's a matter of life and death and the parent's of a minor being involved in a life altering procedure. Those involved on the government school's level ought to be dragged out in the street and shot... well tried and fired or something similar.

I really doubt they "helped her get an abortion" especially since she was a "Pro-Life advocate" as her Mom stated..I smell lawsuit. What I really want to know is "What was way over the line?" A 15 year old having sex without protection...a 15 year old girl who didn't know that sex leads to pregnancy...a 15 year old that couldn't go to her parents and tell them what was happening, or the fact that a 15 year old took it upon herself to make her own decision on how her life was going to go? Which part was over the line...her not thinking like you?

In my opinion most of those bad behaviors you just described were made possible because the girl knew there was a 'safety net' available to her. She knew the school would help her get a free abortion and that sits at the back of the mind even if you do not directly think about it.

 

The problem is new mental health studies keep comming out proving that even 20 years later, these girls will most likely still be suffering from their decision to abort their child long into their life as a woman. They may never get completely over it.

 

I am against abortion because it is the ultimate in the refusal to take responsibility for your own actions, to kill a life just to "get away" with bad behavior but even if I was supportive of abortions, I would be against the Government being part of the process. More often than not the Government sees it like hugo pointed out, a way to save tax money by not spending it on medical care and most likely long term welfare, possibly generational welfare because the child is viewed as falling into the same trends as the mother if this is allowed to continue.

There are a lot of factors that seem to have been left out. Was the decision because of a rape? Too young? Strong indication of deformity? I'm 50/50 on the subject. I believe in pro life but there are some situations in which a woman cannot have the child due to mental or physical harm. I agree with em, I would not want my daughter at 15 making a decision that could affect her whole life without knowing about it. It sounds like the whole deal was a bit shady and I'm pretty sure the girl was confused, upset and not thinking clearly when she made the decision. Thats where the parent should come in. Some parents might make the situation worse but I think generally they would have good intentions and the daughter's interest at heart. No one should call her a tramp, How many of us have made a mistake in the heat of passion that did or could have turned into a disaster? C'mon people if you have one hormone in your body you know how hard it can be to stop. I think it's all very sad and I think the mom has a right to feel outrage.

I agree that this may be a lawsuit in the making but in this case , it seems like it's more about peoples rights to me. I think it was all done wrong so that is my answer.

There are a lot of factors that seem to have been left out. Was the decision because of a rape? Too young? Strong indication of deformity? I'm 50/50 on the subject. I believe in pro life but there are some situations in which a woman cannot have the child due to mental or physical harm. I agree with em, I would not want my daughter at 15 making a decision that could affect her whole life without knowing about it. It sounds like the whole deal was a bit shady and I'm pretty sure the girl was confused, upset and not thinking clearly when she made the decision. Thats where the parent should come in. Some parents might make the situation worse but I think generally they would have good intentions and the daughter's interest at heart. No one should call her a tramp, How many of us have made a mistake in the heat of passion that did or could have turned into a disaster? C'mon people if you have one hormone in your body you know how hard it can be to stop. I think it's all very sad and I think the mom has a right to feel outrage.

I agree that this may be a lawsuit in the making but in this case , it seems like it's more about peoples rights to me. I think it was all done wrong so that is my answer.

 

Yes. We all make mistakes. Poor Ren will NEVER make that "open to buggery" mistake ever again. :lol:

Seems like a challenge em, check my status hehe

I really doubt they "helped her get an abortion" especially since she was a "Pro-Life advocate" as her Mom stated..I smell lawsuit. What I really want to know is "What was way over the line?" A 15 year old having sex without protection...a 15 year old girl who didn't know that sex leads to pregnancy...a 15 year old that couldn't go to her parents and tell them what was happening, or the fact that a 15 year old took it upon herself to make her own decision on how her life was going to go? Which part was over the line...her not thinking like you?

 

I personally believe that before the school helped a young girl commit murder, they should have at least notified her mother. I hope the mother sues that school system, and I hope that everyone in the process is put to death, just like they helped sentence in the process of killing some girl's baby... or at least fired.

Her parents should have been more involved in her personal life, and given the girl the tools to know about sex, avoiding it, or protecting yourself if you're going to do it. The girl also should have gone to her mother/parents first and foremost.

She's too young to make a decision about this by herself.

She's too young to make a decision about this by herself.

 

That and many other factors are so powerful I don't believe any woman can honestly make a good decision at that time. Consider all the complex issues all colliding at the same time there are even hormone changes that all effect the state of mind and put that together with a short period of time to make the decision with the fewest complications should an abortion be selected. It is just too much, nobody could make a decision to kill their own child under those conditions and not live the rest of their life wondering......wondering........regretting.....suffering........what if.

 

 

 

That said I agree with Ren on seeing it a little different if the situation was forced on her in rape, my personal beliefs are such I could not kill a child for any reason but I see no reason under a reasonable society where a woman should be obligated to keep a child growing inside them if there was no choice or responsibility on her part. Thankfully this kind of abortion only accounts for about 1 or 2% of the total abortions performed in America so while it is horrible, that is not our real problem in society dealing with unwanted pregnancies.

 

What we need to figure out is why people are having unprotected sex when they know a life can be created? No child over the age of 14 can claim they don't know what causes pregnancy, so why not use precautions? Where I will not agree with Ren is where she makes the proposition that hormones make you out of control. Nothing takes away your ability to decide, letting yourself fall completely into an abandoned sexual activity without protection is a choice itself.

I could see TJ using these

 

https://www.sex-contract.com/

Tami took me to her doctor and had him show me her medical records proving she had her tubes tied before I stopped using condoms with her.

 

I consider it a profound victory that my son grew up and joined the Marines without ever getting some girl pregnant.

One finger or two TJ?

Yes. We all make mistakes.

Not me.

Tami took me to her doctor and had him show me her medical records proving she had her tubes tied before I stopped using condoms with her.

 

 

I would not date someone I don't trust.

I would not date someone I don't trust.

So on the first date you completely trust that person with your life hugo? I seriously doubt that. Once again your just trying to take potshots because you know that comment was BS.

 

Things happen hugo, I pay more in child support than many people make as their whole income. It is like getting a lot of speeding tickets and suddenly your driving under the speed limit just to be sure. I told her from day one that I was a tad gun shy and to not take anything I do as self-preservation personally because it has nothing to do with her specifically. Being as we were friends for a long time before we ever dated, she was already familure with my situation and was completely understanding of it. That is most likely why we are still together.

 

It takes time to completely trust someone hugo, while we were actively looking into the whole relationship thing, there is not enough to base that kind of trust on. I will admit I do not completely trust easily, but once I am there I am unshakable and completely loyal to that person. I now trust Tami with my life, she has earned my trust through her dedication and understanding of things like my being gun shy.

 

 

 

Of course I did trust the ex-wife and she emptied our bank accounts, ran off with someone else she met on the internet, got pregnant with him, he died in a car accident, then she tried to come back........To say I was devestated would be an understatement, and no I would not take her back, now that was based on a lack of trust.

 

No woman wants an abortion as she wants an ice cream cone or a Porsche. She wants an abortion as an animal caught in a trap wants to gnaw off its own leg. ~ Frederica Mathewes-Green

 

 

Women have got to stop feeling like they owe the world a truckload of guilt simply because they exercised their legal right to govern their own reproduction. ~ Clementine Ford

 

 

When you peel back the layers of the anti-choice motivation, it always comes back to two things: What is the nature and purpose of human sexuality? And second, what is the role of women in the world? Sex and the role of women are inextricably linked, because if you can separate sex from procreation, you have given women the ability to participate in society on an equal basis with men. ~ Gloria Feldt

 

 

And by the way, my belief is that if men were the ones getting pregnant, abortions would be easier to get than food poisoning in Moscow. ~ Dennis Miller

 

 

If you have a penis, your judgements on abortion = sh t ~ wez

Funny how it's always the men who are so fucking judgmental about women who choose to terminate a pregnancy and fantasize about punishing them are the same men who toot the horn of patriotism and encourage their sons to follow in their footsteps and be brainwashed to murder utter strangers as they glorify and romanticize invading foreign countries for the financial benefit of the politicians and ruling class that they bitch about on a daily basis.

 

Apparently killing a living human being isn't murder and removing an unborn fetus from a uterus is..

 

Men good.. women bad.. It's Gods will.. rolling the piss out of my eyes

You would not have those problems with child support if you had stayed with the mother of your children as God intended, TJ. You should have been responsible and respected your vows.

You would not have those problems with child support if you had stayed with the mother of your children as God intended, TJ. You should have been responsible and respected your vows.

I had no decision in that hugo, what would you have me do, kidnap her on the way out the door and strap her to the bed?

 

I respected my vows, I loved her completely, I never cheated, I never raised my hand in anger, I provided well for her and our children but she lost her faith. Why is it you seem so desperate to try and paint me a bad person in this hugo? You talk of God but there is no commandment from God to force a woman to stay if she has decided to go. Do you have any faith at all because you sound like an atheist trying to use religious beliefs against someone without the benefit of understanding what is in the Bible.

 

 

Deuteronomy 24:1-4

1When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house.

 

2And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife.

 

3And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;

 

4Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that is abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

 

 

 

This was from the time of Moses and Jesus later told us that even though divorce was permitted, that was not really the intention of God. God wants us to stay together. The biggest mistake most athiests and religious in appearance only people make is they forget this:

 

 

 

Mark 10:6-9 (King James Version)

 

6But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.

 

7For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;

 

8And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.

 

9What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

 

 

 

Notice where it says what "God hath joined"? The bond of marriage requires God to be involved, without the shared of bond of faith there can be no marriage. My ex-wife lost her faith, turned away from God, turned away from me. She made her decisions in life and I had no way of stopping her, but it was clear our bond through God had been broken.

 

 

1 Corinthians 7:15 (King James Version)

 

But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

 

 

Matthew 19:9 (King James Version)

 

And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

 

 

 

 

 

So tell me hugo, what was the "responsible" thing to do? You claim I was irresponsible and I would like you to spell it out for me how you see my actions as irresponsible?

 

Or is this just another flame attempt hugo? You angry again? If so maybe you should go see what God said about that.

 

Of course I did trust the ex-wife and she emptied our bank accounts, ran off with someone else she met on the internet, got pregnant with him, he died in a car accident, then she tried to come back........To say I was devestated would be an understatement, and no I would not take her back, now that was based on a lack of trust.

And this is the crux of the problem. One or two women have colored your perception of the whole gender and everything we do. I've seen you talk about this many times. This is something that you have to let go of although it seems so deeply ingrained that I don't know if you'll ever do it. Everyone plays the fools at one time in their life. What we do with it is up to us. It's ok to feel ambivalent for awhile but after awhile you have to let it go.

No woman wants an abortion as she wants an ice cream cone or a Porsche. She wants an abortion as an animal caught in a trap wants to gnaw off its own leg. ~ Frederica Mathewes-Green

2 things regarding this quote:

 

#1- if this woman feels that way about a pregnancy, then the kid is prolly better off dead than being raised by her. What a horrible outlook on the beginning of a life.

 

#2- an animal gets caught unsuspectingly in a trap. They are hidden. Pretty sure most women of child bearing age (at least in this country) have an understanding of how it is that one gets pregnant. Since over 98% of abortions are simply used as a post-conception birth control- maybe there are better alternatives than ending a life.

And this is the crux of the problem. One or two women have colored your perception of the whole gender and everything we do. I've seen you talk about this many times. This is something that you have to let go of although it seems so deeply ingrained that I don't know if you'll ever do it. Everyone plays the fools at one time in their life. What we do with it is up to us. It's ok to feel ambivalent for awhile but after awhile you have to let it go.

 

Just because I relate how it went that does not mean I am still upset over it or believing every woman in the world is the same way. I let go of the emotional connections to this memory years ago.

 

Let me ask you a question Ren.

 

If a woman says she is on the pill but does not tell the man she is also on rifampin and ends up getting pregnant, whos fault is it the baby was created?

 

And who pays for that mistake?

 

 

 

Ren your being blinded by your false assumptions of me, I have always been the guy who preaches responsibility above all other things. My possition on creating babies is no matter if it is a mistake or a deception, the man is still responsible for his seed and the life he helps to create. Nothing is 100% so even if the woman is being truthful, there is still the chance of pregnancy so there is no "OUT" for the man under any circumstance. The part your ignoring is I place a heavier burdon on the man even if he was misled because his trust of the lie was still his fault. The only reason I am heavy on women in a abortion discussion is because men don't kill babies, only mothers kill babies so at that point, men are not even involved. Once the situation has passed the point where the woman allows the child to live, then the man can begin his responsibility for his own part in the creation of the child.

 

 

Let me say this again, the men should be held accountable even if they were deceived, there is no excuse for making a baby and trying to escape taking responsibility for that child.

 

 

 

And who pays for that mistake?

 

The child does. Either the mother will kill the child or she will raise a child that was not wanted all because "BOTH" parties did not take reproduction risks seriously.

 

 

I take it seriously, and I took it seriously long before I ever met my ex-wife, lol.

 

 

 

 

 

 

eddo, take it a step further, the vast majority of abortions are to women who already have children and have never been married. There is no "I didn't know" excuse, they know exactly what causes pregnancy. I would have to go look it up again for the exact figure but somewhere around 80% of women who get abortions either used no birth control, or was inconsistent in using birth control when they had sex during the month they got pregnant. Why would so many people be having sex without using protection?

 

They don't care if they get pregnant? Is it something they just block out and refuse to accept as reality?

 

I know I am not a woman but even as a man I have always been extremely careful not to make a baby I did not want. I have three kids and I wanted every one of them and talked about creating a child with my partner each time. I once told my son that if your going to "play like an adult", then you have to behave like an adult and use adult protections.