Young Turk Cenk's rants
- Thread starter phreakwars
- Start date
timesjoke
Active Members
Wow, talk about twisting facts, this idiot took a 4 in 10 single poll result and tried to transform that into a 'majority wanted government healthcare' truly magical garbage these progressives feed themselves.
Most of America was against healthcare reform that cost the Government more money they did not have, the Government offering a Canadian style system of insurance would have cost more than anyone could ever imagine. Obama promised to try and get the public option but the problem was there just was no money to pay for it. Idiots like the one in the video must believe money grows on trees or something but he certainly has no concept that the first thing any decision of this level must also have a way to pay for it.
Not one of these far left progressives ever tell us how we pay for such a thing......sure they do their usual "tax the rich" in the standard class warfare Progressives embrace, but in reality something that huge would have to include much higher taxes for every person in America, not a small increase, a massive increase and let's not forget that a large number of people are out of work so they are not paying into the system why the Government is spending record numbers to keep these people alive right now.
The "CHANGE" Obama promised America was not to change the fabric of America, not to bring socialist programs to America, the promise of "CHANGE" was to transform Washington, to bring cooperation and end partisan bickering to Washington. That "CHANGE" was a complete lie, Obama never intended to depart from the everyday normal partisan politics Progressives always conduct.
Progressives like Republicans have degrees of folowers, some are blindly progressive, some try to insert a little reality of cost into their dreams of creating a perfect daycare center of America. The biggest problem Obama had was the votes, the Government option was never an option because even his own fellow Progressives refused to vote for it. How can this wacko blame Obama for not getting it passed when most of his party told him no way?
Should he have beaten them with a club and forced them physically to vote for something they did not want? And would that make America a dictatorship where one man controlls all the votes of his party instead of the individuals all voting the way they feel is right?
I may not like progressives very much, but it seems you guys are tougher on each other without logical reasons than I ever could be.
Most of America was against healthcare reform that cost the Government more money they did not have, the Government offering a Canadian style system of insurance would have cost more than anyone could ever imagine. Obama promised to try and get the public option but the problem was there just was no money to pay for it. Idiots like the one in the video must believe money grows on trees or something but he certainly has no concept that the first thing any decision of this level must also have a way to pay for it.
Not one of these far left progressives ever tell us how we pay for such a thing......sure they do their usual "tax the rich" in the standard class warfare Progressives embrace, but in reality something that huge would have to include much higher taxes for every person in America, not a small increase, a massive increase and let's not forget that a large number of people are out of work so they are not paying into the system why the Government is spending record numbers to keep these people alive right now.
The "CHANGE" Obama promised America was not to change the fabric of America, not to bring socialist programs to America, the promise of "CHANGE" was to transform Washington, to bring cooperation and end partisan bickering to Washington. That "CHANGE" was a complete lie, Obama never intended to depart from the everyday normal partisan politics Progressives always conduct.
Progressives like Republicans have degrees of folowers, some are blindly progressive, some try to insert a little reality of cost into their dreams of creating a perfect daycare center of America. The biggest problem Obama had was the votes, the Government option was never an option because even his own fellow Progressives refused to vote for it. How can this wacko blame Obama for not getting it passed when most of his party told him no way?
Should he have beaten them with a club and forced them physically to vote for something they did not want? And would that make America a dictatorship where one man controlls all the votes of his party instead of the individuals all voting the way they feel is right?
I may not like progressives very much, but it seems you guys are tougher on each other without logical reasons than I ever could be.
phreakwars
New member
Yet another fine example of how TJ is too stupid to know he's stupid.
Let's get this right.
Obama is ALLEGEDLY a progressive.
He proves he is progressive by using the normal politics that a progressive uses.
He's so progressive in fact, that he went "MAVERICK" and "ROGUE" on progressives and never did what the progressives wanted.
Anybody else catch the total stupidity in that assessment?
.
.
phreakwars
New member
That wasn't the point he was making.
The point he was making, was the REASON people were against it. For instance I MYSELF was against it. Go back and look at my old posts and you'll see this holds true.
Had it been improved on, I would have liked to see it pass. The one that was passed into law, had too much Republican *** kissing smeared on it which made it useless and corporate endorsed.
Progressives don't like big business, remember. Right wingers do.
.
.
phreakwars
New member
Then you tuned out of listening. There are several way. Medicare buy in, increase in the (measley 1.3%) medicare tax, but let's not get into that. Your slow, we understand why you don't get it..
.
timesjoke
Active Members
No, he is a self-declaired Progressive, his own words, not mine or yours. Are you now calling Obama a liar?
Like using class warfare and playing the race card to stop discussion of the actual policies and failures of his Administration.
Typical progressive, Bender you even said everyone who went against Obama was racist and it had nothing to do with his policies, your on the exact same page of behavior.
As I have pointed out before against Hugo, there is no such thing as a "pure" political person on either side of the scale, but there are degree. Obama still drives the bus of the progressive movement to have Big Government "FIX" our lives. Obama is a Progressive even if he did not succeed in getting the votes for the most radical of progressive desires. Obama still tried though and his desire are those things even the radical Progressives want even if the political waters will not let those most radical desires float right now.
Obama did not go "maverick", he did as much as he could do with the support/votes he had available to him. He wanted more, just like the more radical elements of Progressives wanted more, their desires follow the same path, so he is definately a Progressive.
phreakwars
New member
Boy you have an excuse for everything, don't ya TJ.
.
.
.
.
timesjoke
Active Members
Republican *** kissing?
You have lost your mind, almost nothing from republicans was included in the law and the *** kissing was done only by Progressives who piled special deal after special deal onto the reform just to get their own fellow Democrats to vote for it.
The huge *** kiss on the Unions to make them exempt to the new taxes on health insurance was not a Republican idea Bender.
The 'reason' most people did not want it was the expense Bender, everyone knew Obama was not being honest about the cost, and new independent research into the new law says the true cost over ten years will be closer to Three Trillion, not one trillion as Obama promised.
No Bender, nobody has shown a detailed plan on how to pay for a monster single payer system, I already admitted they say as you just did and just offer a basic "tax the rich" theme but at the end of the day extremely huge taxes must be created to cover the cost of a single payer system.
Obama ran on a promise that nobody who makes less then $250,000 a year would see a tax increase, there is no possible way to create a single payer system wihout severely raising taxes on people who make less then $250,000 a year, this is fact, so what do you more radical progressives want him to do?
Should he have broken that promise of no new taxes just to make the tiny few of you radicals happy?
I don't need excuses Bender, I have facts instead, like Obama's own words and direct actions, all I do is tell it like it is.
phreakwars
New member
Your thinking of George Bush senior. Obama never promised no new taxes...
.
phreakwars
New member
So which tax would that be that's went up?
.
.
.
.
timesjoke
Active Members
OMG, you can't keep a conversation straight can you Bender?
The guy in the video and you are crying Obama did not get a single payer system in place. One of my points was how no Progressives say how they can pay for such a monster and it is the massive cost and increased taxes that has almost all Americans against these huge socialist programs you Progressives want.
You say Obama turned his back on the more radical segments of the Progressives just because he could not force the more moderate Progressives to vote for massive tax increases that would be needed to get single payer healthcare passed.
So I asked you if Obama should go against his promise of not increasing taxes on anyone making less than $250,000 a year and for some reason, you tried to claim Obama never made that promise. Your either one of the least informed people in America or your so brainwashed that Obama is a *** that your intentionally teling lies to try and make Obama look better.
So should Obama have broken his promise to the American people not to raise their taxes if they make under $250,000 a year just to make you and a few other radical Progressives happy Bender?
But, to answer the question you asked trying to get away from you being wrong again,
Yes, Obama has broken that promise many times over but to name a couple real fast, he raised taxes on cigaretts while the average smoker makes around $40,000 a year, he added taxes on tanning booths and surely more than just the rich go to tanning beds, there are all sorts of new taxes on things like medical devices that more than just the rich have to buy.
So yes, Obama has broken that promise in a lot of small ways, but trying to pay for a single payer healthcare system would force the creation of new taxes on a scale never dreamed of before except in the dreams of Progressives. To pay for a single payer system, new taxes would be needed down to even the poorest of the poor. If Obama had to tax tanning beds to pay for this smaller intrusion of Government on healthcare, that means nothing will be safe from the new taxes that would be created to cover the cost of a single payer system.
hugo
New member
I think the progresives do not realize that Obama did all that was politically possible. He could not have gotten a Canadian style healthcare system through.
I favor abolishing the Department of Education. It ain't authorized in the Constitution. I do not blame GW for not abolishing the DOE. It would have been politically impossible in the current environment. I do blame him for expanding the role of the federal government in education with the No Child Left Behind Act.
The fact is the current healthcare bill is unfunded and there will have to be radical changes. If the liberals win it will be turning to a no frills government run system. If the Conservatives win it will be a return to our current system. The bill adds inflationary pressures to an industry where costs are already skyrocketing. It cannot survive in its present state.
I favor abolishing the Department of Education. It ain't authorized in the Constitution. I do not blame GW for not abolishing the DOE. It would have been politically impossible in the current environment. I do blame him for expanding the role of the federal government in education with the No Child Left Behind Act.
The fact is the current healthcare bill is unfunded and there will have to be radical changes. If the liberals win it will be turning to a no frills government run system. If the Conservatives win it will be a return to our current system. The bill adds inflationary pressures to an industry where costs are already skyrocketing. It cannot survive in its present state.
phreakwars
New member
So which tax would that be that's went up? Never did see an answer..
.
ImWithStupid
New member
phreakwars
New member
So which tax would that be that's went up? Never did see an answer.
.
.
.
.
timesjoke
Active Members
Go back and read, I already gave you a few examples, is your progressive blindness kicking in the way you refused to admit the Republicans had new ideas when IWS was posting dozens of them over and over?
You always seem to take this tactic, you just stick your head in the sand and pretend the things you don't want to see do not exist.