Maddy McCann

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

Add to all that the fact that Mrs McCann works with dead bodies on a near daily basis,.

 

Not so. Many doctors never get near dead bodies, ie GP's consultants, radiologists, ear nose and throat men, paediatricians etc. This woman fits into this category. I just wish I could remember what she did exactly.

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

There was a nasty murder in my town some years ago. A young mother went missing. The husband claimed she had left him. Her family new that she would never leave the children.

 

He fell under suspicion. He thought he was clever when he enlisted his brothers help. The brother sent letters to him purportedly from the dead women. The brothers dismembered the corpse in the bathroom. Parts of her went into the garbage. Limbs were left all over town in secret places for rats to dispose of.

 

Mentally the husband was quite strong. He stood up well to police interogation. The public then turned against him, followed by the diehards who had supported him. Eventually he was friendless. I think it was this and only this that broke him.He kept his innocent bull going for about a year.

 

Some people are this callous and determined to get away with it. I suspect the McCanns are too.

[Old Salt]

I actually know two mothers, one is single, who leave their doors unlocked all the time, the single mom told me a week ago that she came home at midnight last week to find her things have been moved around. I have warned them both several times, in this day and age you would think people would be educated enough to know better. Both women are college graduates but stupid as hell apparently.

Book smarts and common sense don't always go hand-in-hand. I've known a lot of people who had college degrees and no common sense. I've also known a lot of people with good common sense and no college degree.

[atlantic]

Book smarts and common sense don't always go hand-in-hand. I've known a lot of people who had college degrees and no common sense. I've also known a lot of people with good common sense and no college degree.

Good point.

[hugo]

The truth about Leonor Cipriano (mother of "another missing girl"?) "beaten" and "tortured" by Chief-Inspector Gon?alo Amaral

 

There?s a killer on the road ( ), and his name is "Amaral Lector". This is what most readers of British Media should think, after what was published by tabloids like Daily Express and Daily Mail, about Portuguese CID Chief-Inspector Gon?alo Amaral, the man in charge of the investigation of Madeleine disappearance. That "killer", Gon?alo Amaral, has tortured a poor mother of "another missing girl", (a girl that vanished like Madeleine McCann, right?) as Daily Express wrote. Several emails and comments posted at my page reflected the conclusion their authors arrived, after being so accurately and precisely informed by British journalist about what happened to Joana, an eight years old girl, daughter of Leonor Cipriano, the poor mother tortured by "Amaral Lector".

 

What most British journalists forget to mention ? never allow truth or reality to kill a good story, of course ? - was a couple of "small" details that, if mentioned, would transform those good headlines in nothing. So, let?s take a look at some facts about that "another missing girl":

 

1 ? Joana Cipriano vanished from a small place 10 km in the outskirts of Portim?o. Last time somebody saw her, she was on her way to a local groceries shop;

2 - Her mother, Leonor Cipriano, only reported to Police her daughter has disappeared two days after;

3 ? After a long and difficult investigation, headed by Chief-Inspector Gon?alo Amaral, Leonor Cipriano and her brother were accused of murdering the eight years old child;

4 ? The body of Joana Cipriano was never found, but samples of her blood were found in her mother refrigerator;

5 ? Her mother justified those samples of blood admitting she had beaten Joana, for some reason, she was hurt and she blooded from her nose;

6 ? Leonor Cipriano and her brother, who had a incestuous relationship, were sentenced to 16 years in jail, for the murder of her daughter and nice;

7 ? Before the trial, Leonor Cipriano accused five CID officers of beating her, trying to extract a confession. She named the five CID officers, and included Chief-Inspector Gon?alo ("Amaral Lector", according to British tabloids?);

8 ? The Public Prosecutor?s Office opened a criminal investigation and ordered a police line-up, with the CID officers named and accused by Leonor Cipriano of beating her;

9 ? The line-up took place with Leonor Cipriano behind a two-way mirror and she couldn?t recognize any of the aggressors;

10 ? The Public Prosecutor?s Office magistrate that was in charge of the criminal investigation decided to accuse the five CID officers, but didn?t mentioned, in the accusation sent to the Court, that Leonor Cipriano couldn?t identify any of the aggressors, in the police line-up;

11 ? Leonor Cipriano never confessed the murder of her own daughter. Her brother, in a letter written from jail, accused Leonor Cipriano of selling her daughter;

12 ? Police is convinced (and the jurors at the trial found enough evidence to pass a verdict of guilty) that Leonor Cipriano and her brother were found, by Joana, having sexual relations, when she came home, back from the groceries shop. As Leonor Cipriano had a lover, at the time, they were afraid she would tell him what she saw;

13 ? So, they beat her, in order to frighten her and keep her mouth shut up;

14 ? Perhaps accidentally, they beat her so violently that they killed her. So, they decided to get rid of he body and cut it in pieces, keeping some of them in the freezer, while they gave the other pieces to be eaten by pigs (this is what police believes is the strongest possibility, because there was no other trace of Joana Cipriano, unless the blood samples in her mother freezer?)

15 ? The body of Joana Cipriano was never found.

 

And so, here we have a terrible story of a dysfunctional family, a child murdered and a very difficult police investigation. The only thing ? in my humble opinion - that has some similarity with Madeleine McCann disappearance is the fact that the person in charge of Madeleine?s case is the same that successfully headed Joana Cipriano investigation: CID Chief-Inspector Gon?alo Amaral. And success, in Joana?s case, is clear: the murderers were found, accused, went to court, they were sentenced, they appealed the sentence and the Portuguese Supreme Court reduced it to 16 years of jail to both of them ? the mother, Leonor Cipriano and her brother, for the murder her daughter and nice, eight year old Joana Cipriano.

 

If many "consumers" of British Media have another idea, that?s because most British journalists covering Madeleine McCann abduction strongly believe that truth never should be allowed to "kill" a good story. Even if I means destroying the reputation of an experienced CID Chief-Inspector. "And what?s the problem?" ? I imagine my British colleagues asking themselves this question, with a pint of Guinness in the hand, enjoying the sunshine at Praia da Luz. "The guy isn?t even British, he?s just a Portuguese?"

 

Leonor killed and fed her own child to pigs. She deserved a lot worse.

[Jhony5]

Sounds like an awful leap of logic to go from a few drops of blood in a freezer to the conclusion that she fed her daughter to pigs. Don't cha think?

 

If the cops searched my house they would find quite a few of my daughters blood droplets all about. And she's just fine.

[hugo]

Sounds like an awful leap of logic to go from a few drops of blood in a freezer to the conclusion that she fed her daughter to pigs. Don't cha think?

 

If the cops searched my house they would find quite a few of my daughters blood droplets all about. And she's just fine.

 

 

The mother confessed to beating her daughter and bloodying her nose as the excuse for the blood in the fridge.. Plus the mother was screwing her own brother. I don't recall ever bloodying my son's nose. Reddened his rear end a couple times.

 

The couple received 16 year sentences.

What the report doesn't say is the mother waited 2 days before she notified the police.

During that time she washed her house down with petrol.Blood was found in the freezer belonging to Joana which the mother claimed came from a nose bleed after she had given Joana a beating

.

 

Yep, normal people wait two days to report a young child missing and wash their home down with petrol in the meantime.

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

Sounds like an awful leap of logic to go from a few drops of blood in a freezer to the conclusion that she fed her daughter to pigs. Don't cha think?

 

If the cops searched my house they would find quite a few of my daughters blood droplets all about. And she's just fine.

 

In a 20 year period, there has nly ever been one occasion where drops of my blood were about my house. Its was a nasty puncture wound I got during an accident.

 

Similarly, I dont think the police would, at any given time, find droplets of your daughters blood about her house.

 

And even on hose rare occasions when they would, I doubt the plice would discover those drops in the fridge !

 

If you ever take up the lawyer business jon let me know. I want you to defend me if I ever go to court !!!!!!

[Jhony5]

Yep, normal people wait two days to report a young child missing and wash their home down with petrol in the meantime.

I really wasn't trying to get all into the aspects of that case and whether or not she was really guilty. The point of mentioning it was to show the difference between Portuguese law enforcement techniques and American techniques. Imagine the reaction if Patsy Ramsey emerged from the Boulder Colorado police station looking like that.

 

If the law enforcement agency and the court system is not comprised of white folk, than it is not to be trusted. N ggers can't create a righteous system of justice. Dispute that? Prove me wrong. Find me some n gger run countries that aren't f cked up. And yes, by "n gger" I mean any country whose predominant demographic within the government is not Caucasian/Asian. In n gger countries they beat your ass and run roughshod over your ass, guilty or not.

 

In a 20 year period, there has only ever been one occasion where drops of my blood were about my house. Its was a nasty puncture wound I got during an accident.

 

Similarly, I dont think the police would, at any given time, find droplets of your daughters blood about her house.

First off Sheik, I don't know if you ever had kids, but they get hurt ALOT. Skinned knees, cuts and the like. One could easily transfer minuscule amounts of blood into a freezer by reaching in to get ice for your child's injury.

 

Secondly, I am not talking about obvious visible drops of blood. I am speaking about minute, minuscule droplets and residuals. The variety that can only be found with luminescent light and a chemical reagent. I guarantee in any household of any missing child, the police could find blood traces and DNA all over the place.

 

Not so. Many doctors never get near dead bodies, ie GP's consultants, radiologists, ear nose and throat men, paediatricians etc. This woman fits into this category. I just wish I could remember what she did exactly.

 

She was a "General Practitioner". I derived the fact that she handles corpses from the below article. How much validity there is too it, I have no idea.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/09/11/wmaddy411.xml

The police are also relying on the reaction of "cadaver dogs" trained to react to the scent of a corpse. One is said to have "smelled death" in the hire car and the apartment. Kate McCann's work as a doctor, in which she handles corpses, could mean she had slight traces of such odours on her clothing.

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

First off Sheik, I don't know if you ever had kids, but they get hurt ALOT. Skinned knees, cuts and the like. One could easily transfer minuscule amounts of blood into a freezer by reaching in to get ice for your child's injury. ]

 

Now you put it like that I see your point.

 

Secondly, I am not talking about obvious visible drops of blood. I am speaking about minute, minuscule droplets and residuals. The variety that can only be found with luminescent light and a chemical reagent. I guarantee in any household of any missing child, the police could find blood traces and DNA all over the place. ]

 

The press of course leave things like this unsaid. Its much more titilating to lets peoples imaginations as well as paper sales run riot.

 

 

She was a "General Practitioner". ]

 

These are the ones we go to to get our drug prescriptions renewed, our blood pressure checked and our ears peered into. She meets cadavers, like I'm sick of bumping into Superman

[Jhony5]

These are the ones we go to to get our drug prescriptions renewed, our blood pressure checked and our ears peered into. She meets cadavers, like I'm sick of bumping into Superman

Ya that's what I thought. Ear, nose and throat doctors I thought, but the article from a reliable source worded it as if she handles cadavers. I read this from a few other sources but none of them were specific. Maybe she does some sort of training for med students or.........?

[Old Salt]

Now you put it like that I see your point.

 

 

 

The press of course leave things like this unsaid. Its much more titilating to lets peoples imaginations as well as paper sales run riot.

 

 

 

 

These are the ones we go to to get our drug prescriptions renewed, our blood pressure checked and our ears peered into. She meets cadavers, like I'm sick of bumping into Superman

Maybe she's a really, really bad GP and has a lot of patients die in her officie?

[Feckless Wench]

I had a thought today while I was reading through the newpaper and saw yet ANOTHER story about this child. What if this is all one HUGE hoax? What if the parents have been paid to see if they can get a story in the news every day for a whole year?

 

Something stinks about this case.

[Jhony5]

Maybe she's a really, really bad GP and has a lot of patients die in her office?

 

hehehehe......or maybe she KILLS THEM!!!!!

 

Something stinks about this case.

The investigation is what reeks. They had the cleaning staff clean the room long before DNA was searched for. HUNDREDS of people trampled in and out of the room. The only "evidence" was a supposed hit by a cadaver dog in the rental car that had been in service for quite some time, driven by hundreds of people before the McCann's. The hotel employees weren't interviewed for over 60 hours after Maddy was reported missing.

 

What stinks is the investigation. How in the world anyone could even whisper that the McCann's are "obviously" guilty under such circumstance, I have no f cking clue.

[hugo]

The McCann's are so paranoid of fire that they habitually leave their backdoor unlocked. What did they think Maddy and her siblings would have done if there had been a fire?

 

McCanns evidence 'doesn't add up'

EXCLUSIVE THE HUNT FOR MADELEINE Brit team questions Kate's reaction

Stewart Maclean In Praia Da Luz Stewart.Maclean@Mirror.Co.Uk 18/10/2007

A team of British crime specialists who have scrutinised the Madeleine McCann case claim there are inconsistencies in her parents' version of events.

 

The retired experts believe there is a question mark over Kate's response when she discovered the four-year-old was missing.

 

Forensic scientist Professor David Barclay, part of the four-man team who reviewed the case for Channel Four's Dispatches show, said: "We examined all of the available evidence and the conclusion we came to was that there appeared to be some significant inconsistencies.

 

"One thing we looked for was any sign of 'staging', the term we use for the actions of someone who has committed a crime and wants to 'stage it' to appear someone else has done it.

 

"The first words apparently spoken by Kate McCann when she discovered Madeleine had vanished were significant. She is supposed to have said 'They've taken her, they've taken her' - which seems a strange choice of phrase.

 

"I don't think that would have been my first reaction if my child had gone missing."

 

Prof Barclay also questioned the McCanns' claims that an abductor got into their Praia da Luz holiday flat through the back shutters.

 

He said: "We checked the scene of the crime and it struck us immediately how unlikely it would be for anyone to try and access the apartment through the back windows. The shutters there were firmly shut and couldn't be opened and the car park behind the flat was overlooked.

 

"We're not saying it was impossible to have gained entry that way, but with all of our collected years of experience to us it seemed highly unlikely and a very implausible scenario.

 

"It could be that claim is consistent with staging, but without full knowledge of all of the facts in the case it would be impossible to say for sure."

 

Prof Barclay visited the crime scene along with ex-Detective Chief Superintendent Chris Stevenson, the man who caught Soham killer Ian Huntley and psychological profiler David Canter.

 

Prof Barclay, 62, added: "There has been a tendency to criticise the Portuguese police but on the whole they did a pretty good job.

"However, they made two big mistakes. Firstly, they did not seal of the crime scene anywhere nearly quick enough. Secondly, in my opinion they were not aggressive enough with the McCanns in the first stage of the investigation.

 

"It is actually for the parents' benefit in cases like this that the police tackle them robustly and demand a comprehensive account of their movements during the relevant timeframe."

[Jhony5]

The McCann's are so paranoid of fire that they habitually leave their backdoor unlocked. What did they think Maddy and her siblings would have done if there had been a fire?

 

Again, this is the kind of sh t that says nothing about the McCann's guilt in the childs supposed death.

[hugo]

Again, this is the kind of sh t that says nothing about the McCann's guilt in the childs supposed death.

 

 

ThaT ALONG WITH THE EXPERT OPINION ON THE LIKELIHOOD OF AN INTRUDER THROUGH THE WINDOW SAYS QUITE A BIT. tHESE ARE TWO PROFESSIONALS WHO WHILE AFRAID OF FIRE THEMSELVES HAVE NO PROBLEMS LEAVING THEIR CHILDREN. iT MAKES NO RATIONAL SENSE. tHEY ARE GUILTY AS HELL. in' caps lock.

[Jhony5]

Prof Barclay, 62, added: "There has been a tendency to criticise the Portuguese police but on the whole they did a pretty good job.

 

"However, they made two big mistakes. Firstly, they did not seal of the crime scene anywhere nearly quick enough. Secondly, in my opinion they were not aggressive enough with the McCanns in the first stage of the investigation.

So.......they did a "Pretty good job" but they didn't seal the crime scene (AT ALL) and they allowed a cleaning lady to spray cleaning agents all over the room before it was tested for DNA? Oh...and they didn't interview any of the people in the building from which Maddy was taken for almost 3 days. GREAT JOB!

 

 

Right.

 

Most of the assessments I have heard toward the Portuguese police investigation was along the lines of "One of the worst crime scene investigations I have ever heard of".

 

 

"The first words apparently spoken by Kate McCann when she discovered Madeleine had vanished were significant. She is supposed to have said 'They've taken her, they've taken her' - which seems a strange choice of phrase.

Should she have assumed the child just disappeared into thin air? Also, this is the sort of anecdotal nonsense that sensationalist magazines just love. MY assumption, anyones assumption, would have been to think the child had been taken.

 

"I don't think that would have been my first reaction if my child had gone missing."

How many times has this biased idiot had his child stolen?

[hugo]

Professor Barclay pointed out the major mistake the police made and that was not harshly interrogating the perpetrators of the crime, the McCanns. It is quite clear the probability of an intruder was very low, That leaves the McCann's. Like the Boulder, Colorado police force in another celebrated case the mistake was to let wealthy parents off easy.

 

BIRMINGHAM, England, Oct. 14 A forensic examination of a bloody footprint found in Kate and Gerry McCann's apartment in Portugal has renewed interest in their daughter's disappearance.

 

With a British laboratory finding that the blood may have been Madeline McCann's, investigators' suspicion into the 4-year-old's parents has been renewed, The Daily Mail said Sunday.

 

The Forensic Science Service laboratory determined the footprint also matched a mark found in the McCanns' rental car in Portugal.

 

Guilty as hell.

[Jhony5]

Professor Barclay pointed out the major mistake the police made and that was not harshly interrogating the perpetrators of the crime, the McCanns. It is quite clear the probability of an intruder was very low, That leaves the McCann's. Like the Boulder, Colorado police force in another celebrated case the mistake was to let wealthy parents off easy.

 

 

 

Guilty as hell.

 

In America and the UK we require "evidence" to prosecute people. We don't just sit them down, handcuffed to a chair and beat their ass black and blue until they confess.

 

Guilty as hell.

If I am ever on trial, I sure hope I don't see you on the jury.

 

Too much reasonable doubt in this case.

 

It's crap like this that causes me to call for a moratorium on the death penalty until they figure out why our juries are so simple minded and prone to Soap opera forensics.

[hugo]

There has never been a proven case, post-Furman, of an innocent executed. Sadly, a murderer, e.g. Mrs. McCann, is much more likely to go free. Particularly when they can afford high-priced attorneys.

[Jhony5]

There has never been a proven case, post-Furman, of an innocent executed. Sadly, a murderer, e.g. Mrs. McCann, is much more likely to go free. Particularly when they can afford high-priced attorneys.

 

If you think that an innocent has never been put to death here in America, you are fooling yourself.

 

Innocence: List of Those Freed From Death Row

 

Since 1973, 126 people in 26 states have been exonerated from death row. Dozens of them after more than 10 years and frighteningly close to their execution date. Many of them after their date had been commuted.

 

And this is coming from someone that ardently supports the death penalty if it is used properly during trial. The sad fact is, all too often the juries do what you are doing. Convicting on a preponderance of maybes.

[hugo]

If you think that an innocent has never been put to death here in America, you are fooling yourself.

 

Innocence: List of Those Freed From Death Row

 

Since 1973, 126 people in 26 states have been exonerated from death row. Dozens of them after more than 10 years and frighteningly close to their execution date. Many of them after their date had been commuted.

 

And this is coming from someone that ardently supports the death penalty if it is used properly during trial. The sad fact is, all too often the juries do what you are doing. Convicting on a preponderance of maybes.

 

Not one person executed. Our system works.

[hugo]

If you think that an innocent has never been put to death here in America, you are fooling yourself.

 

Innocence: List of Those Freed From Death Row

 

Since 1973, 126 people in 26 states have been exonerated from death row. Dozens of them after more than 10 years and frighteningly close to their execution date. Many of them after their date had been commuted.

 

And this is coming from someone that ardently supports the death penalty if it is used properly during trial. The sad fact is, all too often the juries do what you are doing. Convicting on a preponderance of maybes.

 

Not one person executed. Our system works.

 

The McCann's Are Guilty! Petition : [ powered by iPetitions.com ]

 

Key witness casts doubt over Kate McCann's account of Madeleine's disappearance

By REBECCA CAMBER - More by this author ?

 

Last updated at 18:38pm on 16th December 2007

 

Comments

 

A crucial witness has cast fresh doubt over Kate McCann's account of the night her daughter disappeared in a new police quiz.

 

 

Detectives consider the testimony of an Ocean Club waiter as the "trump card" in their investigation, it was claimed today.

 

The holiday resort employee was first on the scene moments after Madeleine's mother discovered she was missing at 10pm on May 3.

 

His evidence, which highlights a number of contradictions in the McCanns' statements, is said to be so vital to the police inquiry that they have re-interviewed the waiter for the third time in recent days.

 

Scroll down for more

 

 

 

Kate McCann: A vital witness has cast doubt on her account of the night her daughter Madeleine disappeared

 

Crucially, the member of staff, who has not been identified, claims that the parents and their holiday friends, the so-called Tapas Nine, did not check on their children every 30 minutes.

Contrary to what Kate McCann told police, the tapas restaurant worker also said that Kate McCann did scream: "They've taken her, they've taken her" when she learnt Madeleine was missing.

 

He said instead of running back to the tapas bar where she was dining with her husband Gerry and friends, Mrs McCann raised the alarm from the balcony of their holiday apartment in Praia da Luz.

 

The mother's precise words have become a pivotal issue in the case, with Portuguese police questioning why she would automatically assume Madeleine had been abducted.

 

Madeleine McCann has been missing since May 3rd

His version of events contrasts dramatically with the account friends of the couple have given.

 

They claim that the 39-year-old GP raised the alarm when she ran back to the restaurant on 3 May shouting "Madeleine's gone, Madeleine's gone."

 

The highly respected Portuguese newspaper, Diario de Noticias reported today that the eyewitness account is considered a "trump card", critical to pining down supposed contradictions in the accounts of the Tapas Nine.

 

The Ocean Club employee has been re-interviewed at Portimao police station in recent days about the McCanns' behaviour where he reaffirmed his original statement.

 

Policia Judiciaria detectives believe the key to unlocking the mystery of Madeleine's disappearance lies within the group and alleged inconsistencies in their witness statements are at the heart of the investigation.

 

The revelation comes as police prepare to fly to Britain where Kate and Gerry McCann and their holiday friends will be re-interrogated about their movements on the night she went missing.

 

Police suspect that Madeleine died in an accident in the apartment and the McCanns disposed of her body - an allegation the couple have denied.

 

Detectives are working on the theory some of their friends helped cover up the crime and some could be named as suspects when they are re-interviewed.

 

But the McCanns have always insisted Madeleine was snatched from their Ocean Club apartment while they were dining with their friends just yards away.

 

The waiter's account mirrors that of nanny Charlotte Pennington who said she heard Kate McCann scream: "They've taken her, they've taken her!"

 

But other waiters working at the holiday complex have disputed key elements of his evidence, saying that the group checked on their children every 20 minutes.

 

Yesterday the McCanns' spokesman Clarence Mitchell furious denied the claims. He said: "This is all lies. Kate has consistently and categorically absolutely denied that she said that on the veranda.

 

"But in the evening she may have said it at some stage as a general remark, but she did not run out with this phrase.

 

"Whoever this guy is and if he is saying this, he is either making it up or he is mistaken.

 

"Kate, Gerry and their friends told the truth. They will continue to maintain their stories, because it is the truth. Whatever this guy is saying, we reject it, it is not true."

 

The other seven of the Tapas Nine should be interrogated until one cracks.

[Jhony5]

Not one person executed. Our system works.

 

Our "system" ruined 126 lives in just this particular punishment, and that's just going back to 1973.

 

There is NO WAY whatsoever that America hasn't executed innocent men. NO WAY! Logic and just the plain 'ol law of averages says this is impossible.

 

DNA has only been solid for about ten years and it is usually the only reason people have been exonerated. Many counties discard evidence shortly after a conviction, leaving no recourse for the wrongly convicted.

 

I support the death penalty but don't lie like a snake and tell me you find it preposterous to claim that innocents have not been killed by the state.

 

There is no way conceivable, given the evidence of wrongful death penalty convictions, that at least a few (probably several) people have been strapped to the electric chair thinking "WTF I didn't do a damn thing".

 

The reason this happens is because our juries are fickle and are easily poisoned by overzealous prosecutors that spread lies and build a case entirely upon "maybes".