Guest FromTheRafters Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 Steve covered the scenario from the "bad site" authors point of view - he wants you to visit his site for whatever reason. Alun covered the scenario from the "denial of service" authors point of view - all he wants is to either keep you from visiting the correct site, or use DNS poisoning to generate excess traffic to some other site for whatever reason. "~BD~" <~BD~@nospam.invalid> wrote in message news:%23nMuXYaCJHA.5656@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...<span style="color:blue"> > Might this be relevant here too? > > http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080827/D92QSA880.html > > Dave > -- > > > </span> Quote
Guest FromTheRafters Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:6A3A0C3E-E465-4657-94FA-8C62DEE9DCB9@microsoft.com...<span style="color:blue"> > What Paul does not realize and if he followed US-Cert proper procedure and > doxpara website and the Sans Storm Center then he would realize that DNS > Pollution is and was a huge problem.</span> It can be a problem, agreed. <span style="color:blue"> > The technology industry is mainly in > denial about Chris Cquirke, mvp's research</span> Which of Chris' ideas are you referring to here? <span style="color:blue"> > and now Dan K's research with DNS Pollution</span> It looks like you jumped tracks here - are we talking about Chris Q or Dan K? <span style="color:blue"> > and the biggest reason this is such a big problem is the NT source > code that has been leaked out over the Internet in the past and is solid > external defense but has no true internal safety like DOS (Disk Operating > System).</span> None of this has anything to do with source code leaks. The basic groundwork for the internet was laid out when trust was inherent in the network. All connected computers were going to be well behaved - there was no need to build any authentication into the basic protocols. In hindsight, that was not a good decision, but how were the pioneers to know that untrustworthy computers would be connected and trying to break software at every chance? Back then, most everyone was just trying to make good use of the new technology of computering. Now we have miscreants showing how easily things break. <span style="color:blue"> > The majority of people here are indeed smart but they have followed > their senses and bought the company line hook line and sinker and did not > go > far enough and ask why the individual operating systems cannot be made > safer > on the inside</span> They are being made safer. Some are geared more toward ease of use and security takes a back seat. <span style="color:blue"> > and what is the use of all this external security that will > indeed crumble if there is no internal safety</span> Externals are needed because some malware "lives" external to the desktop OS. <span style="color:blue"> > of Disk Operating System or an equivalent</span> It's been a long time since I have seen an OS that wasn't a Disk OS. Are you referring to MS-DOS or DR-DOS or any other specific DOS? <span style="color:blue"> > and all users are left with is a cheap command.com interface that > may be satisfactory for many but sucks for the individual home consumers > who > I represent.</span> Lost without a GUI? The idea Chris is talking about with respect to DOS as a maintenance OS is that newer OSes don't have a fallback simple Disk OS that you can use for troubleshooting or possible recovery. The "recovery console" falls short of what would be needed for some kinds of revovery - not because of the lack of GUI, but because of the lack of available functions. <span style="color:blue"> > Sure, the price of having two lines of source code is expensive</span> Huh? Two lines of source code is not a very big program. A virus can be written in one. style_emoticons/) <span style="color:blue"> > but how does one company have the right to say which line of source code > is > superior and if it is so superior how come we suddenly are having so many > problems with security.</span> It's their code - they can say whatever they want to about it. From your perspective (the average user it seems) "problems" with security means "access denied" messages when all you want to do is look at your own photos, on your own computer. This is actually increased security over the older OSes that had no file system security at all. It is just one example of how an increase in security negatively effects the "ease of use" experience. <span style="color:blue"> > It is an easy concept because if you want all your > computers linked as one and one gets a virus then all the others can share > that virus and sicken too.</span> It appears to me that you have jumped tracks again. What concept? Are you talking about diversity in OSes on the net? Sure, it is a good thing - but there is still plenty of "sameness" out there for malware to survive. <span style="color:blue"> > Now, remember if we backtrack and have each > computer become a unique individual that creates and learns without the > need > of the collective then we are making progress.</span> Stay in the real world, please. <span style="color:blue"> > Do we really need computers > to become like the Borg where all the computers are connected to one super > computer. Why not let man and womankinds creativity flow from each > machine > and not have to be so reliant upon the others that the machine can not do > anything without checking what machines b,c,d,e, and f are doing before > the > machine is even confident enough to proceed.</span> Because that is how it works, cooperation between systems - each performing its function for the benefit of the whole. To resist is futile (sorry - couldn't help myself) - seriously, it is necessary in order to coordinate the communications link. <span style="color:blue"> > I am purposely stretching the > truth and exagerrating but I am making a point on how the entire industry > went wrong when the wrong source code was chosen.</span> No, what went wrong was that we became too entrenched and dependent on what was already in place by the time we realized it could have been designed better for security. We have applied bandages and chewing gum to keep the system viable in an increasingly hostile environment when a rewrite was really needed. Rewrite was out of the question because we needed no interuption in the operation. Another (new) network could be built with security in mind and populated by new pioneers - when enough bugs are worked out businesses could migrate to the new paradigm without disruption. Sorry - maybe is sci-fi too. <span style="color:blue"> > The only real solution is > for Microsoft to bring the new source code to the market that is > internally > safe with a maintenance operating system and also externally secure.</span> Microsoft has nothing to do with it. They didn't create the underlying structure that is the internet - and that is the issue here. <span style="color:blue"> > "~BD~" wrote: ><span style="color:green"> >> You're welcome, Dan. >> >> For the most part, I understand your posts - all of them!</span></span> Can I borrow your decoder ring? style_emoticons// <span style="color:blue"><span style="color:green"> >> Stick with it! style_emoticons/ >> >> Dave >> >> -- >> "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >> news:FA0EE75A-8851-4F30-99E7-C763FFC05BFC@microsoft.com...<span style="color:darkred"> >> > <Warning Long Story --- mainly for Steve Riley {MSFT} benefit as well >> > as >> > anyone interested and caring enough not to give some smart aleck >> > response}:-> >> > >> > Thanks BD.</span> >> >> <snip> >> >> >> </span></span> Quote
Guest ~BD~ Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 Thank you for clarifying! style_emoticons/ Dave -- "FromTheRafters" <erratic@ne.rr.com> wrote in message news:OqDLTYjCJHA.2496@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...<span style="color:blue"> > Steve covered the scenario from the "bad site" authors point > of view - he wants you to visit his site for whatever reason. > > Alun covered the scenario from the "denial of service" authors > point of view - all he wants is to either keep you from visiting > the correct site, or use DNS poisoning to generate excess > traffic to some other site for whatever reason. > > "~BD~" <~BD~@nospam.invalid> wrote in message > news:%23nMuXYaCJHA.5656@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...<span style="color:green"> >> Might this be relevant here too? >> >> http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080827/D92QSA880.html >> >> Dave >> -- >> >> >></span> > > > </span> Quote
Guest ~BD~ Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 "FromTheRafters" <erratic@ne.rr.com> wrote in message news:%234SOjHkCJHA.4704@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... Said "Can I borrow your decoder ring?" style_emoticons// You have done an excelent job without it! I'd like to thank you for taking the time and trouble to answer Dan in the manner you did. I'm fairly sure he will not wish to argue with you. Thanks! style_emoticons/ Dave -- Quote
Guest Dan Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 I appreciate all the replies. My main objective has already been accomplished which is just to get people to think about external security and internal safety of 2 different source codes which are the NT source code which is in use today and the 9x source code of yesterday. Thank you for all of your feedback. I will continue to review it and answer as best as I can. "~BD~" wrote: <span style="color:blue"> > > "FromTheRafters" <erratic@ne.rr.com> wrote in message > news:%234SOjHkCJHA.4704@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... > > Said "Can I borrow your decoder ring?" style_emoticons// > > You have done an excelent job without it! > > I'd like to thank you for taking the time and trouble to answer Dan in the > manner you did. I'm fairly sure he will not wish to argue with you. Thanks! > style_emoticons/ > > Dave > > -- > > > </span> Quote
Guest Root Kit Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 00:57:00 -0700, Dan <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: <span style="color:blue"> >I appreciate all the replies. My main objective has already been >accomplished which is just to get people to think about external security and >internal safety of 2 different source codes which are the NT source code >which is in use today and the 9x source code of yesterday.</span> There is no reason to get people to think about some imaginary security topics that exist only in your head. You never had any objective. Quote
Guest Dan Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 Tra, la, la --- the b_nice person is back -- oh yeah, smiles "Root Kit" wrote: <span style="color:blue"> > On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 00:57:00 -0700, Dan > <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: > <span style="color:green"> > >I appreciate all the replies. My main objective has already been > >accomplished which is just to get people to think about external security and > >internal safety of 2 different source codes which are the NT source code > >which is in use today and the 9x source code of yesterday.</span> > > There is no reason to get people to think about some imaginary > security topics that exist only in your head. You never had any > objective. > </span> Quote
Guest Paul Adare - MVP Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 03:45:01 -0700, Dan wrote: <span style="color:blue"> > Tra, la, la --- the b_nice person is back -- oh yeah, smiles</span> You are mentally unbalanced. -- Paul Adare MVP - Identity Lifecycle Manager http://www.identit.ca Netnews is like yelling, "Anyone want to buy a used car?" in a crowded theater. Quote
Guest Dan Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 whatever, b_nice is a jerk "Paul Adare - MVP" wrote: <span style="color:blue"> > On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 03:45:01 -0700, Dan wrote: > <span style="color:green"> > > Tra, la, la --- the b_nice person is back -- oh yeah, smiles</span> > > You are mentally unbalanced. > > -- > Paul Adare > MVP - Identity Lifecycle Manager > http://www.identit.ca > Netnews is like yelling, "Anyone want to buy a used car?" in a crowded > theater. > </span> Quote
Guest ~BD~ Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 You, "Paul Adare - MVP", still haven't bothered to fix the error on your web site, viz:- Sign Up for ILM 2007 Certificate Management Training IdentIT is offering public training on ILM 2007 Certificate Management. The course covers the fundamentals of ILM 2007 Certificate Management and provides you with hands-on experience with the product before deploying ILM 2007 Certificate Management in your organization. The following dates have been booked for ILM 2007 Training: a.. Mississauga, Ontario, Canada - November 13 - 16, 2007 - Click here to register! b.. New York City, NY, USA - TBA For registration information, please send email to info@identit.c Dave -- Quote
Guest Paul Adare - MVP Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 20:27:12 +0100, ~BD~ wrote: <span style="color:blue"> > You, "Paul Adare - MVP", still haven't bothered to fix the error on your > web site, viz:-</span> The state of my web site has no bearing in this news group and is really not any of your concern. -- Paul Adare MVP - Identity Lifecycle Manager http://www.identit.ca Command: Statement presented by a human and accepted by a computer in such a manner as to make the human feel as if he is in control. Quote
Guest ~BD~ Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 "Paul Adare - MVP" <pkadare@gmail.com> wrote in message news:aqj9y2tbu91l$.16zxefuf7t9eb$.dlg@40tude.net...<span style="color:blue"> > On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 20:27:12 +0100, ~BD~ wrote: ><span style="color:green"> >> You, "Paul Adare - MVP", still haven't bothered to fix the error on >> your >> web site, viz:-</span> > > The state of my web site has no bearing in this news group and is really > not any of your concern. > > -- > Paul Adare > MVP - Identity Lifecycle Manager > http://www.identit.ca > Command: Statement presented by a human and accepted by a computer in > such > a manner as to make the human feel as if he is in control.</span> I beg to differ, Mr Adare. You publish your web site in your signature block. If you want no-one reading here to visit, I suggest you remove it. Having made such a visit, I brought the out-of-date information to your attention on a number of occasions. You ridicule Dan, yet purport to be a 'professional' yourself. How can you expect folk reading here to believe you when the very heart of your business, your web site, is not accurate? Think about it! Dave Quote
Guest Paul Adare - MVP Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 22:32:07 +0100, ~BD~ wrote: <span style="color:blue"> > Having made such a visit, I brought the out-of-date information to your > attention on a number of occasions.</span> Good for you, do you want a medal or something? I really could not care less what you happen to bring to my attention, it has no bearing on this news group, and unless you control 50,000 plus seats you're not even close to my target audience. -- Paul Adare MVP - Identity Lifecycle Manager http://www.identit.ca How was Thomas J. Watson buried? 9 edge down. Quote
Guest Paul Adare - MVP Posted August 30, 2008 Posted August 30, 2008 On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 22:32:07 +0100, ~BD~ wrote: <span style="color:blue"> > How can you > expect folk reading here to believe you when the very heart of your > business, your web site, is not accurate? Think about it!</span> My web site is not even close to the very heart of my business. So please, keep your posts on-topic and your useless little comments about my web site out of this news group. -- Paul Adare MVP - Identity Lifecycle Manager http://www.identit.ca Programming is an unnatural act. Quote
Guest Brian Komar \(MVP\) Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 Dave, I really do not appreciate your language. Our Web site may be out of date (my fault to be honest). But, it is not inaccurate. Please learn the meaning of the word inaccurate and get back to me. Jeesh..... Brian "~BD~" <~BD~@nospam.invalid> wrote in message news:eaCt1fuCJHA.4576@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...<span style="color:blue"> > > "Paul Adare - MVP" <pkadare@gmail.com> wrote in message > news:aqj9y2tbu91l$.16zxefuf7t9eb$.dlg@40tude.net...<span style="color:green"> >> On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 20:27:12 +0100, ~BD~ wrote: >><span style="color:darkred"> >>> You, "Paul Adare - MVP", still haven't bothered to fix the error on >>> your >>> web site, viz:-</span> >> >> The state of my web site has no bearing in this news group and is really >> not any of your concern. >> >> -- >> Paul Adare >> MVP - Identity Lifecycle Manager >> http://www.identit.ca >> Command: Statement presented by a human and accepted by a computer in >> such >> a manner as to make the human feel as if he is in control.</span> > > > I beg to differ, Mr Adare. > > You publish your web site in your signature block. If you want no-one > reading here to visit, I suggest you remove it. > > Having made such a visit, I brought the out-of-date information to your > attention on a number of occasions. > > You ridicule Dan, yet purport to be a 'professional' yourself. How can you > expect folk reading here to believe you when the very heart of your > business, your web site, is not accurate? Think about it! > > Dave > </span> Quote
Guest ~BD~ Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 Brian Perhaps you should refer to this page: http://www.answers.com/topic/accurate wher you will note that one meaning of accurate is "Having no errors". I note on this page of your web site http://www.identit.ca/clients.html that there is still no list of clients available for visitors to review. Out of interest, do you have anyone else working in your organisation or is it just you and Mr Adare? Dave -- "Brian Komar (MVP)" <brian.komar@nospam.identit.ca> wrote in message news:BD09D899-D229-4C98-AC44-0F3308D4D746@microsoft.com...<span style="color:blue"> > Dave, > I really do not appreciate your language. > Our Web site may be out of date (my fault to be honest). > But, it is not inaccurate. > Please learn the meaning of the word inaccurate and get back to me. > Jeesh..... > Brian</span> Quote
Guest Paul Adare - MVP Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 On Sun, 31 Aug 2008 08:21:45 +0100, ~BD~ wrote: <span style="color:blue"> > I note on this page of your web site http://www.identit.ca/clients.html that > there is still no list of clients available for visitors to review. > > Out of interest, do you have anyone else working in your organisation or is > it just you and Mr Adare?</span> This will be my last response on this topic. Stop wasting everyone's time here and get off this topic. This is not an appropriate place to discuss your opinion of our web site and as I've stated elsewhere in this thread, your opinion simply does not matter. The state of our web site has zero impact on our business and I'll thank you to stay on-topic in this news group and to keep your unwanted opinions to yourself. -- Paul Adare MVP - Identity Lifecycle Manager http://www.identit.ca GIGO: A movie industry acronym referring to the numerous "Gidget Goes..." movies, i.e. GIGO Hawaii, GIGO surfing, etc. Quote
Guest BoaterDave Posted August 31, 2008 Posted August 31, 2008 On Aug 31, 8:54�am, Paul Adare - MVP <pkad...@gmail.com> wrote:<span style="color:blue"> > On Sun, 31 Aug 2008 08:21:45 +0100, ~BD~ wrote:<span style="color:green"> > > I note on this page of your web sitehttp://www.identit.ca/clients.htmlthat > > there is still no list of clients available for visitors to review.</span> ><span style="color:green"> > > Out of interest, do you have anyone else working in your organisation or is > > it just you and Mr Adare?</span> > > This will be my last response on this topic. Stop wasting everyone's time > here and get off this topic. This is not an appropriate place to discuss > your opinion of our web site and as I've stated elsewhere in this thread, > your opinion simply does not matter. The state of our web site has zero > impact on our business and I'll thank you to stay on-topic in this news > group and to keep your unwanted opinions to yourself. > > -- > Paul Adare > MVP - Identity Lifecycle Managerhttp://www.identit.ca > GIGO: �A movie industry acronym referring to the numerous "Gidget Goes..." > movies, i.e. �GIGO Hawaii, GIGO surfing, etc.</span> Hmmmm! Some help needed here guys! You can see that Mr Adare's post was made Sun, 31 Aug 2008 08:21:45 +0100 As far as I can ascertain he lives in Canada. What time would it be in Canada when the post was made? Thanks Dave Quote
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