VENEZUELANS REJECT CHAVEZ'S PLANS! HEY LIEBERALS, ARE YOU PAYINGATTENTION???

[Guest Jerry Kraus]

On Dec 4, 1:51 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

>

> news:7f596029-0436-4f8a-a941-635d33f3b910@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

>

>

>

>

>

> > On Dec 4, 12:45 pm, Baldin Lee Pramer <baldinpra...@msn.com> wrote:

> > > On Dec 3, 7:35 am, Grandmaster Sensei Shaolin

>

> > > <grandmastersenseishao...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > The Lieberals need to be paying attention since they love more

> > > > government and more socialist programs.

>

> > > You are too stupid to have an opinion on this.

>

> > > BLP

>

> > You must remember, Mr. Pramer, that this is cross-posted to a martial

> > arts group. Many of the posters have suffered one too many karate

> > kicks to the head. They even have an autistic, dyslexic writer

> > posting who specializes in writing for the sub-50 IQ crowd! His

> > responses are limited to "your argument is ad hominem". He doesn't

> > seem to have anything else to say.

>

> Your inability to read is not my problem.

>

> Neither is your propensity to lie through your teeth.

>

> --

> David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com-- Back from hiatus!

> Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

>

> - Show quoted text -

 

David, apparently you're an applied physicist. You may, for all I

know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

"writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

Sorry.

 

Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

spend enough money and time trying to do so. I'd rather just have

whatever I want to say disseminated on the internet. Which isn't to

say I haven't published a few things in print from time to time. But,

it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

[Guest Shuurai]

On Dec 4, 11:28 am, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Dec 3, 3:49 pm, "Herbert Cannon" <hcanno...@cox.net> wrote:

>

>

>

>

>

> > > Chavez is basically an idealist in an uncertain position. He's a

> > > potential Castro, but Castro wasn't really that bad a fellow either.

> > > His options were limited.

>

> > Why no, of course not, he really was a really good fellow, he just murdered

> > the oppostion; and he just recently locked up the dissidents. Not a bad

> > fellow at all, if you like living in communist dictatorships. If you dont

> > you float.

> > What utter bullshit.

>

> > He did the best he could.>

>

> > I would say he did a pretty good job of murder.

>

> > > Once we get rid of Bush and implement some economic reforms

> > > domestically, South America will restabilize, and the temptations of

> > > Communism will recede.

>

> > Yes and the world will turn nice and fuzzy and warm; and the terrorist will

> > all turn into hippies: and we can all surrender our arms; and we can disband

> > our armies; and Islam will be a peaceful religion; and everyone will love

> > everyone; and I have some bridges and some plots of land to sell you - the

> > snake oil I throw in for free.

>

> > As I say, my nickname for Bush is "Instant

>

> > > Communism".

>

> > My nickname for you is moron. Unless of course you want to buy my plots of

> > land, then I will call a dumb customer.

>

> > He makes Communism look good, as an alternative to

>

> > > imperialistic fascism.

>

> > Gee that must be why we are having a presidential election in the future

> > because we are a imperialistic fascist. The Bush Brown shirts are under your

> > bed.

>

> Castro doesn't kill people. The U.S. does. Castro has no Gulag, the

> U.S. does.

 

Are you sure you know who Castro is?

> Despite being a poor country, average life expectancy is

> just as high in Cuba as in the U.S.

 

There is a difference between life expectancy and quality of life. If

you don't believe me, go live in Cuba for a while.

> Cuba is a paradise compared to

> Mexico. You don't see any Cubans escaping to "Freedom in Mexico".

 

But you DO see both Cubans and Mexicans escaping to the United

States. Why do you think that's so? Why do so many Cubans risk their

lives to come to America when, according to you, it's just as good

there as here? They have the same "life expectancy" right? Why don't

we ever hear about Americans flocking to Cuba? According to you, they

have just as much reason to do so as the Cubans have of coming here...

 

Seems you might be full of shit, son. Again. Go figure.

[Guest Jerry Kraus]

On Dec 4, 1:59 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> On Dec 4, 11:28 am, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>

>

> But you DO see both Cubans and Mexicans escaping to the United

> States. Why do you think that's so? Why do so many Cubans risk their

> lives to come to America when, according to you, it's just as good

> there as here? They have the same "life expectancy" right? Why don't

> we ever hear about Americans flocking to Cuba? According to you, they

> have just as much reason to do so as the Cubans have of coming here...

>

> Seems you might be full of shit, son. Again. Go figure.- Hide quoted text -

>

> - Show quoted text -

 

Because the U.S. is rich from military imperialism, you moron!!!! WE

STEAL FROM THE ENTIRE WORLD!!!

[Guest ChristiaNazism]

We (USA) were 1 (one) SCJOTUS from having a Dictatorship (from the) RIGHT

here in America...the Dems regaining in the House and Senate was a bigger

victory than most will ever realize...

 

Sandra Day O'Connor warned Americans as such...

 

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4728508

 

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines06/0313-03.htm

 

http://www.sexwork.com/coalition/SandraDayOconnor.html

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,,1729396,00.html

 

http://www.yuricareport.com/Law%20&%20Legal/OConnorWarnsOfDictatorship.html

 

--

At the RNC incest is priority-one because that's how the GOP got started, all

the way back to the Virgin Birth

[Guest Mike]

On Dec 4, 2:56 pm, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> David, apparently you're an applied physicist. You may, for all I

> know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> Sorry.

 

Shut it puppy.

 

-Mike K.

[Guest Mike]

On Dec 4, 3:01 pm, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Because the U.S. is rich from military imperialism, you moron!!!! WE

> STEAL FROM THE ENTIRE WORLD!!!

 

So you are saying that people come here from other countries to become

thiefs.

 

That's got to be what you are saying, because otherwise it's crap.

 

-Mike K.

[Guest David L. Burkhead]

"Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:f8ab50ef-3203-4778-bb7f-5647d225e3f6@j44g2000hsj.googlegroups.com...

> On Dec 4, 1:51 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

> >

> >

news:7f596029-0436-4f8a-a941-635d33f3b910@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > On Dec 4, 12:45 pm, Baldin Lee Pramer <baldinpra...@msn.com> wrote:

> > > > On Dec 3, 7:35 am, Grandmaster Sensei Shaolin

> >

> > > > <grandmastersenseishao...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > The Lieberals need to be paying attention since they love more

> > > > > government and more socialist programs.

> >

> > > > You are too stupid to have an opinion on this.

> >

> > > > BLP

> >

> > > You must remember, Mr. Pramer, that this is cross-posted to a martial

> > > arts group. Many of the posters have suffered one too many karate

> > > kicks to the head. They even have an autistic, dyslexic writer

> > > posting who specializes in writing for the sub-50 IQ crowd! His

> > > responses are limited to "your argument is ad hominem". He doesn't

> > > seem to have anything else to say.

> >

> > Your inability to read is not my problem.

> >

> > Neither is your propensity to lie through your teeth.

> >

> > --

> > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com-- Back from hiatus!

> > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

> >

> > - Show quoted text -

>

> David, apparently you're an applied physicist. You may, for all I

> know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> Sorry.

 

You're opinion on that matter is completely without merit: as you

demonstrate every time you set fingers to keyboard.

> Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> spend enough money and time trying to do so.

 

I see the publishing industry is something else you are completely

ignorant about.

> I'd rather just have

> whatever I want to say disseminated on the internet. Which isn't to

> say I haven't published a few things in print from time to time.

 

Name _one_ in a professional, commercial publication--where they pay

_you_, not the other way around.

 

You see, in every one of the pieces I mention it was the publisher that

paid me, not me paying the publisher.

 

Among professional writers there's a saying "the only place a writer

signs a check is on the back."

 

Here's a nice starting point for learning a bit about the subject:

http://www.sfwa.org/beware/

> But,

> it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

 

A number of my friends would disagree with you: they make their living

writing.

 

That you are not aware of this speaks volumes about your

credibility--and not to your credit.

 

--

David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

mailto:dburkhead@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

My webcomic Cold Servings

http://www.coldservings.com -- Back from hiatus!

Updates Wednesdays

[Guest David L. Burkhead]

"Mike" <mkornecki2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:50233b59-8c41-44b4-9a7c-d04d596a5d29@e6g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

> On Dec 4, 2:56 pm, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > David, apparently you're an applied physicist. You may, for all I

> > know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > Sorry.

>

> Shut it puppy.

 

Let him rant on. With every movement of his mouth, his foot goes

farther and farther down his throat. I want to see if he pulls an Igli.

 

--

David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

mailto:dburkhead@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

My webcomic Cold Servings

http://www.coldservings.com -- Back from hiatus!

Updates Wednesdays

[Guest Shuurai]

> David, apparently you're an applied physicist.

 

Jerry, apparently you're an idiot.

> You may, for all I know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> Sorry.

 

And you can?

> Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> spend enough money and time trying to do so.

 

So where are yours? Anyone can do it, right?

> I'd rather just have whatever I want to say disseminated on the internet.

 

Sure; because the internet has no standards or expectations. It's the

only place where someone like you CAN have your words disseminated.

> Which isn't to say I haven't published a few things in print from time to time.

 

Which isn't to say that you have.

> But, it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

 

Especially when you're only lying about it on usenet...

[Guest Jerry Kraus]

On Dec 4, 2:20 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

>

> news:f8ab50ef-3203-4778-bb7f-5647d225e3f6@j44g2000hsj.googlegroups.com...> On Dec 4, 1:51 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> > > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

>

> news:7f596029-0436-4f8a-a941-635d33f3b910@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> > > > On Dec 4, 12:45 pm, Baldin Lee Pramer <baldinpra...@msn.com> wrote:

> > > > > On Dec 3, 7:35 am, Grandmaster Sensei Shaolin

>

> > > > > <grandmastersenseishao...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > The Lieberals need to be paying attention since they love more

> > > > > > government and more socialist programs.

>

> > > > > You are too stupid to have an opinion on this.

>

> > > > > BLP

>

> > > > You must remember, Mr. Pramer, that this is cross-posted to a martial

> > > > arts group. Many of the posters have suffered one too many karate

> > > > kicks to the head. They even have an autistic, dyslexic writer

> > > > posting who specializes in writing for the sub-50 IQ crowd! His

> > > > responses are limited to "your argument is ad hominem". He doesn't

> > > > seem to have anything else to say.

>

> > > Your inability to read is not my problem.

>

> > > Neither is your propensity to lie through your teeth.

>

> > > --

> > > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com--Back from hiatus!

> > > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

>

> > > - Show quoted text -

>

> > David, apparently you're an applied physicist. You may, for all I

> > know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > Sorry.

>

> You're opinion on that matter is completely without merit: as you

> demonstrate every time you set fingers to keyboard.

>

> > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

>

> I see the publishing industry is something else you are completely

> ignorant about.

>

> > I'd rather just have

> > whatever I want to say disseminated on the internet. Which isn't to

> > say I haven't published a few things in print from time to time.

>

> Name _one_ in a professional, commercial publication--where they pay

> _you_, not the other way around.

>

> You see, in every one of the pieces I mention it was the publisher that

> paid me, not me paying the publisher.

>

> Among professional writers there's a saying "the only place a writer

> signs a check is on the back."

>

> Here's a nice starting point for learning a bit about the subject:http://www.sfwa.org/beware/

>

> > But,

> > it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

>

> A number of my friends would disagree with you: they make their living

> writing.

>

> That you are not aware of this speaks volumes about your

> credibility--and not to your credit.

>

> --

> David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com-- Back from hiatus!

> Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

>

> - Show quoted text -

 

David, you SURE AS HELL don't make your living writing. And YOU

NEVER WILL.

 

Everything is relative. There is a bit of money in writing. But not

much.

 

Actually, if you want to talk about lasers, something you may know

something about, that might be of some interest.

[Guest Jerry B. Altzman]

on 2007-12-04 14:50 Shuurai said the following:

> On Dec 3, 11:46 pm, "Jerry B. Altzman" <jba...@altzman.com> wrote:

>> on 2007-12-03 21:49 Sam the Bam said the following:

>>> This Jerry guy is great... he's like Hal on meth.

>>> Don't chase him off, ok?

>> Wow, thanks!

>> Oh wait, not me.

>> Never mind.

> That was a terrible haiku!

 

It was better in the original Klingon.

 

//jbaltz

--

jerry b. altzman jbaltz@altzman.com http://www.jbaltz.com

thank you for contributing to the heat death of the universe.

[Guest Jerry Kraus]

On Dec 4, 2:22 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > David, apparently you're an applied physicist.

>

> Jerry, apparently you're an idiot.

>

> > You may, for all I know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > Sorry.

>

> And you can?

>

> > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

>

> So where are yours? Anyone can do it, right?

>

> > I'd rather just have whatever I want to say disseminated on the internet.

>

> Sure; because the internet has no standards or expectations. It's the

> only place where someone like you CAN have your words disseminated.

>

> > Which isn't to say I haven't published a few things in print from time to time.

>

> Which isn't to say that you have.

>

> > But, it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

>

> Especially when you're only lying about it on usenet...

 

For some reason I don't fell like providing personal details to

psychotic morons who threaten me on the internet. Call it an

eccentricity.

[Guest Shuurai]

On Dec 4, 3:01 pm, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Dec 4, 1:59 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>

> > On Dec 4, 11:28 am, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>

> > But you DO see both Cubans and Mexicans escaping to the United

> > States. Why do you think that's so? Why do so many Cubans risk their

> > lives to come to America when, according to you, it's just as good

> > there as here? They have the same "life expectancy" right? Why don't

> > we ever hear about Americans flocking to Cuba? According to you, they

> > have just as much reason to do so as the Cubans have of coming here...

>

> > Seems you might be full of shit, son. Again. Go figure.

>

> Because the U.S. is rich from military imperialism, you moron!!!!

 

Earlier you were saying that the US is going broke from military

imperialism... Damn, Jerry - you'd be a hell of a lot more

interesting if you could actually keep track of your own bullshit.

Maybe you need to start taking medication?

> WE STEAL FROM THE ENTIRE WORLD!!!

 

You're not making any sense, Jerry. Seriously. You just got done

saying that Cuba is a paradise compared to Mexico, and that by your

(asinine) standards just as good as the US since it has the same life

expectancy.

 

So according to you, Cuba is just as good a place to live as America -

even BETTER actually, since Castro doesn't kill people or send them

into Gulags - but Cubans are sneaking into America anyway because we

steal from the rest of the world? Hmmm...

 

Sorry, Jerry... the only rational conclusion remains as it was before

- that you are completely full of shit. So what random unrelated

bullshit will you try next in place of an actual argument? Try global

warming - that one always seems to get a reaction from people.

[Guest Jerry Kraus]

On Dec 4, 2:33 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> On Dec 4, 3:01 pm, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>

> > On Dec 4, 1:59 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>

> > > On Dec 4, 11:28 am, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>

> > > But you DO see both Cubans and Mexicans escaping to the United

> > > States. Why do you think that's so? Why do so many Cubans risk their

> > > lives to come to America when, according to you, it's just as good

> > > there as here? They have the same "life expectancy" right? Why don't

> > > we ever hear about Americans flocking to Cuba? According to you, they

> > > have just as much reason to do so as the Cubans have of coming here...

>

> > > Seems you might be full of shit, son. Again. Go figure.

>

> > Because the U.S. is rich from military imperialism, you moron!!!!

>

> Earlier you were saying that the US is going broke from military

> imperialism... Damn, Jerry - you'd be a hell of a lot more

> interesting if you could actually keep track of your own bullshit.

> Maybe you need to start taking medication?

>

> > WE STEAL FROM THE ENTIRE WORLD!!!

>

> You're not making any sense, Jerry. Seriously. You just got done

> saying that Cuba is a paradise compared to Mexico, and that by your

> (asinine) standards just as good as the US since it has the same life

> expectancy.

>

> So according to you, Cuba is just as good a place to live as America -

> even BETTER actually, since Castro doesn't kill people or send them

> into Gulags - but Cubans are sneaking into America anyway because we

> steal from the rest of the world? Hmmm...

>

> Sorry, Jerry... the only rational conclusion remains as it was before

> - that you are completely full of shit. So what random unrelated

> bullshit will you try next in place of an actual argument? Try global

> warming - that one always seems to get a reaction from people.

 

I'm sorry. I realize psychotic morons like yourself have different

standards of proof than the average person. I'll try to make this

simple.

 

1. Cuba is a better place to live than Mexico, because its socialist

system improves the people's standard of living.

2. The United States is a better place to live than Cuba, because

the U.S. military steals and intimidates the entire world to extort

wealth, so wealth, comparatively speaking, is more available in the

U.S. than in Cuba. The greater availability of wealth -- albeit

through theft -- more than compensates for the advantages of

socialism, in this particular case. But, it is a unique case. No

other country can steal as much as the U.S., because of its size, and

military strength.

[Guest Jerry Kraus]

On Dec 4, 2:50 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> --

> David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com-- Back from hiatus!

> Updates Wednesdays

>

> "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

>

> news:45c1e77f-5ab4-48af-a0e8-8ccc2c16c319@b15g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...> On Dec 4, 2:20 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> > > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

>

> news:f8ab50ef-3203-4778-bb7f-5647d225e3f6@j44g2000hsj.googlegroups.com...>

> On Dec 4, 1:51 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:> > > > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

>

> news:7f596029-0436-4f8a-a941-635d33f3b910@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

>

>

>

>

>

> > > > > > On Dec 4, 12:45 pm, Baldin Lee Pramer <baldinpra...@msn.com>

> wrote:

> > > > > > > On Dec 3, 7:35 am, Grandmaster Sensei Shaolin

>

> > > > > > > <grandmastersenseishao...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > The Lieberals need to be paying attention since they love more

> > > > > > > > government and more socialist programs.

>

> > > > > > > You are too stupid to have an opinion on this.

>

> > > > > > > BLP

>

> > > > > > You must remember, Mr. Pramer, that this is cross-posted to a

> martial

> > > > > > arts group. Many of the posters have suffered one too many karate

> > > > > > kicks to the head. They even have an autistic, dyslexic writer

> > > > > > posting who specializes in writing for the sub-50 IQ crowd! His

> > > > > > responses are limited to "your argument is ad hominem". He

> doesn't

> > > > > > seem to have anything else to say.

>

> > > > > Your inability to read is not my problem.

>

> > > > > Neither is your propensity to lie through your teeth.

>

> > > > > --

> > > > > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > > > > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > > > > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com--Backfrom

> hiatus!

> > > > > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

>

> > > > > - Show quoted text -

>

> > > > David, apparently you're an applied physicist. You may, for all I

> > > > know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> > > > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > > > Sorry.

>

> > > You're opinion on that matter is completely without merit: as you

> > > demonstrate every time you set fingers to keyboard.

>

> > > > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> > > > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

>

> > > I see the publishing industry is something else you are completely

> > > ignorant about.

>

> > > > I'd rather just have

> > > > whatever I want to say disseminated on the internet. Which isn't to

> > > > say I haven't published a few things in print from time to time.

>

> > > Name _one_ in a professional, commercial publication--where they pay

> > > _you_, not the other way around.

>

> > > You see, in every one of the pieces I mention it was the publisher

> that

> > > paid me, not me paying the publisher.

>

> > > Among professional writers there's a saying "the only place a writer

> > > signs a check is on the back."

>

> > > Here's a nice starting point for learning a bit about the

>

> subject:http://www.sfwa.org/beware/

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> > > > But,

> > > > it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

>

> > > A number of my friends would disagree with you: they make their

> living

> > > writing.

>

> > > That you are not aware of this speaks volumes about your

> > > credibility--and not to your credit.

>

> > > --

> > > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com--Back from hiatus!

> > > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

>

> > > - Show quoted text -

>

> > David, you SURE AS HELL don't make your living writing. And YOU

> > NEVER WILL.

>

> This is the first correct statement you've made so far. Unfortunatly,

> it falls unde the "blind hog" paradigm since the _reason_ I don't make a

> living writing is that it's a hobby for me.

>

> But I'll lay any odds you care to name that I've made more money at it

> than you have.

>

> > Everything is relative. There is a bit of money in writing. But not

> > much.

>

> Once again you don't know what you're talking about. Now, mind you,

> there's not a whole lot of money to be made in short fiction, and the novel

> market is laboring a bit, but non-fiction remains as lucrative as it ever

> was.

>

> If you want to know about writing as a business, don't talk to wannabes

> on the Internet--talk to actual pros who have made actual professional

> sales.

>

> > Actually, if you want to talk about lasers, something you may know

> > something about, that might be of some interest.

>

> Well, if we can simply find something, anything, that you know something

> about, we might have the basis for a conversation. So far, however, you are

> batting 0.- Hide quoted text -

>

> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

>

> - Show quoted text -

 

Non-fiction was never particularly lucrative. It's not a very good

business. If it were, it wouldn't be your hobby, but your profession.

Anyone would naturally make their hobby their profession if they had

the choice. You don't. Not many people do.

[Guest David L. Burkhead]

--

David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

mailto:dburkhead@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

My webcomic Cold Servings

http://www.coldservings.com -- Back from hiatus!

Updates Wednesdays

 

"Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:45c1e77f-5ab4-48af-a0e8-8ccc2c16c319@b15g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...

> On Dec 4, 2:20 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

> >

> >

news:f8ab50ef-3203-4778-bb7f-5647d225e3f6@j44g2000hsj.googlegroups.com...>

On Dec 4, 1:51 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> > > > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

> >

> >

news:7f596029-0436-4f8a-a941-635d33f3b910@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > > > On Dec 4, 12:45 pm, Baldin Lee Pramer <baldinpra...@msn.com>

wrote:

> > > > > > On Dec 3, 7:35 am, Grandmaster Sensei Shaolin

> >

> > > > > > <grandmastersenseishao...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > The Lieberals need to be paying attention since they love more

> > > > > > > government and more socialist programs.

> >

> > > > > > You are too stupid to have an opinion on this.

> >

> > > > > > BLP

> >

> > > > > You must remember, Mr. Pramer, that this is cross-posted to a

martial

> > > > > arts group. Many of the posters have suffered one too many karate

> > > > > kicks to the head. They even have an autistic, dyslexic writer

> > > > > posting who specializes in writing for the sub-50 IQ crowd! His

> > > > > responses are limited to "your argument is ad hominem". He

doesn't

> > > > > seem to have anything else to say.

> >

> > > > Your inability to read is not my problem.

> >

> > > > Neither is your propensity to lie through your teeth.

> >

> > > > --

> > > > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > > > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > > > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com--Back from

hiatus!

> > > > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

> >

> > > > - Show quoted text -

> >

> > > David, apparently you're an applied physicist. You may, for all I

> > > know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> > > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > > Sorry.

> >

> > You're opinion on that matter is completely without merit: as you

> > demonstrate every time you set fingers to keyboard.

> >

> > > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> > > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

> >

> > I see the publishing industry is something else you are completely

> > ignorant about.

> >

> > > I'd rather just have

> > > whatever I want to say disseminated on the internet. Which isn't to

> > > say I haven't published a few things in print from time to time.

> >

> > Name _one_ in a professional, commercial publication--where they pay

> > _you_, not the other way around.

> >

> > You see, in every one of the pieces I mention it was the publisher

that

> > paid me, not me paying the publisher.

> >

> > Among professional writers there's a saying "the only place a writer

> > signs a check is on the back."

> >

> > Here's a nice starting point for learning a bit about the

subject:http://www.sfwa.org/beware/

> >

> > > But,

> > > it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

> >

> > A number of my friends would disagree with you: they make their

living

> > writing.

> >

> > That you are not aware of this speaks volumes about your

> > credibility--and not to your credit.

> >

> > --

> > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com-- Back from hiatus!

> > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

> >

> > - Show quoted text -

>

> David, you SURE AS HELL don't make your living writing. And YOU

> NEVER WILL.

 

This is the first correct statement you've made so far. Unfortunatly,

it falls unde the "blind hog" paradigm since the _reason_ I don't make a

living writing is that it's a hobby for me.

 

But I'll lay any odds you care to name that I've made more money at it

than you have.

> Everything is relative. There is a bit of money in writing. But not

> much.

 

Once again you don't know what you're talking about. Now, mind you,

there's not a whole lot of money to be made in short fiction, and the novel

market is laboring a bit, but non-fiction remains as lucrative as it ever

was.

 

If you want to know about writing as a business, don't talk to wannabes

on the Internet--talk to actual pros who have made actual professional

sales.

> Actually, if you want to talk about lasers, something you may know

> something about, that might be of some interest.

 

Well, if we can simply find something, anything, that you know something

about, we might have the basis for a conversation. So far, however, you are

batting 0.

[Guest Jerry Kraus]

On Dec 4, 2:52 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

>

> news:ba585a15-de81-4dae-94c4-17b149157e60@j20g2000hsi.googlegroups.com...> On Dec 4, 2:22 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > > > David, apparently you're an applied physicist.

>

> > > Jerry, apparently you're an idiot.

>

> > > > You may, for all I know, be quite a good physicist. But, by

>

> presenting yourself as a

>

>

>

>

>

> > > > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > > > Sorry.

>

> > > And you can?

>

> > > > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> > > > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

>

> > > So where are yours? Anyone can do it, right?

>

> > > > I'd rather just have whatever I want to say disseminated on the

> internet.

>

> > > Sure; because the internet has no standards or expectations. It's the

> > > only place where someone like you CAN have your words disseminated.

>

> > > > Which isn't to say I haven't published a few things in print from time

> to time.

>

> > > Which isn't to say that you have.

>

> > > > But, it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

>

> > > Especially when you're only lying about it on usenet...

>

> > For some reason I don't fell like providing personal details to

> > psychotic morons who threaten me on the internet. Call it an

> > eccentricity.

>

> IOW, you've got nothing. If you could name even _one_ professional

> publication, you'd do so. You may not realize how transparent you are, but

> I'd stay away from fiber optics research labs if I were you.

>

> --

> David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com-- Back from hiatus!

> Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

>

> - Show quoted text -

 

Actually, I do, but I won't. Why would I bother? Trust me, stick to

physics, you're no psychologist.

[Guest Shuurai]

> > Especially when you're only lying about it on usenet...

>

> For some reason I don't fell like providing personal details to

> psychotic morons who threaten me on the internet.

 

The reason is quite clear, Jerry - you are lying. It really is that

simple. You are lying.

 

And when exactly did I ever threaten you? Is that just another wad of

bullshit you're throwing into the air to distract people from seeing

what you really are? Surely you've realize by now that you ought to

try something else...

> Call it an eccentricity.

 

Nah; I'd rather just call it what it is: A lame attempt to cover the

fact that you lied and were called on it.

[Guest David L. Burkhead]

"Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1906@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:ba585a15-de81-4dae-94c4-17b149157e60@j20g2000hsi.googlegroups.com...

> On Dec 4, 2:22 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > > David, apparently you're an applied physicist.

> >

> > Jerry, apparently you're an idiot.

> >

> > > You may, for all I know, be quite a good physicist. But, by

presenting yourself as a

> > > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > > Sorry.

> >

> > And you can?

> >

> > > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> > > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

> >

> > So where are yours? Anyone can do it, right?

> >

> > > I'd rather just have whatever I want to say disseminated on the

internet.

> >

> > Sure; because the internet has no standards or expectations. It's the

> > only place where someone like you CAN have your words disseminated.

> >

> > > Which isn't to say I haven't published a few things in print from time

to time.

> >

> > Which isn't to say that you have.

> >

> > > But, it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

> >

> > Especially when you're only lying about it on usenet...

>

> For some reason I don't fell like providing personal details to

> psychotic morons who threaten me on the internet. Call it an

> eccentricity.

 

IOW, you've got nothing. If you could name even _one_ professional

publication, you'd do so. You may not realize how transparent you are, but

I'd stay away from fiber optics research labs if I were you.

 

--

David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

mailto:dburkhead@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

My webcomic Cold Servings

http://www.coldservings.com -- Back from hiatus!

Updates Wednesdays

[Guest Jerry Kraus]

On Dec 4, 2:51 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > > Especially when you're only lying about it on usenet...

>

> > For some reason I don't fell like providing personal details to

> > psychotic morons who threaten me on the internet.

>

> The reason is quite clear, Jerry - you are lying. It really is that

> simple. You are lying.

>

> And when exactly did I ever threaten you? Is that just another wad of

> bullshit you're throwing into the air to distract people from seeing

> what you really are? Surely you've realize by now that you ought to

> try something else...

>

> > Call it an eccentricity.

>

> Nah; I'd rather just call it what it is: A lame attempt to cover the

> fact that you lied and were called on it.

 

Why do you care?

[Guest David L. Burkhead]

"Shuurai" <Shuurai11@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:16eb9a4a-9fe6-4a04-b41e-800a9f6827e1@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com...

>

> > David, apparently you're an applied physicist.

>

> Jerry, apparently you're an idiot.

>

> > You may, for all I know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting

yourself as a

> > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > Sorry.

>

> And you can?

>

> > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if they

> > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

>

> So where are yours? Anyone can do it, right?

>

> > I'd rather just have whatever I want to say disseminated on the

internet.

>

> Sure; because the internet has no standards or expectations. It's the

> only place where someone like you CAN have your words disseminated.

 

When I take the time to write that kind of story or article, I'd rather

be _paid_ for it--and, generally, I have been.

> > Which isn't to say I haven't published a few things in print from time

to time.

>

> Which isn't to say that you have.

>

> > But, it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

>

> Especially when you're only lying about it on usenet...

 

People I know personally who make a living writing:

Dr. Jerry Pournelle.

Julia Ecklar

Joel Robertson

Steve Barnes

Ray Feist

Dafydd ab Hugh

 

And that's just a handful off the top of my head of folk who make a living

writing--and this only counts people in the SF&F field who are known to me

personally.

 

--

David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

mailto:dburkhead@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

My webcomic Cold Servings

http://www.coldservings.com -- Back from hiatus!

Updates Wednesdays

[Guest David L. Burkhead]

"Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1906@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:f767de78-0ab8-4662-951b-52e6c2ff2ff8@f3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...

> On Dec 4, 2:50 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> > --

> > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com-- Back from hiatus!

> > Updates Wednesdays

> >

> > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

> >

> >

news:45c1e77f-5ab4-48af-a0e8-8ccc2c16c319@b15g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...>

On Dec 4, 2:20 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> > > > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

> >

> >

news:f8ab50ef-3203-4778-bb7f-5647d225e3f6@j44g2000hsj.googlegroups.com...>

> > On Dec 4, 1:51 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:> > > >

"Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

> >

> >

news:7f596029-0436-4f8a-a941-635d33f3b910@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > > > > > On Dec 4, 12:45 pm, Baldin Lee Pramer <baldinpra...@msn.com>

> > wrote:

> > > > > > > > On Dec 3, 7:35 am, Grandmaster Sensei Shaolin

> >

> > > > > > > > <grandmastersenseishao...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > The Lieberals need to be paying attention since they love

more

> > > > > > > > > government and more socialist programs.

> >

> > > > > > > > You are too stupid to have an opinion on this.

> >

> > > > > > > > BLP

> >

> > > > > > > You must remember, Mr. Pramer, that this is cross-posted to a

> > martial

> > > > > > > arts group. Many of the posters have suffered one too many

karate

> > > > > > > kicks to the head. They even have an autistic, dyslexic

writer

> > > > > > > posting who specializes in writing for the sub-50 IQ crowd!

His

> > > > > > > responses are limited to "your argument is ad hominem". He

> > doesn't

> > > > > > > seem to have anything else to say.

> >

> > > > > > Your inability to read is not my problem.

> >

> > > > > > Neither is your propensity to lie through your teeth.

> >

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > > > > > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > > > > > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com--Backfrom

> > hiatus!

> > > > > > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

> >

> > > > > > - Show quoted text -

> >

> > > > > David, apparently you're an applied physicist. You may, for all I

> > > > > know, be quite a good physicist. But, by presenting yourself as a

> > > > > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > > > > Sorry.

> >

> > > > You're opinion on that matter is completely without merit: as

you

> > > > demonstrate every time you set fingers to keyboard.

> >

> > > > > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if

they

> > > > > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

> >

> > > > I see the publishing industry is something else you are

completely

> > > > ignorant about.

> >

> > > > > I'd rather just have

> > > > > whatever I want to say disseminated on the internet. Which isn't

to

> > > > > say I haven't published a few things in print from time to time.

> >

> > > > Name _one_ in a professional, commercial publication--where they

pay

> > > > _you_, not the other way around.

> >

> > > > You see, in every one of the pieces I mention it was the

publisher

> > that

> > > > paid me, not me paying the publisher.

> >

> > > > Among professional writers there's a saying "the only place a

writer

> > > > signs a check is on the back."

> >

> > > > Here's a nice starting point for learning a bit about the

> >

> > subject:http://www.sfwa.org/beware/

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > > > But,

> > > > > it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

> >

> > > > A number of my friends would disagree with you: they make their

> > living

> > > > writing.

> >

> > > > That you are not aware of this speaks volumes about your

> > > > credibility--and not to your credit.

> >

> > > > --

> > > > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > > > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > > > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com--Back from

hiatus!

> > > > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

> >

> > > > - Show quoted text -

> >

> > > David, you SURE AS HELL don't make your living writing. And YOU

> > > NEVER WILL.

> >

> > This is the first correct statement you've made so far.

Unfortunatly,

> > it falls unde the "blind hog" paradigm since the _reason_ I don't make a

> > living writing is that it's a hobby for me.

> >

> > But I'll lay any odds you care to name that I've made more money at

it

> > than you have.

> >

> > > Everything is relative. There is a bit of money in writing. But not

> > > much.

> >

> > Once again you don't know what you're talking about. Now, mind you,

> > there's not a whole lot of money to be made in short fiction, and the

novel

> > market is laboring a bit, but non-fiction remains as lucrative as it

ever

> > was.

> >

> > If you want to know about writing as a business, don't talk to

wannabes

> > on the Internet--talk to actual pros who have made actual professional

> > sales.

> >

> > > Actually, if you want to talk about lasers, something you may know

> > > something about, that might be of some interest.

> >

> > Well, if we can simply find something, anything, that you know

something

> > about, we might have the basis for a conversation. So far, however, you

are

> > batting 0.- Hide quoted text -

> >

> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

> >

> > - Show quoted text -

>

> Non-fiction was never particularly lucrative.

 

You really don't know what you're talking about.

 

For decades, non-fiction has been where the reliable money is at in

fiction. While it may not have the "highs" of the Steven Kings and the

Michael Crichton's, it's been a reliable, steady, income provider for many

people. Look at your local bookstore shelves sometime: every one of the

articles in those magazines made money for its author (not counting

"academic" publications like "Nature," "Physical Review," and the like which

run on a completely different model).

 

You appear to be completely unaware of how the business of publishing

and writing works.

> It's not a very good

> business. If it were, it wouldn't be your hobby, but your profession.

 

That turns out not to be the case. Many things that are enjoyable done

at your own pace, when the mood strikes, but become far less so when you

have to do them every day to pay the bills. As one example, I enjoy

driving, both street driving and competitive driving. But put me into a

position as a professional driver--deliveries or whatever--and I'd be driven

mad with boredom within a month. Hobbies are spices. One's career is the

stable. The two are not the same.

> Anyone would naturally make their hobby their profession if they had

> the choice.

 

"Anyone" is overassuming. Hey, I like sex too, but I don't think I'd

want to do it professionally.

> You don't.

 

Actually, if I accept a more modest means and being buttoned up in a

room by myself for long periods of the day I very much do have that choice

because I've _done_ it. There was a period where I was doing feature

article writing for a news magazine that paid for my apartment, food on the

table, etc. Sure, I do better now. But I could do "well enough" then.

> Not many people do.

 

More people than you expect have the choice. But they chose "no" by not

putting in the dog work it takes to get to the point of being able to make

money. The aphorism is that it takes writing about 1 million words of crap

before one starts to write saleable material. And it can't be just any

crap. It has to be the absolute best crap you are capable of writing. (I.e.

you have to really be trying.) There's a lot of heartache, a lot of

rejection, and a lot of frustration along the road. Most people who start

give up along the way. That's a choice.

 

--

David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

mailto:dburkhead@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

My webcomic Cold Servings

http://www.coldservings.com -- Back from hiatus!

Updates Wednesdays

[Guest David L. Burkhead]

"Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1906@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:5f06b36a-88e8-438d-a6ce-11f98cdb5357@s36g2000prg.googlegroups.com...

> On Dec 4, 2:52 pm, "David L. Burkhead" <dburkh...@sff.net> wrote:

> > "Jerry Kraus" <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

> >

> >

news:ba585a15-de81-4dae-94c4-17b149157e60@j20g2000hsi.googlegroups.com...>

On Dec 4, 2:22 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > > > > David, apparently you're an applied physicist.

> >

> > > > Jerry, apparently you're an idiot.

> >

> > > > > You may, for all I know, be quite a good physicist. But, by

> >

> > presenting yourself as a

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > > > "writer", you really do yourself a disservice. You can't write.

> > > > > Sorry.

> >

> > > > And you can?

> >

> > > > > Anyone can, of course, get some articles and stories published if

they

> > > > > spend enough money and time trying to do so.

> >

> > > > So where are yours? Anyone can do it, right?

> >

> > > > > I'd rather just have whatever I want to say disseminated on the

> > internet.

> >

> > > > Sure; because the internet has no standards or expectations. It's

the

> > > > only place where someone like you CAN have your words disseminated.

> >

> > > > > Which isn't to say I haven't published a few things in print from

time

> > to time.

> >

> > > > Which isn't to say that you have.

> >

> > > > > But, it's not much of a business, as you are, I suspect, aware.

> >

> > > > Especially when you're only lying about it on usenet...

> >

> > > For some reason I don't fell like providing personal details to

> > > psychotic morons who threaten me on the internet. Call it an

> > > eccentricity.

> >

> > IOW, you've got nothing. If you could name even _one_ professional

> > publication, you'd do so. You may not realize how transparent you are,

but

> > I'd stay away from fiber optics research labs if I were you.

> >

> > --

> > David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

> > mailto:dburkh...@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

> > My webcomic Cold Servingshttp://www.coldservings.com-- Back from hiatus!

> > Updates Wednesdays- Hide quoted text -

> >

> > - Show quoted text -

>

> Actually, I do, but I won't. Why would I bother? Trust me, stick to

> physics, you're no psychologist.

 

And you stick to lying. It's what you do best. Not well, mind you, but

better than everything else you fail at.

 

 

--

David L. Burkhead "Dum Vivimus Vivamus"

mailto:dburkhead@sff.net "While we live, let us live."

My webcomic Cold Servings

http://www.coldservings.com -- Back from hiatus!

Updates Wednesdays

[Guest Pierre Honeyman]

On Dec 4, 8:28 am, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Castro doesn't kill people. The U.S. does. Castro has no Gulag, the

> U.S. does. Despite being a poor country, average life expectancy is

> just as high in Cuba as in the U.S. Cuba is a paradise compared to

> Mexico. You don't see any Cubans escaping to "Freedom in Mexico".

 

You would if Mexico were closer.

 

Pierre

[Guest Pierre Honeyman]

On Dec 4, 12:40 pm, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Dec 4, 2:33 pm, Shuurai <Shuura...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > Sorry, Jerry... the only rational conclusion remains as it was before

> > - that you are completely full of shit. So what random unrelated

> > bullshit will you try next in place of an actual argument? Try global

> > warming - that one always seems to get a reaction from people.

>

> I'm sorry. I realize psychotic morons like yourself have different

> standards of proof than the average person. I'll try to make this

> simple.

>

> 1. Cuba is a better place to live than Mexico, because its socialist

> system improves the people's standard of living.

 

You're in high school aren't you?

 

Pierre