Darkness in the world

[JammerG]

I have had personal experience. My Brother-In-Law is Gay. He said he knew when he was 11 years old. When I first met him I asked his brother - my husband - was he gay. In those days Q (his name has been withheld for privacy reasons) was a young youth member of the Salvation Army in Australia. He had a girlfriend (Her name V) who was also in uniform in the Salvation Army. They broke up after being together for two years. V later told me it was because she wanted a man and Q wasn't one. he was funded to go to Russia to do some work there for 3 months and met another Aussie Girl, Z. She was in her final year of Psychology. They kept up their relationship for 6 months until he proposed to her. She told him to accept the facts and come out of the closet. that he was gay. It took a Psychologist to tell him it was ok. The Church didn't like it. Q was outcast from the church. Even his father disowned him. I brought the family back together. Q's father still prays that his son returns to normality. But My husband another Psychologist says he will never be a hetrosexual. He has been Homosexual since he was born. Q keeps looking for a long term partner, somone to settle down with.

 

But for Gay guys it is hard it is around one relationship in 15 that succeed.

 

They can't help it.

 

JammerG

[o0SugaxNxSpice0o]

Both Sniper and Twilight put in some good pointers. Great job guys lol! A formal debate. I was scared it'll turn into an insulting arguement and I wouldn't have liked that at all ^.^* You're both smart and you both made me THINK. As if I ever think lol.

 

I'm quite neutral on the subject myself. I can't say I've ever thought about turning gay and liking girls. I don't swing that way, I'm just not attracted to girls in a sexual way, so I don't really know why people do that. But it's their preferences and their sexuality. I don't know any gay people in real life, but a lot of online people claim that they're "bi". Too many people tell me they're bi, I'm starting to think it's a stupid trend with emo kids lol. *Shrugs*

 

These gay couples must REALLY love each other if they're willing to get married and go against what the bible (?) says, and what the society was brought up to believe in. I wouldn't really like it if I really wanted something badly, but there was a law that was stopping me from doing so. They feel strongly about it, and I really wouldn't want to be the person to stop that. Love is just love. As the cliche goes, you can't stop / change who you fall for.

 

I'm not really sure if I believe that people were just born gay. I don't really get that, do your genes tell you what sexuality you are? When your parents concieved you, did a mixture of their sexuality somehow made you gay? Did they use to have weird gay fetishes but supressed it and somehow it passed down to their kids lol? It's just weird to think that.

 

Anyway, I don't have a religion but my own, which I make up in my mind lol. So nothing can dictate to me what I can and can't believe in, but myself. I wasn't born with a religion, or brought up to believe in a specific thing, so my beliefs are kinda vague and varied. My parents just want me to be a good person. Which I am I hope lol.

 

Would you feel different about a person *Say your best friend for instance*, if they suddenly told you that they was gay? I'll be a bit shifty, and think that was really weird. But I know my best friend, and being gay doesn't really change who she is.

 

Oh also, I'm interested to know, why some guys are so homophobic against guy on guy action, yet they think 2 lesbians having at go at it is really "hott" lol?

 

One last thing LOL. It's interesting you guys brought up the animal stuff and the gay thing! A few weeks agos in the newspaper, and on newsround, a zoo had to import female penguins into the sanctuary because all the male penguins were gay, and they wanted the female ones to "distract" them and turn them straight again, so that they can produce babies lol. Needless to say, it caused a bit of controversy and some people were outraged and believed that if the penguins were gay, then let them be. In the end, the female penguins didn't help and the male penguins are "happy" together haha. It was kinda cute and amusing lol.

Apparantely, my english teacher *He's really weird I swear* claims that some animals are gay *He told us to watch the discovery channel o_0*. He even showed us some pictures of 2 male gorillas "humping" lol. It was seriously disturbing and he said he had others with other animals as proof. He found it completly funny but we didn't see that as you can probably guess =D

[lpunderground]

Selfish of me? Well I believe in Islam' date=' which is just like Christianity and Judaism, and they all say that being gay is ok. As long as you dont act on it. That is why I believe, if we prevent these people from doing their things, then we can save them, and we can make our communities a place where we would appreciate the next generations growing up. I cant believe that people are trying to break the sacred oath of marige. Well sacred to me anyways. I just hope my next generations dont have to suffer the consequences of seeing gay people out on the streets and stuff. If we accept them now, their population will grow. It will stop the production of children which has already declined and then we will all go to hell Again, this is my opinion and beliefs. And I tend to believe what I think is right because I mostly am right. Especially about these things. I mean, I say if you are gay, marry a normal spouse and then be gay in your mind, or go to a gay strip club. You dont have to be striaght to love someone of the opposite sex. But whatever. Close this thread if you would all want, I just wanted to state my concern for our societies.[/quote']

 

 

i respect ur oppion but who are you to tell whats right and whats wrong. i think it is a matter of the person at hand. If you truly love someone no matter what the sexual prefrence then you should be happy and go with it. i thinks its wrong for the goverment to sit on their ass and say we have freedoms and we have the right of this and that when they sit there and discriminate saying how they wont allow gay marriages in most of the states- if thats not bashing our rights as american citzens i dont know what it. land of the free my ass, its wrong to discriminate on the basis of if someone is gay or not. i respect ur relgion. who gives a shit if u see a guy and a girl kissing in a public place but god firbid seeing a gay couple wow taboo. so many people make gay slurs and jokes and its wrong. im sure people wouldnt like it if someone came up to them and made smart ass comments on their religion poking fun at the person. its the same thing and most of the time the people get it thrown in their face.

[LPGotLinkinPark]

For saying that people have never accepted being gay, that is not true. In the movie Troy, the director was trying to depict real life then. So Brad Pitt's cousin in the movie, was originally supposed to be his gay lover. It was too controversial, so they made him a cousin instead. Also, (though I did not see it) in Alexander, (once again trying to give an image of what it was like back then) Alexander the Great was gay. Or bi. I don't know. One of the two.

 

And animals being gay? How can you say that they are or they are not? Lots of dogs hump everything in site, so you can never really tell. And I do believe that some animals have feelings. I had a puppy once that got hit by a car a killed. So now, my other dog always protects my new dog from everything. My grandma's dog also loves his owners. When my great-grandmother broke ribs in her back, he heard he screaming in pain when my grandma tried helping her out of bed, so he went to defend her. Some animals do have feelings or emotions, not all though.

 

On religion, I am brought up Catholic. Though, we've never been extremely active and haven't gone to church for a year or two except on Christmas and Easter. I do have beliefs, but I never really learned what "our" beliefs were. I think homosexuality is not really excepted, but I do not have a problem with it. I wouldn't approve though.

 

One why people are gay. I can infact be a genetic code Jen. If it is, it was probably not passed down from parents. Most likely a genetic defect. Or in some people, it may be how they saw other people. I don't believe that though. People always say that if you see something, such as smoking, drinking, and homosexuality, you tend to want to try it. Not true. Only if you already had an intrest.

 

Well, that's all I got on the subject.

[LPGotLinkinPark]

i respect ur oppion but who are you to tell whats right and whats wrong. i think it is a matter of the person at hand. If you truly love someone no matter what the sexual prefrence then you should be happy and go with it. i thinks its wrong for the goverment to sit on their ass and say we have freedoms and we have the right of this and that when they sit there and discriminate saying how they wont allow gay marriages in most of the states- if thats not bashing our rights as american citzens i dont know what it. land of the free my ass' date=' its wrong to discriminate on the basis of if someone is gay or not. i respect ur relgion. who gives a shit if u see a guy and a girl kissing in a public place but god firbid seeing a gay couple wow taboo. so many people make gay slurs and jokes and its wrong. im sure people wouldnt like it if someone came up to them and made smart ass comments on their religion poking fun at the person. its the same thing and most of the time the people get it thrown in their face.[/quote']

 

You can still love someone in a non-sexual way though. This is done all the time in best friend love, family love, etc. And also, marriage is defined both religiously and legally. By most religions, it's a bonding between a MAN and a WOMAN. The legal part of it is based on the religious part. So therefore, that is why the government decided that marriage was to be between a MAN and a WOMAN.

[lpunderground]

GotLinkinPark?']You can still love someone in a non-sexual way though. This is done all the time in best friend love' date=' family love, etc. And also, marriage is defined both religiously and legally. By most religions, it's a bonding between a MAN and a WOMAN. The legal part of it is based on the religious part. So therefore, that is why the government decided that marriage was to be between a MAN and a WOMAN.[/quote']

 

but thats dicsrimination. the Untied states is supposed to give us freedoms and thats taking away the freedoms of someone who is human too and feels emotion.

[LPGotLinkinPark]

It's not discrimination, it's following the law. The law is that marriage is defined as between a man and a woman. If you say that is discrimination, wouldn't locking away a mass murderer be discrimination also?

[ImTheOneThatFalls]

interesting......ha newsday everyday newsday everyday

[lpunderground]

GotLinkinPark?']It's not discrimination' date=' it's following the law. The law is that marriage is defined as between a man and a woman. If you say that is discrimination, wouldn't locking away a mass murderer be discrimination also?[/quote']

 

 

no a mass murder has done something wrong, gay ppl have done nothing wrong.

[LPGotLinkinPark]

Well, the laws are basicly based on the Ten Commandmants. Murdering was an exaggeration, but it's still a religious point of view on it. Thou shalt not kill. Or whatever. Now, I'm not a Bible/Jesus/Religion Freak, but I'm pretty sure that most religions do not accept homosexuality. So that's why the government decided to define marriage as only between a man and a woman. And another thing, homosexuality is just unnatural. It's not what nature intended. Having gay sex does nothing, no reproduction (which is the natural purpsoe for sex).

[SNiPeRViRuS]

Maybe you should continue on for me? You have a nutreal point of view while I am 150% enthusiastically conservative on it. I think you will be a better debater. I am going to watch, and occasionally make some points. You make me proud gotlinkinpark!

[LPGotLinkinPark]

Thanks. *feels special* I don't know, I just stand for what I believe in. I wasn't trying to hurt his/her feelings. Just saying what I think needs to be said. Also, I am glad this thread is an intelligent debate rather than stupid flames like before.

[twilightcrimson7]

I commend everyone who debated on here! I went to school thinking there'd be a few flames, or perhaps even a war while I was gone, and I was a bit skeptical, but you all made very execllent comments! Like Sniper, I'll take the back seat for a while, because I wanna see where this goes. I'll comment when i need to though. ^_^

[LPGotLinkinPark]

But lpunderground left so there's no one left to discuss with!!!

[twilightcrimson7]

Give it time. maybe some more people with different views will come talk here. I just wanna see everyone's reaction and dicuss it

[shirakawa_otori]

Well, this thread is really showing how we can discuss some delicate issues without flaming each other. It showed intelligent posts from each side of the argument, and it was a great thread to read, with good interventions.

About the topic now. I am not an American, but here the government doesn't allow gay marriages either. I think people should be free to do whatever they want in what comes to their affections. What belongs in our intimacy should not be object of focus to the government. Love is love, and it should be respected.

However, I came here to post about a couple of things. First, because there are theories that say it is not a choice, per se, to be gay or straight. Ok, so let's see. The basic model for the brain of a fetus is the female one (ok, I should explain this, but honestly, I talked about it in class, but I don't remember properly *blushes*). So between 6 or 8 weeks after conception, the male fetus (with the cromosomes X and Y) receives a massive dose of a male hormone called androgen, that ensures the formation of the testicles, and then he has to get a second dose of androgens, to modify the brain and make it go from female-mode to male-mode. When the male fetus does not get enough androgen this second time around, one of the outcomes is that the male baby can be born with a brain structure that has a predominant female type rather than male, and this baby male has more chance of becoming gay, when he reaches puberty. So basically this is a theory that homosexuality (well, in this case, male homosexuality) is a result of a defective hormone supplie, so to speak. Just thought I'd introduce this into the argument

Another thing, homosexuality is a very ancient thing. I see some people here already mentioned Troy and Alexander to say this. In the ancient Greek society, male homosexuality was normal. It's not a recent "trend". It's just that now, people's minds are opening up a bit more and more and more people are "coming out of the closet" (because after the Greeks and so, there were periods of great repression, it's not like there were no gays and now suddendly there's more and more, it's just that now they're not afraid to assume their homosexuality anymore).

Also, there is homosexual behaviors in the wild, the nature. Some animals display them. So it wouldn't be correct to say it is an un-natural behavior. It doesn't serve the purpose of sexual intercourse, that is to generate offsprings, but it does exist in the wild. If you investigate, you'll see this is true.

And also, like o0SugaxNxSpice0o said, why are some guys so totally homophobic in what concerns male homosexuality, but are so "amused" when there's a lesbian scene in a movie or something? lol :o

Sorry if this isn't too clear, but it's a bit late and I'm trying to do my best. Peace :thumbsup:

[SNiPeRViRuS]

Can I ask you something though? Why should people have to marry someone, just because that is who they are attracted to sexually? They can do society a favor by marrying the opposite sex. You can love both ways.

 

 

And, I dont really find it amusing, but it IS hot to see a lesbo couple. At least some people think. I dont.

[LPGotLinkinPark]

Even if that thing with the male hormone happened, that wouldn't necessarily make the person gay. There are plenty of straight guys that are just a little feminine. Also, is that defection common or not?

[cmlp]

Point blank, the law sux for them (it doesn't affect me,), our country sux, the president who came up with this sux, and the bible with the stupid "ya can't do this and ya can't do that." sux. I don't understand why others won't let people live life how they want it with who ever want's it. Not like same sex marriage is gonna kill anyone.

[SNiPeRViRuS]

How do you know killing someone is bad. From what you say, it sux that people cant do that. We should just let people live how they want, right? You contradict yourself severely.

[JammerG]

In a karmist view everything that goes around comes around... For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

In Death Birth and relationships the negative often breeds a negative, but there are times when a positive is born.

[LPGotLinkinPark]

Hmm....so what are you getting at? Can you speak non-metaphoricly?

[SNiPeRViRuS]

Probably not. But, at least it speaks in full english grammar.

[JammerG]

Probably not. But' date=' at least it speaks in full english grammar.[/quote']

 

Thanks Virus

 

If I spoke my mind on the subject I would either be called small minded or sick... or maybe even both.

 

Personally I think gay people are ok. But it is only because I have so many gay friends and family (Scary Man I tell you, when you enter a house and more than 60% prefer the same sex... Lucky I am female!!!) ... Unless I go visit the other Family where I try to look as asexual as possible...

 

I don't condone it. but having been hit with it personally, I try to stay out of it, but if you do bad shit it comes back to bite you on the ass, sometimes in a big way.

[lpunderground]

GotLinkinPark?']But lpunderground left so there's no one left to discuss with!!!

 

nah i didnt leave. i had school. and other things i needed to do. im back now.