Abortion Smoothie

[wez]

Why should a baby be killed just because it's mother was irresponsible or it may "inconvenience" her?

 

 

Abortion as a form of birth control (which is how it abortion is used the majority of the time) infuriates me.

 

 

If you aren't prepared to be a parent, then your best bet is to not have sex (because abstinence is the only 100% effective form of birth control.)

 

Why do you think children should be used as punishment for having sex?

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

While a foetus is growing inside a woman, it belongs to her..

 

I disagree. No one owns you, me, or anyone else. Slavery was abolished many years ago for good reason.

 

Neither can I go for the belief that a foetus is not a human being. Do you really believe that a (+1 day old baby) is human, but a (-1 day old is not) ? This is just a self serving argument used by pro abortionists to excuse their behaviour.

 

I

f men want to have an opinion on it, they should take action to stop other men raping women, underage girls, and even their own children. Untill all that kind of nasty inhumane behaviour stops happening, women need to have abortions legally available.

 

Here is where I must modify my belief. A woman who has been raped should be able to have an abortion. Also where going to full term endangers the womans life, and also possibly where the child is known to have serious health implications.

 

A contradiction? Yes. A necessary clause I think.

[eddo]

Why do you think children should be used as punishment for having sex?

 

You view having kids as a punishment? I don't, but getting pregnant is a natural side-effect of having sex. I was taught that in the 5th grade, and I assume most people having abortions were taught that as well (I say 'people' instead of 'women', because there are plenty of men that push their women to have abortions so they won't have to deal with it.)

 

Can't stand the heat? Don't play with fire. Abortion should not be used as birth control. Ever.

[wez]

Whoops double posted... See below.

[wez]

You view having kids as a punishment? I don't, but getting pregnant is a natural side-effect of having sex. I was taught that in the 5th grade, and I assume most people having abortions were taught that as well (I say 'people' instead of 'women', because there are plenty of men that push their women to have abortions so they won't have to deal with it.)

 

Can't stand the heat? Don't play with fire. Abortion should not be used as birth control. Ever.

 

You think women that get pregnant who have no desire or means to have and raise a child should have them anyway and serve as consequenses for their decision to have sex. Heat = pregnancy and fire = sex. So if one does play with fire and can't stand the heat, what do you propose for the unwanted child? Can they drop them off at your door?

 

If you haven't noticed, people don't just have sex to produce children. It's quite enjoyable, you should try it sometime.

 

I agree abortion shouldn't used as birth control and I don't think most women who have them are using them as such. It's much easier to take a pill but the fact is, unwanted pregnancies happen. What do you think should happen? They should be forced to give birth against their will?

[snafu]

...

Here is where I must modify my belief. A woman who has been raped should be able to have an abortion. Also where going to full term endangers the womans life, and also possibly where the child is known to have serious health implications.

 

A contradiction? Yes. A necessary clause I think.

 

I disagree with the rape scenario. It wasn't the child's fault. We have plenty of people looking to adopt children. But if going through the pregnancy or delivering the child is a threat to the womens life I could see abortion as an option.

[snafu]

... What do you think should happen? They should be forced to give birth against their will?

 

Yes.........

[snafu]

..Would you rather a baby was born, unwanted, to ill equipped and unprepared parents?

 

Why should a woman go through nine months of pain if she really isn't ready for it?

 

Please, stop being incensed and try to understand it from a female point of view. Having a baby is a huge decision, a huge responsibilty, a major life altering experience - and shouldn't be forced upon anyone.

 

 

Why should the man be expected to pay child support for 18 years then if he didn't want the child?

 

Murder by abortion pill?

Nov. 30: A Wisconsin man is facing attempted murder charges after

allegedly slipping abortion pills into his mistress's drink during two

pregnancies. WGBA-TV's Lacey Crisp reports.

NBC News Channe

 

 

updated 8:56 a.m. PT, Fri., Nov. 30, 2007

APPLETON, Wis. - Authorities charged a married man Thursday with

slipping his girlfriend an abortion drug that caused her to miscarry

twice.

 

 

Manishkumar M. Patel, 34, of Appleton, was charged with seven felonies

and two misdemeanors, including attempted first-degree murder of an

unborn child, stalking, burglary and two counts of violating a

restraining order.

 

 

His attorney, Thomas Zoesch, said he expected his client to plead not

guilty.

 

 

Patel and his girlfriend, 39-year-old family physician Darshana Patel,

have a 3-year-old child together, authorities said. They are not

related, and he is married to someone else; Patel is a common Indian

last name.

 

 

Darshana Patel became pregnant two more times but miscarried in

December and September, Outagamie County sheriff's Capt. Michael Jobe

said.

 

 

Spiked smoothie

A week or two before her second miscarriage, Manishkumar Patel bought

her a smoothie at an ice cream shop, Sheriff's Sgt. Ryan Carpenter

said. Darshana Patel noticed white powder on the rim and, feigning

illness, took the drink back to her office.

 

 

Suspecting she had been slipped mifespristone, the abortion pill also

known as RU-486, Darshana Patel sent a sample of the smoothie to a

California lab for analysis, Carpenter said.

 

 

When it tested positive for the drug, she approached the sheriff's

department Nov. 1. Manishkumar Patel was arrested Wednesday.

 

 

Court Commissioner Brian Figy ordered Patel held on $750,000 bail

after prosecutor Mark Schroeder said he had a net worth of $400,000

and investigators found evidence he had been looking at flights to

Germany.

 

 

Click for related content

Women die after Nicaragua's ban on abortions

 

 

"The allegations are devious, diabolical and disturbing," Figy said.

"Extraordinary cases deserve extraordinary care."

 

 

A legal immigrant from India, Manishkumar Patel owns gas stations and

other businesses in the Appleton area, Carpenter said.

 

 

Carpenter did not know where Patel's wife was but said investigators

do not believe she's in the area.

 

 

Man allegedly says he gave her the drug

Patel told investigators he gave his girlfriend the drug but would not

give them details on how he did it, Carpenter said. Investigators

believe he got the drug outside the U.S. because it must be obtained

here from a doctor and taken in the doctor's office, he said.

 

 

Wisconsin is one of 37 states with a fetal homicide law, according to

the National Conference of State Legislatures. Under the 1998 law,

anyone who attacks a pregnant woman and injures or kills her fetus

could face life in prison.

 

At least six people have been charged with a crime under the law since

1998, according to Susan Armacost, legislative director for Wisconsin

Right to Life. The group tracks use of the law through media reports,

so Armacost said it's possible there are more cases.

 

 

 

This guy is going up for first degree murder. I simply don't understand the difference if the women dose it. If she wants the child its murder. If she doesn't want the child its an inconvenience and can be aborted?

[hugo]

What do you think should happen? They should be forced to give birth against their will?

 

Yep, and after giving birth they should be flogged in the town square.

[snafu]

So in essence this women can say "never mind, I didn't really want the child either" and he walks (minus the endangerment charges). But as it stands he's gonna spend the rest of his life behind bars?

[snafu]

But to reiterate, I don't want to be judgmental on women that have had abortions. I apologize if I offend any of you with my beliefs. I blame it on society as a whole. They lead you do belive its ok.

[wez]

But to reiterate, I don't want to be judgmental on women that have had abortions. I apologize if I offend any of you with my beliefs. I blame it on society as a whole. They lead you do belive its ok.

 

I agree with that, society is not very child friendly these days.. maybe never were.

[eddo]

You think women that get pregnant who have no desire or means to have and raise a child should have them anyway and serve as consequenses for their decision to have sex. Heat = pregnancy and fire = sex. So if one does play with fire and can't stand the heat, what do you propose for the unwanted child? Can they drop them off at your door?

As Snafu said, there are lots of people waiting to adopt. Adoption is obviously better for the child, and easier for the mom to handle than abortion.

 

I am glad that you got my heat and fire analogies. Playing with fire means you can get burned. Having sex means you can get pregnant.

 

yes, if need be- they can drop them off at my door- especially if it saves an innocent child from being aborted. I will absolutely do my best to make sure they are safe and get a home that will love and care for them.

 

If you haven't noticed, people don't just have sex to produce children. It's quite enjoyable, you should try it sometime.

 

I get that, really I do. But, it is a fact that sex, no matter how enjoyable, can lead to babies. If you are in a situation that you wouldn't be a suitable mom or dad, then maybe you need to re-examine your decision to have sex: That is part of the responsibility of being an adult.

 

I agree abortion shouldn't used as birth control and I don't think most women who have them are using them as such.

Then why do you think most abortions happen?

 

Why do women have abortions?

74% say having a baby would interfere with work, school, or other responsibilities.

73% say they cannot afford to have a child.

48% say they do not want to be a single parent, or have relationship problems with husband or partner.

Less than 2% say they became pregnant as a result of rape or incest.

 

Source: The Alan Guttmacher Institute, Perspective on Sexual & Reproductive Health, Sept. 2005

 

United States Abortion Statistics

Last updated 11/26/2007

 

48,589,993 abortions in the United States 1973-2006

 

Source: United States Abortion Statistics

People are upset at just over 3,000 soldiers being killed in Iraq since 2002. Where's the outrage over the 1.2 MILLION US babies that were killed in 2006 alone???

 

What do you think should happen? They should be forced to give birth against their will?

Yes. Once a woman gets pregnant she has a responsibility to care for herself and that baby til it is delivered. Her choice (apart from rape- but snafu made an excellent argument for that) has already been made- when she decided to have sex.

 

Now, I also feel that the mans responsibility is equally as important- but a woman has to acknowledge that she will have more at stake physically if she gets pregnant, thus she needs to consider her options before hand a little closer than the guy does. THIS DOES NOT ABSOLVE THE MAN OF RESPONSIBILITY, but the next nine months of his physical life aren't going to be thrown in a bender for 15 minutes of "enjoyment."

 

But to reiterate, I don't want to be judgmental on women that have had abortions. I apologize if I offend any of you with my beliefs. I blame it on society as a whole. They lead you do belive its ok.

Another excellent point Snafu. I do not intend to pass judgment either, but I cannot believe that society feels it is ok to kill innocent babies and call it little more than a "choice."

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

I disagree with the rape scenario. It wasn't the child's fault. We have plenty of people looking to adopt children. But if going through the pregnancy or delivering the child is a threat to the womens life I could see abortion as an option.

 

Hi Snaf

I was expecting someone to disagree ! As I said, it is a contradiction to what I said earlier, but I believe there has to be a few waivers.

 

You too agree to abortion for health reasons.

 

I think it should be allowed for rape too. Just imagine being the raped woman. Imagine carrying the child of the criminal who ruined your life.

 

Not only that but society does not need rapists breeding. There is quite enough arseholes wandering around, without allowing a breeding programme for them.

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

But to reiterate, I don't want to be judgmental on women that have had abortions. I apologize if I offend any of you with my beliefs. I blame it on society as a whole. They lead you do belive its ok.

 

I agree with you here as well. I do not sit in judgement of anyone who has chosen this route.

[hugo]

Why should a baby be killed just because it's mother was irresponsible or it may "inconvenience" her?

 

 

 

Had scrambled chickens for breakfeast.

[ImWithStupid]

Had scrambled chickens for breakfeast.

 

I hope you didn't share them with your pet chicken. That's just mean.

[RegisteredAndEducated]

I know a couple of women and a few girls who have gotten abortions. Not ONE of them would do it again if they were faced with that decision again. I know alot of women who went ahead and had the kids that they were pregnant with. The greatest enjoyment that they've ever experienced were when they saw their kids for the first time. When they saw them walk for the first time. When they hear "I love you momma." Greatest moments of their lives. Think about that.

[RegisteredAndEducated]

Ok... off the mushy side. Abortion is most definately murder. This guy should be hanged. He forced abortion on the baby. Women do this all the time, and they should also all be hanged. Even the ones that feel bad about it. Even the ones that regret it. Sounds harsh? So does murder.

[ImWithStupid]

In reality, I too, have had several close, female friends who have had abortions, based on life's convenience. Every one of them, later in life, when they had children, regretted their "choice" when they were young.

 

More then one, needed several years of therapy to realize that was the root cause of their issue, whether it be depression or ptsd or whatever. I also noticed that the ones who had the most problems later, were the ones who were pressured into having an abortion by either the baby's daddy or their own parents.

[timesjoke]

I feel the same way.

 

I don't think I would ever personally be able to have an abortion, but then again I don't think anyone has the right to dictate what women want to do with their own bodies.

 

The woman did have a choice of what she does with her body when she agreed to have risky sex. She put her life in danger as well because if she gets pregnant, she could also be exposed to many diseases.

 

An abortion is nothing more than a way for the woman to escape taking responsibility for the "choice" she already made but regretted later.

 

 

While a foetus is growing inside a woman, it belongs to her. I imagine that many men (and some women) don't want to hear that, and they don't want to accept it, so they fight to control it, but they need to learn that this is something that they are simply never going to be able to control.

 

As already stated, it took a man to create that life as well but women remove the man's rights to say what happens to something that is 1/2 his. It is his child, why should anyone have the right to kill a child?

 

Another point, why is a man held responsible for supporting a child if he has no say about it being killed? Kinda one sided right?

 

Women have the right to decide whether or not they want to put their body through carrying a baby, and I respect that right. Everyone else should learn to respect it, too.

 

Already covered, the woman already made the choice to have risky sex, her choice happened "before" the life was created.

 

Also, if women don't have access to clean, medical abortion facilities they'll resort to unclean backyard methods like coathangers and goodness knows what else, thus endangering their own lives.

 

So you want baby killings to be legal because the killers will put their own lives in danger to kill them????

 

Make it easier for killers to kill?

 

 

If men want to have an opinion on it, they should take action to stop other men raping women, underage girls, and even their own children. Untill all that kind of nasty inhumane behaviour stops happening, women need to have abortions legally available.

 

Most women who get abortions already have kids and have never been married.

 

Most abortions happen with women who used either no protection, or did not use it consistantly the moth they conceived.

 

 

Rape accounts for very few abortions so it is not even a real consideration, but it is used to deflect attention away from the real issue of women killing children for irresponsible reasons.

 

 

 

 

 

I know several women who had abortions and later had mental issues because of it. When a woman gets pregnant, her chemical balances go all over the place and the time pressures make it impossible for her to make a wise decision. The pressure is incredible and even a married couple will get scared.

 

Sometimes we need to protect people from themselves. A pregnant woman could qualify as being mentally imbalanced, so why allow her to make such drastic decisions when she is impared? We are simply creating a generation of women who believe abortion is nothing, killing a life is without meaning.

 

I saw a bumper sticker the other day, it read:

 

 

If you can read this,

Your mother did not abort you.

Maybe you should go give her a hug.

[Anna Perenna]

That's fine, but if I run into your car in a drunken romp, and the only thing that results, is you loose the baby, I shouldn't be charged with a crime.

 

Not even drunk driving?

 

Why should a baby be killed just because it's mother was irresponsible or it may "inconvenience" her?

 

Mother, mother, mother.

 

Why is it all about the mother's initial irresponsibility, and her subsequent responsibility to keep the baby?

 

Why is the onus (not to mention the blame) always on the mother - but it's the father's indignity if she chooses not to keep it?

 

What about the millions of men who want their girlfriends, wives, etc to have abortions? I'm sure the perpetrator in the article at hand isn't the only man on earth who hasn't wanted to be a father.

 

Abortion as a form of birth control (which is how it abortion is used the majority of the time) infuriates me.

 

If you aren't prepared to be a parent, then your best bet is to not have sex (because abstinence is the only 100% effective form of birth control.)

 

Great idea. You should start a campaign asking all men who aren't ready to be fathers to keep their dicks in their pants. I fully support you. I'll start a complementary campaign asking women to abstain.

 

Let's see how it goes.

 

I disagree. No one owns you, me, or anyone else. Slavery was abolished many years ago for good reason.

 

While it's inside her body, I think it belongs to her, and the law seems to agree with me. Like I said, people don't want to accept this very simple truth, but it's something that needs to be accepted.

 

Neither can I go for the belief that a foetus is not a human being. Do you really believe that a (+1 day old baby) is human, but a (-1 day old is not) ? This is just a self serving argument used by pro abortionists to excuse their behaviour.

 

I have personally never heard the argument that a foetus is not a "human being". I have heard that an early stage foetus is simply a lump of cells that cannot think or feel - therefore, it doesn't know what pain is, and has no concept of life/death.

 

I disagree with the rape scenario. It wasn't the child's fault. We have plenty of people looking to adopt children. But if going through the pregnancy or delivering the child is a threat to the womens life I could see abortion as an option.

 

Snafu, I understand your sympathy for the unborn child, but where is your sympathy for the mother who has been raped?

 

Why should she endure 9 more months of torture, carrying the baby of a rapist? Hasn't she been through enough?

 

Why should the man be expected to pay child support for 18 years then if he didn't want the child?

 

So, you don't support women who don't want children, but you do support men who want to be dead beat Dads? Geez.

 

This guy is going up for first degree murder. I simply don't understand the difference if the women does it. If she wants the child its murder. If she doesn't want the child its an inconvenience and can be aborted?

 

Obviously, the man tricked her body into aborting not one but two children. She had no idea it was happening, and nor did anyone else.

 

You can't compare the two situations with parity.

 

Why do women have abortions?

74% say having a baby would interfere with work, school, or other responsibilities.

73% say they cannot afford to have a child.

48% say they do not want to be a single parent, or have relationship problems with husband or partner.

Less than 2% say they became pregnant as a result of rape or incest.

 

Source: The Alan Guttmacher Institute, Perspective on Sexual & Reproductive Health, Sept. 2005

 

Again, the focus of the blame is on the mother. Where are all the fathers in this Alan Guttmacher Institute?

 

And who the is Alan Guttmacher?

 

People are upset at just over 3,000 soldiers being killed in Iraq since 2002. Where's the outrage over the 1.2 MILLION US babies that were killed in 2006 alone???

 

I'm more concerned about the innocent women and children who have been killed in Iraq since 2002. The headcount is also much higher than 3000 ...

 

Yes. Once a woman gets pregnant she has a responsibility to care for herself and that baby til it is delivered. Her choice (apart from rape- but snafu made an excellent argument for that) has already been made- when she decided to have sex.

 

So, once again, it's all about the mother, the mother, the mother.

 

Lucky her, she gets the responsibility and the blame - and the poor father gets to be the victim, no matter what her decision is.

 

But wait a minute, according to you guys, she shouldn't be allowed to have that decision, either.

 

Now, I also feel that the mans responsibility is equally as important- but

 

a woman has to acknowledge that she will have more at stake physically if she gets pregnant, thus she needs to consider her options before hand a little closer than the guy does.

 

THIS DOES NOT ABSOLVE THE MAN OF RESPONSIBILITY, but the next nine months of his physical life aren't going to be thrown in a bender for 15 minutes of "enjoyment."

 

Thanks for the token nod to the fact that women do have much more at stake physically (in fact it's about 100% more) but that does not mean that women should have to be more considerate sexually. Women have sex drives, just like men. Women are human, just like men. You can't place all the blame and all the (before and after) responsibility on women's shoulders, and all the aftermath martyrdom on men's shoulders. That's crap.

Unless you are willing to give women more, you shouldn't be allowed to expect more from them.

 

Another excellent point Snafu. I do not intend to pass judgment either, but I cannot believe that society feels it is ok to kill innocent babies and call it little more than a "choice."

 

Something to consider:

 

A man, Dr. Bernard Nathanson, coined the phrase "pro-choice".

 

An abortion is nothing more than a way for the woman to escape taking responsibility for the "choice" she already made but regretted later.

 

Care to prove that?

 

As already stated, it took a man to create that life as well but women remove the man's rights to say what happens to something that is 1/2 his. It is his child, why should anyone have the right to kill a child?

 

Well, apparently, it's only his child if he wants it.

 

Other than that, it's all the mother's responsibility, and of course, fault.

 

Another point, why is a man held responsible for supporting a child if he has no say about it being killed? Kinda one sided right?

 

Actually, nobody has proven that he has no say.

 

I personally believe that the final decision (if the two parents can't agree) should be given to the mother. That's all.

 

So you want baby killings to be legal because the killers will put their own lives in danger to kill them????

 

Make it easier for killers to kill?

 

As far as I'm aware, abortions are already legal, so why would I want what I've already got?

 

Stop making assumptions.

 

What I want is for pompous men to a) stop imposing double standards on women, and to b) stop being so hard on women in general.

 

They are being painted as cold blooded killers in this thread, which is seriously unfair.

 

Most women who get abortions already have kids and have never been married.

 

Most abortions happen with women who used either no protection, or did not use it consistantly the moth they conceived.

 

Where are you getting your statistics from?

 

And who are these women conceiving moths?

 

Rape accounts for very few abortions so it is not even a real consideration, but it is used to deflect attention away from the real issue of women killing children for irresponsible reasons.

 

Again, it's the focus is on women killing children. The men have absolutely nothing to do with the killing, right?

 

When a woman gets pregnant, her chemical balances go all over the place and the time pressures make it impossible for her to make a wise decision. The pressure is incredible and even a married couple will get scared.

 

Care to prove that?

 

Sometimes we need to protect people from themselves. A pregnant woman could qualify as being mentally imbalanced, so why allow her to make such drastic decisions when she is impared?

 

You are arrogant, offensive, and clearly unqualified to make a claim like this.

 

Also, please learn how to spell "impaired" if you want me to believe you are qualified to make an opinion on impairment.

 

We are simply creating a generation of women who believe abortion is nothing, killing a life is without meaning.

 

Again, care the prove this?

 

I saw a bumper sticker the other day, it read:

 

If you can read this,

Your mother did not abort you.

Maybe you should go give her a hug.

 

But don't hug your father?

 

I think the bearer of that sticker should go f k a crucifix.

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

Originally Posted by sheik-yerbouti

I disagree. No one owns you, me, or anyone else. Slavery was abolished many years ago for good reason.

 

Anna :While it's inside her body, I think it belongs to her, and the law seems to agree with me. Like I said, people don't want to accept this very simple truth, but it's something that needs to be accepted.

 

I disagree, the unborn child does not belong to the woman. No one belongs to anyone- thats called slavery. You do not have a right to treat your imaginary slave anyway you like.

 

I dont care what the politicians/feminist lobby groups have determined to be the law. The law is an ass. Murder is murder.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheik-yerbouti

Neither can I go for the belief that a foetus is not a human being. Do you really believe that a (+1 day old baby) is human, but a (-1 day old is not) ? This is just a self serving argument used by pro abortionists to excuse their behaviour.

 

I have personally never heard the argument that a foetus is not a "human being". I have heard that an early stage foetus is simply a lump of cells that cannot think or feel - therefore, it doesn't know what pain is, and has no concept of life/death.

 

But that is exactly what your argument is. You beleive that the unborn child is not human, therefore is perfectly alright to murder the child.

 

All animal lifeforms begin as a few cells, that does not detract from what those cells are - a growing baby.

 

I matters not if the baby has no concept of thought, fear, pain or feeling, You are steering yourself away from the truth you do not wish to confront. The simple truth is that an unborn child is a human being, and should not be murdered at anyone's convenience.

[RegisteredAndEducated]

What you're not getting her Anna, is that we're blaming everyone equally. If you see "so abortion is OK, but a man not wanting a child makes him a deadbeat" somewhere... We're trying to point out the ironic nature of the whole situation. A woman can claim "it's my body, it's my right to abort if I want to" but if a guy says "I don't want that child" he has to pay child support for 18 years of the kid's life. I still think he's an ass, but why should she get a 'free pass' as it were? You see the point? Or are you too blinded by the feminist garbage you've been spouting?

[wez]

What you're not getting her Anna, is that we're blaming everyone equally. If you see "so abortion is OK, but a man not wanting a child makes him a deadbeat" somewhere... We're trying to point out the ironic nature of the whole situation. A woman can claim "it's my body, it's my right to abort if I want to" but if a guy says "I don't want that child" he has to pay child support for 18 years of the kid's life. I still think he's an ass, but why should she get a 'free pass' as it were? You see the point? Or are you too blinded by the feminist garbage you've been spouting?

 

 

 

Perhaps if you grew and sh t out a 10# sack of potatoes in your body you could put yourself on equal footing when it comes to childbirth..

 

Don't forget, you'll be expected to nurture and love those taters every minute of every day for at least 18 years because of the bond you'd feel by growing them in your body .. Take a look at history.. Men cannot understand what they cannot experience firsthand.

 

 

A women who wants a child can be artificially inseminated, they don't need our muscles and might = right theory anymore.. Better wake up.