Bible Prophecy & The Scientfic Method

[Phantom]

I do agree. The evidence seems to point to one primordial faith that was later distorted through geography and time.

[timesjoke]

Let me ask you this: If all roads point to the same God, what was the purpose of Jesus having to be crucified? Remember His plea in the garden immediately before His arrest- Is there any other way?

 

 

Well taking the idea that God is all powerful and capable of spreading the same mesage to the world in it's entirity, not just a very tiny speck of it, I have to believe the isolated event was on purpose and intended for the people involved, possibly even more but clearly not everyone because everyone was not involved in anything like this. If you consider it closely, not even 1% of the worlds population was involved in these times and stories so why make assumptions on God's mission?

 

There was no other way for Jesus, just like there was no other way for Job, certain things are done for reasons only God can tryly explain, and maybe not even then because we may not be able to see thing his way.

 

 

All I am saying is God must have a reason for not pressing this same faith in other areas, because he does not leave things to chance.

 

 

Think of this like a war, not all soldiers are given the same instructions or the same goals, or even the same battlefield, but all are just as important to the whole.

 

 

edit to respond to eddo

 

Great post eddo and that is my intention by saying most faiths are serving the same God, man has done nothing perfect, no reason to expect designing a religion that is perfect would have any different result than anything else. My view even goes beyone the standard faiths you mentioned though, as I said just now, different soldiers for different tasks, all serving the same top leader.

[Guest Fullauto]

my thoughts on that:

 

Jehova, god, allah, buddha, zeus, etc- were all originally the same deity- if in nothing else than in mans desire to know his creator. Man, somewhere along the way, decided that the way joe schmoe down the street was worshiping was wrong, so he changed it. Over and over and over. Now, i don't believe they are all correct pathways to that one god, but i do believe that the different religions are all trying to get to that one true god. Man screwed up the way to god, and in turn made things a whole lot harder than they need to be.

 

 

Some like to use different belief structures that have common beliefs as an example of faiths stealing form one another (for example, more than just christianity/judaism have stories of great floods, virgin births, and others.) to me, this points, not to a discrepancy in belief structure, but a branching off somewhere along the way. And to me, it adds credibility to the faith i hold to.

 

read zacharia sitchin ! ! !

[Phantom]

Oh come on. Sitchen is a debunked tard.

[Guest Fullauto]

Oh come on. Sitchen is a debunked tard.

 

of course you know, this means war!

[Phantom]

of course you know, this means war!

 

Oh that reminds me. I did some research on those Egyptian hieroglyphics that allegedly depict a helicopter, space craft, submarine, etc.

[wez]

That is an excellent ideal, but very wrong.

 

Those that follow Christ (Christians) don't become perfect because they follow Christ. They still live in a fallen world. They still struggle with sin. They still struggle with issues in their lives, just like non-Christians do.

 

The difference is that us real Christians have a God that they know loves them, even though they screw up. They have a God that is willing toforgive, forget and help them move on.

 

This thought that "Real Christians aren't liars and hypocrites" is why many don't trust church, and why Religion is so wrong.

 

People go to church, see churchgoers in church, and then see those same churchgoers out in the world messing up. "Oh no, that church can't be real! It's got sinners in it!" Do people avoid hospitals because sick people are there? No, they go there to get better. The church is much the same way. It isn't for perfect people, it's for people trying to "get better."

 

Religion (capital R) says that it's followers must be perfect. It's leaders must be flawless. This has everyone more concerned about everyone else's issues rather than their own. When someone falls, it casts a horrible light on everything- because perfection has been preached and expected.

 

But God knows that because of our free will, we will make stupid decisions, and He made a way for us to be cleansed from our screwups. But this hardly means that we won't still struggle, or at times fail.

 

Real Christians realize they are sinners, and choose to allow God to forgive them- and help them move forward. Perfection is an admirable goal (and one all Christians should be striving for, since Jesus was perfect) but understanding that none of us are there yet is very important.

 

 

It'd be nice to believe that eddo.. but aren't there passages that specifically talk about serving men or God? Money or God? Enduring til the end? Being hated by men and the world? Seeing like a child? The narrow over the broad road? The many who search, and the few who find it? No one is born a liar and hypocrite..

 

Remember when you were young? You shone like the Sun ~ Pink Floyd

[eddo]

It'd be nice to believe that eddo.. but aren't there passages that specifically talk about serving men or God? Money or God? Enduring til the end? Being hated by men and the world? Seeing like a child? The narrow over the broad road? The many who search, and the few who find it? No one is born a liar and hypocrite..

 

Remember when you were young? You shone like the Sun ~ Pink Floyd

 

Having a life goal of Serving God, as opposed to money or man, doesn't mean we will accomplish this without fail- because we are human. Humans screw up. They Bible tells us how we should live, as Christians, but it also reminds us that "All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." This word "all" means everyone. Me, you, Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Einstein, everyone. But Jesus was different. He was born of a virgin, so as to not have a human father's sinful bloodline. This made it possible for Him to be the perfect blood sacrifice that God needed (because of an Old Testament covenant made with Abraham) to make atonement for those sins of "all." God knew we needed this, so He made a way. If perfection was attainable, why the need to send Jesus? Why the need for the cross?

 

 

As for the "no one is born a liar and hypocrite..," while this is technically true, as a society we do a rather good job of indoctrinating our children into the world (the same world the rest of us live in) of lies and hypocrisy. Why? Because we make stupid decisions apart from the will of God.

 

 

 

 

"Stop your rhyming! I mean it!"

 

"Anybody want a peanut?" ~ Princess Bride </random quote>

[Phantom]

Wez are you a Christian?

[wez]

Wez are you a Christian?

 

 

Well, I've never been to church in my life and never picked up a bible til I was 35.. But loved it when I did.. It seemed like things I already knew and was born with..

 

 

I was always guided by.. whatever is ok for me to do to another human being, is ok for every other human being to do to me.. anything other than that can only be backed up by hypocrisy.. so I made decisions accordingly and stood against hypocrisy wherever I saw it no matter who it was or who was watching.. Not rocket science. I must have actually thought out the golden rule somewhere along the line when I was a kid, and knew it to be true.

 

 

I don't think I'd ever call myself a Christian.. I despise labels.. they exclude people from me, and vice versa. I'm wez.

[wez]

Having a life goal of Serving God, as opposed to money or man, doesn't mean we will accomplish this without fail- because we are human. Humans screw up. They Bible tells us how we should live, as Christians, but it also reminds us that "All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." This word "all" means everyone. Me, you, Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Einstein, everyone. But Jesus was different. He was born of a virgin, so as to not have a human father's sinful bloodline. This made it possible for Him to be the perfect blood sacrifice that God needed (because of an Old Testament covenant made with Abraham) to make atonement for those sins of "all." God knew we needed this, so He made a way. If perfection was attainable, why the need to send Jesus? Why the need for the cross?

 

 

As for the "no one is born a liar and hypocrite..," while this is technically true, as a society we do a rather good job of indoctrinating our children into the world (the same world the rest of us live in) of lies and hypocrisy. Why? Because we make stupid decisions apart from the will of God.

 

 

 

 

"Stop your rhyming! I mean it!"

 

"Anybody want a peanut?" ~ Princess Bride </random quote>

 

 

Why didn't God just make everyone and everything the way God wanted it the first time around? So if this is a test.. going against the will of God would be failure, correct?

 

 

I will execute great vengeance on them with wrathful rebukes; and they will know that I am the LORD when I lay My vengeance on them ~ Ezekial 25:17

 

Lay his vengence on who and for what?

[Phantom]

I don't think I'd ever call myself a Christian.. I despise labels.. they exclude people from me, and vice versa. I'm wez.

 

Have you accepted Jesus as your savior?

[wez]

Have you accepted Jesus as your savior?

 

The day I was born..

[eddo]

Why didn't God just make everyone and everything the way God wanted it the first time around? So if this is a test.. going against the will of God would be failure, correct?

 

 

I will execute great vengeance on them with wrathful rebukes; and they will know that I am the LORD when I lay My vengeance on them ~ Ezekial 25:17

 

Lay his vengence on who and for what?

 

God did make everyone and everything the way He wanted it. We (read: humanity) screwed it up. He gave us 10 simple rules to follow, and we turned them into over 300 laws that tried to dictate our path to Him through following lists and rules and other things that took away from the original idea- and made one which no one could maintain perfection of, and that there was no other way to know God.

 

So He had another idea. Jesus paying the price for us, so we were no longer bound by the letter of the law. now it became about grace, about love, about mercy. Perfection was no longer necessary, because grace forgives our wrongdoings. Love accepts us as we are. Mercy gives us another chance. Sure, going against the will of God is failure (read: sin) but He has already made a way to get past that.

 

I don't view life as a test, as much as I do an experience. Sure we face tests and trials, and how we react to them is important. To we turn to God for help, strength, and/or guidance? Or do we try to do it on our own? Trusting God builds an amazing relationship with Him, and that my friend, is the narrow road that the Bible is talking about that many don't travel. Taking the time to get to know God, know his character, His call on our lives, is not easy, and many struggle with it. But it is worth it.

 

 

Have you accepted Jesus as your savior?

 

The day I was born..

 

Can you explain what you mean by that wez?

[wez]

God did make everyone and everything the way He wanted it. We (read: humanity) screwed it up. He gave us 10 simple rules to follow, and we turned them into over 300 laws that tried to dictate our path to Him through following lists and rules and other things that took away from the original idea- and made one which no one could maintain perfection of, and that there was no other way to know God.

 

So He had another idea. Jesus paying the price for us, so we were no longer bound by the letter of the law. now it became about grace, about love, about mercy. Perfection was no longer necessary, because grace forgives our wrongdoings. Love accepts us as we are. Mercy gives us another chance. Sure, going against the will of God is failure (read: sin) but He has already made a way to get past that.

 

I don't view life as a test, as much as I do an experience. Sure we face tests and trials, and how we react to them is important. To we turn to God for help, strength, and/or guidance? Or do we try to do it on our own? Trusting God builds an amazing relationship with Him, and that my friend, is the narrow road that the Bible is talking about that many don't travel. Taking the time to get to know God, know his character, His call on our lives, is not easy, and many struggle with it. But it is worth it.

 

 

 

 

Can you explain what you mean by that wez?

 

 

The things Jesus talked about are the things I was born with and fought for and held onto for dear life against a hostile world without even knowing why at the time.. Now I know why.

 

 

So why would men and the world hate you for that? You sure the narrow road isn't something else?

[eddo]

The things Jesus talked about are the things I was born with and fought for and held onto for dear life against a hostile world without even knowing why at the time.. Now I know why.

 

 

So why would men and the world hate you for that? You sure the narrow road isn't something else?

 

The world is mostly at odds with what Jesus taught, and if you know what He said as you say you do, then you should know that already:

 

Jesus taught about putting others before you. Man and the world teach "Me first"

 

Jesus taught that restraint was god. Man and the world teaches "Do what ever you want, as long as it makes you feel goo, it's ok."

 

Jesus taught patience. Man and the world teach instant gratification.

 

Jesus taught selflessness. Man and the world thrive on selfishness.

 

The world hates the teachings of Jesus, because they aren't self serving.

[snafu]

We all gotta go and if we won the lottery of life, why can't we win the lottery of life after? Just pondering.

 

http://Off Topic Forum.com/off-topic-bs/58-we-need-a-lyrics-post-74.html#post69753

[Phantom]

101 Last Days Prophecies.

[wez]

Interesting stuff Aer..

 

 

I like this.. too true.. too true..

 

Men would sear their conscience so they could continue in sin (1 Timothy 4:2). The conscience is where God reveals right and wrong. Con means with and science means knowledge. Therefore we sin with knowledge when we ignore God's moral law and violate our own conscience.

 

we obviously have it for a reason.. Where did it come from? Accident? I don't think so.. emotions may just be chemical impulses physically but the results of them.. unreal.

 

They are our guide.. a gift from God.. or whatever else you want to call our creator..

 

To deny to myself and others.. any of them.. is quite foolish. I feel something for a reason and with some effort can always figure out why..

 

So why then, are we as children basically forced to deny them? They don't go away, but go inwards and fester til the point where many get lost and can no longer sort them.. sad state of affairs.

 

The worst part is children are not yet self equipped to deal with them.. they need the guide of elders who tell the truth.. the good, the bad, and the ugly.. Tough to rediscover as an adult.. and quite painful. But well worth it..

 

There are no bad emotions, contrary to popular belief..

 

I've even heard one genius tell me with pride.. "I could kill you without a shred of emotion, like cutting away a cancer".. yay him..

 

That's nothin' to be proud of, Rusty ~ Clark W. Griswold

[jokersarewild]

Actually, con as a prefix can also mean "against", which would mean "against science", which would mean we use emotion as opposed to logic. Anyway...

 

In that link you posted, Phantom...

 

The first two are obvious to any intelligent being who believes what they're doing is gonna be big. Not a prophecy as much as an intelligent guess.

 

Same with three, really. This is a "Let's think big" type scenario.

 

With 4, you have to remember something: The "world" as they knew it back then was essentially a small chunk of the middle east. It's the same thing with ye olde Flood. They say "OMG the whole world was covered in water", but really, they had no way of knowing about the "whole world" yet.

 

With 5, it's just "blah blah everyone dies in the end times because of others." Well, you can't tell me we JUST NOW discovered the ability to massively slaughter large groups of people until the world was empty of people. Let's see...let's start even with the invention of the gun. Or, hell, industrialization. Make more guns and more bullets. So we've been waiting since like...the 1400s or so for this to happen? Ok...

 

6 states basically (in the text on the site) that we now have bombs that dissolve stuff. And that such was unimaginable back in Zechariah's day. However, what they don't tell you is that, if you read from Zech 14:1 on, it's actually God saying "Well, whatever nations decide to attack Jerusalem are going to feel my wrath." Um, considering the power of God, I'd think such things weren't unimaginable. Since he, you know, imagined it.

 

With 7, what they fail to examine is that there have always been hippies and cries for peace. There just hasn't quite been the population there is now. And really, your average citizen doesn't give two s about peace with other countries. Sure, they may have an opinion , but that doesn't mean they actually care about it.

 

 

 

More later. My internet keeps ting out on me

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

Although there are literally hundreds of fulfilled Bible prophecies

Enjoy!

 

I'm not at all surprised that there are "hundreds of fulfilled bible prophecies". Neither am I surprised that Nostradamus "saw" the future.

 

Its easy enough with romantic idiots to hand throughout the centuries, doing everything they can to convince fools that their business (religion) is the thing to buy into.

 

They rewrite the history books post event, and other times "favourably" interpret the prophecy.

 

I'm amazed that anyone believes this crap. There are no sky-faeries.

[Phantom]

II'm amazed that anyone believes this crap. There are no sky-faeries.

 

I agree. There are no sky fairies. However, there is a God and He is the God of the Bible.

[Guest sheik-yerbouti]

I agree. There are no sky fairies. However, there is a God and He is the God of the Bible.

 

Well okay, no end of Christians go to Lourdes and other "holy ! " places. They say that god has answered their prayers, and cured them.

 

So what has god got against amputees ?

 

I'm still waiting for landmine casualties to get their prayers answered ! This would be definitive proof would it not?

 

It'll never happen. So now you need to come up with some convincing bull, like maybe the one thing they truly want, is the thing they dont pray to their sky faerie for.

 

But you'll never agree, they probably did pray to your god, but s/he wont do any miracles for them. How very convenient. Much more plausible is this - s/he wont, because s/he does not exist.

 

Your faeries,gods, goblins and pixies dont have any magick. Thats because they dont exist.

 

I dont mind you believing it, because it helps you in some way. I only mind that this crap is forced into little minds at school/church etc.

 

I see no difference between theology, nazism, or Stalinism. It,s all brainwashing of the masses.

[Phantom]

So what has god got against amputees ?

 

I just finished something like a 10 page debate on this on another forum. lol I have personally only known of one amputee that was healed (he lost one of his arms from the elbow down in a gas explosion) and that is the only case that matters to me because I do not accept hearsay stories. So they do get healed. God doesn't promise or guarantee perfection in these temporary bodies but we are promised perfection in our heavenly bodies. As for other amputees who pray and are not answered, I would need to hear from them personally.

 

Your faeries,gods, goblins and pixies dont have any magick. Thats because they dont exist.

 

Again, I don't believe in fairies, goblins, pixes, magic, or even 'gods.' I only believe in God (Jehovah) because He is the only one who has validated His existence to me.

 

I dont mind you believing it, because it helps you in some way.

 

That is somewhat of a misconception. Although some use their faith as a crutch and comfort, in some cases walking the walk only makes things more challenging because it requires a denial of the self. My faith is not a crutch but a way of life. Yes it does bring me comfort but not in the sense of hope. It brings me comfort in the sense of knowledge because knowledge is what led me to accept Jesus.

 

I only mind that this crap is forced into little minds at school/church etc.

 

On this I agree. I am an ardent advocate of separation of church and state. The majority religion might be in my favor today but it might not be in a decade from now. Should I then be forced to pray to Allah or a universal one-world deity? I couldn't. Therefore, church and state separation for me all the way. Not to mention I want the government to keep their nose out of my church. Separation of church and state works both ways.

 

I see no difference between theology, nazism, or Stalinism. It,s all brainwashing of the masses.

 

And I see no difference between atheism, Nazism, and Stalinism. It's all just brainwashing of the masses. Not to mention, much more deadly.

[snafu]

I just finished something like a 10 page debate on this on another forum. lol I have personally only known of one amputee that was healed (he lost one of his arms from the elbow down in a gas explosion) and that is the only case that matters to me because I do not accept hearsay stories. So they do get healed. God doesn't promise or guarantee perfection in these temporary bodies but we are promised perfection in our heavenly bodies. As for other amputees who pray and are not answered, I would need to hear from them personally.

 

 

 

.

 

He grew his arm back?