Religion

[KillMeImIrish]

 

Does anyone else think its selfish to do what you believe in? I just don't see how. (1)People should makes their own decesions, not have a higher being or friend or anything/one decide for them. I also think that if you truely believe in something, you will die for it. If what you believe in could happen, but it would require you taking your life, would you do it? I myself am searching for a cause for which I can put my full belief and trust behind, along with my life.

 

"A man who won't die for something is not fit to live." - Martin Luther King Jr.

 

I was watching the Discovery Channel yesterday, and they had a special thing about Jesus.(2) History shows that the odds were Jesus wasn't born in a manger, and that he wasn't surronded by strangers. Also there is no way he was born in December, the Palestin winter at night create incredibly cold tempertures. I just thought this was interesting, not trying to diss Christianity

 

1. you're very right: people should make their own decisions. and God allows us too. as i said in an earlier post, God allows free choice. the only thing he has ANYTHING to do with our decision is guiding them. that's why the Bible is there. to HELP us make the right decision. hmm. it kind of tells us the right decision, and allows us to make it or not.

 

2. that's the problem- "history says this.." who cares about history? yeah, it might have better facts than us "christians" who go off of "a book." have faith, and that's all you need. like i said before, if we're wrong.. we'll just decinigrate (sp.. shut it) like everyone says we will.. but if we're right, we'll be in paradise, and you won't be. ("you" meaning the general people on here who are against and/or just don't care about christianity.)

[Fort_Underground]

^ I thought Christanity only preached heaven and hell, not paradise. Thats what the Muslimes believe. I don't think that Christanity is right, I don't think any religion is the "true" religion. I think religion is just something people find comfort and understanding in. Humans like to have guidance, and religion is a great way to find it for us. Also, we all disingrate Irish. But I don't want to be buried, the thought of people standing over my body as the put flower 6 feet abover my corpse doesn't appeal to me. I'd rather be creamted or have one of those abover ground houses that people put bodies in ( Dont know the name ).

 

But lets say your right Irish, lets say all good Christians go to heaven and all the non-believers don't. If this is true, then I will be in Pergatory. Pergatory is something that fascinates me, and I think I would feel right at home there. I'd like to quote Vincent from the Cowboy Bebop movie Knockin on Heavens door (ironicly enough)

 

Pergatory is the place where the souls of the destraught go. A places where there is despair and darkness. In other words, the place were living in now. And the only way for a soul to reach heaven is to pray as hard as they can. And if they do it enough, they can go to heaven, but only on Halloween

[Fall_And_Faint]

Paradise Is Heaven

[Reflectionist]

2. that's the problem- "history says this.." who cares about history? yeah, it might have better facts than us "christians" who go off of "a book." have faith, and that's all you need. like i said before, if we're wrong.. we'll just decinigrate (sp.. shut it) like everyone says we will.. but if we're right, we'll be in paradise, and you won't be. ("you" meaning the general people on here who are against and/or just don't care about christianity.)

 

Odd, I specifically remember reading about Jesus in my History Book. I guess we do have some basis in History. Score one for the hometeam, right Irish?

 

History shows that the odds were Jesus wasn't born in a manger, and that he wasn't surronded by strangers. Also there is no way he was born in December, the Palestin winter at night create incredibly cold tempertures.

 

Well that's true, but the calender has changed since then, and they had folks doing math etc. etc. etc. etc. and that's what we came up with. the reason it's a date is because it'd probably be something like 2 christmases in one year and none in the next or something....

 

Easter is based off the lunar calendar, so sometimes it's in april, like today, sometimes may, sometimes even march.

 

And that did say "odds are" Well, odds don't mean anything. If you haven't learned that by now in your life, then.... well, I don't know what to tell you, but you shouldn't place a whole lot of weight in the odds.

 

Just so you know, ODDS are of Jesus being the Christ and fulfilling the prophecy are about the same as covering the entire state of texas in wooden nickels three feet deep, and picking out the ONLY red one without looking. On your first try.

 

But that's what happened.

 

With God, nothing is impossible.

[KillMeImIrish]

^ I thought Christanity only preached heaven and hell' date=' not paradise. [/b']Thats what the Muslimes believe. I don't think that Christanity is right, I don't think any religion is the "true" religion. I think religion is just something people find comfort and understanding in. Humans like to have guidance, and religion is a great way to find it for us. Also, we all disingrate Irish. But I don't want to be buried, the thought of people standing over my body as the put flower 6 feet abover my corpse doesn't appeal to me. I'd rather be creamted or have one of those abover ground houses that people put bodies in ( Dont know the name ).

 

But lets say your right Irish, lets say all good Christians go to heaven and all the non-believers don't. If this is true, then I will be in Pergatory. Pergatory is something that fascinates me, and I think I would feel right at home there. I'd like to quote Vincent from the Cowboy Bebop movie Knockin on Heavens door (ironicly enough)

 

as fall and faint said, paradise IS heaven. so i meant that we will be in paradise (heaven) you they will be in hell.

 

there is no "good christian, bad christian" thing. you either are one, or you aren't. you'll meet lots of false ones out there who claim to be a christian, but aren't. so yes, all CHRISTIANS will go to heaven.

 

i don't believe in pergatory. now, im not judging you because you do, but i believe that since you aren't a christian, you will go to hell.

 

 

 

And reflectionist: yeah, Jesus IS in the history books, but they don't "preach" about him. they tell facts (some true and some false) about him. like, they would say that Jesus died on a cross. the end. but i would say that Jesus suffered and was crucified on a cross for our sins. ya know?

[Fall_And_Faint]

And still lives today on Heaven

[djwakka]

And some Christian's lifes are run by the Devil and they act it all out' date=' If you want the truth, yes there are very few chritians that follow everything to the letter, Im not there yet but Im trying to, I don't do anything stupid to end up in AAA. Oh and if you didn't notice sometimes only God can help certain people[/quote']

 

If you do wrong, that was you, not the fucking Devil. If you take another person's life, that was not the act of the Devil. That was you. If you accidentally forgot to pick up your sibling from school. That was you. Not the Devil.

 

You have no right to justify your wrongdoings claiming that some Biblical creature forced you to do it. Sure, God has "saved" a lot of people. But I just find it interesting that when something unfortunate happens, it's the deed of the Devil. If it's a miracle, it was blessed by God.

[Reflectionist]

Yeah, a man is always responsible for his own actions.

 

In my opinion, Satan isn't actually a character, more like... just... evil itself.

 

In Genesis, Satan (if you read literally) is a lizard that causes Eve to sin, and God makes him into a snake (or something like that). But really, He made the evil His bitch.

 

As far as the Devil controlling lives, yes and no.

 

It's true that you can let some things in the past control you (i.e. like, people in the US who don't want to fly around anymore because of Sept 11.). And some could argue that the reason 9.11 even happened is because of the Satan.

 

It's kind of a vague subject for me, but, I'm trying my best to view it objectively.

[KillMeImIrish]

If you do wrong, that was you, not the fucking Devil. If you take another person's life, that was not the act of the Devil. That was you. If you accidentally forgot to pick up your sibling from school. That was you. Not the Devil.

 

You have no right to justify your wrongdoings claiming that some Biblical creature forced you to do it. Sure, God has "saved" a lot of people. But I just find it interesting that when something unfortunate happens, it's the deed of the Devil. If it's a miracle, it was blessed by God.

 

 

the devil didn't FORCE you to do it, but he is the cause of all evil, so in a way, he did "make" you do it.

 

 

 

ref- i believe the devil is a real character and that he reveals himself through different sins and evils.

[Reflectionist]

dude, that went way to far beyond an opinion. That was an insult, and an attack. The only reason we are even having this thread is because we have been pretty good on the insults lately. But that was too far.

 

And pretty pathetic, because in actually reading it, it was all just a lie anyway.

 

About the murder, genocide, hatred, etc. etc. etc.

 

So i guess it's another case of.... pointing out the speck of sawdust in a friends eye while ignoring the log in your own.

[KillMeImIrish]

^ who was that directed to?

[Reflectionist]

Meh, the post was deleted.

 

Had a picture of the Bible, with a disclaimer on it, like, a parental advisory label, that had some crap on it about brainwashing, and so on and so forth....

[Fall_And_Faint]

I never said The Devil did anything, I said their lives are run by the Devil

 

The Devil tempts people so don't start on thinking I said it's the Devil's Fault for wrong doing.

[djwakka]

the devil didn't FORCE you to do it, but he is the cause of all evil, so in a way, he did "make" you do it.

 

 

 

ref- i believe the devil is a real character and that he reveals himself through different sins and evils.

 

What do you mean by different sins? Some sins are caused by the Devil?

Is homosexuality "tempted" by the Devil too? I mean, you're born with that trait, explain that one. Drugs = Devil. Premarital Sex = Devil. Kind of reminds you of the Sandler movie, Waterboy, doesn't it? http://images.allmoviephoto.com/1998_The_Waterboy/kathy_bates_the_waterboy_001.jpg

Vicky Vallencort is the Devil. Football is the Devil. Benjamin Franklin is the Devil.

 

I'm sure that the Devil tempts teenagers with alcohol and weed at a party, and not peer pressure. Did the Devil "make" alcohol, drugs, and most, if not, all sins and the objects of sin? But didn't God make everything that exists today, which would include the sinful things?

 

Satan nor the Devil caused the attacks on September 11. If that were the case, shouldn't we be waging war on the demons of Hell? Or is it that, the terroists "have the Devil in them" and that's what we're after?

 

dude' date=' that went way to far beyond an opinion. That was an insult, and an attack. The only reason we are even having this thread is because we have been pretty good on the insults lately. But that was too far.[/quote']

Who are you talking to? What are you talking about?

[KillMeImIrish]

What do you mean by different sins? Some sins are caused by the Devil?

Is homosexuality "tempted" by the Devil too? I mean, you're born with that trait, explain that one. Drugs = Devil. Premarital Sex = Devil. Kind of reminds you of the Sandler movie, Waterboy, doesn't it? http://images.allmoviephoto.com/1998_The_Waterboy/kathy_bates_the_waterboy_001.jpg

Vicky Vallencort is the Devil. Football is the Devil. Benjamin Franklin is the Devil.

 

I'm sure that the Devil tempts teenagers with alcohol and weed at a party, and not peer pressure. Did the Devil "make" alcohol, drugs, and most, if not, all sins and the objects of sin? But didn't God make everything that exists today, which would include the sinful things?

 

Satan nor the Devil caused the attacks on September 11. If that were the case, shouldn't we be waging war on the demons of Hell? Or is it that, the terroists "have the Devil in them" and that's what we're after?

 

by different sins, i mean all sins of different kinds. i don't believe people are born with homosexuality. i believe that people make that choice. and the next lines you give, "drugs= devil, premarital sex= devil." yes. drugs = evil > evil = devil > drugs = devil.

 

yes, the devil does tempt teenagers, and everyone, through drugs and alcohol. the devil didn't "make" them. God did. but God placed those things here TO tempt us... to see if we are strong enough to overcome the temptation. but evil is only evil if you fall into the temptation. if you're at a party with drugs and alcohol available, but reject those things, have you allowed yourself to do evil? no.

 

and last, but not least, you're right. the devil didn't CAUSE sept. 11 to happen. man (terrorists) did. but obviously evil (which is caused by Satan) is in their hearts. which i think is what you were saying in the last part of that paragraph.

[Jeezy]

What do you mean by different sins? Some sins are caused by the Devil?

Is homosexuality "tempted" by the Devil too? I mean, you're born with that trait, explain that one. Drugs = Devil. Premarital Sex = Devil. Kind of reminds you of the Sandler movie, Waterboy, doesn't it?

 

Hey come on that's so wrong. You have to drive a car before you buy it...

[KillMeImIrish]

Hey come on that's so wrong. You have to drive a car before you buy it...

 

 

too bad that didn't make sense.

 

explain, thanks.

[djwakka]

too bad that didn't make sense.

 

explain, thanks.

 

Unless you were being sarcastic, I think he was saying how people should have sex before marriage to see if that is the right person.

 

Jeezy, sex isn't the most important part of a marriage and relationships based on it will inevitably fail.

[Fort_Underground]

^ Ok Wakka. Someone deleted the post I had that put up previously. It was a picture of a bible with a warning sticker on it. Which did say what the bible teaches inside, the exposure warning is something they didn't have to put on it, but history shows us religion is the number one killer of people in history. If you want to see it, just go to google, then image search, then type bible warning label. You'll get a few pics of what it is. Also, I could have gotten at least a notification it was deleted. If it was that offensive, I would have deleted it. But then again, the Danish cartoon drawings of Muhammad are incredibly offensive to the Muslim people. Yes, they were published well before the Muslims saw it, but the cartoonists could of at least said they were sorry, but no. Yes, freedom of press, but when you use that to make fun of other people and it leads to riots, then I think you should rethink how you do something. And I think the picture pissed people, but now you might have an understanding of where the Muslim people come from.

 

I agree with you Wakka, sex should not be the sole reason why people get married. I also don't think praying will help your relationships either, if thats the only thing you do. You have to adress the problems and deal with them, not ask a higher being to sort everything out for you.

[KillMeImIrish]

ha, thanks wakka. i thought that's what he may have been saying, but i wasn't sure. and i def. agree with you (yeah, amazing right?) on the whole sex thing. it should in no way be the only reason two people get married. i don't look down on you if you choose to have premarital sex.. it's your life. but i dont agree with it either. but since when did what i "agreed with" count for anything?

 

fort- i think praying should be SOMETHING you do in your relationship to help solve problems, but it shouldn't be the ONLY thing you do. chyeah you should definitely address the issue, try to work things out, and if that doesn't work, then you should pray.

[Reflectionist]

^ Ok Wakka. Someone deleted the post I had that put up previously. It was a picture of a bible with a warning sticker on it. Which did say what the bible teaches inside, the exposure warning is something they didn't have to put on it, but history shows us religion is the number one killer of people in history. If you want to see it, just go to google, then image search, then type bible warning label. You'll get a few pics of what it is. Also, I could have gotten at least a notification it was deleted. If it was that offensive, I would have deleted it. But then again, the Danish cartoon drawings of Muhammad are incredibly offensive to the Muslim people. Yes, they were published well before the Muslims saw it, but the cartoonists could of at least said they were sorry, but no. Yes, freedom of press, but when you use that to make fun of other people and it leads to riots, then I think you should rethink how you do something. And I think the picture pissed people, but now you might have an understanding of where the Muslim people come from.

 

I agree with you Wakka, sex should not be the sole reason why people get married. I also don't think praying will help your relationships either, if thats the only thing you do. You have to adress the problems and deal with them, not ask a higher being to sort everything out for you.

 

And that gives you an excuse to put down Christianity? I didn't make that cartoon. Nobody in LPF made that cartoon. So, no matter what you say, you were out of line. Just admit it. I admitted it when I was.

 

Why don't you be the bigger man and admit it too?

[KillMeImIrish]

^ wait.. how is he out of line?

[djwakka]

^ Ok Wakka. Someone deleted the post I had that put up previously. It was a picture of a bible with a warning sticker on it. Which did say what the bible teaches inside, the exposure warning is something they didn't have to put on it, but history shows us religion is the number one killer of people in history. If you want to see it, just go to google, then image search, then type bible warning label. You'll get a few pics of what it is. Also, I could have gotten at least a notification it was deleted. If it was that offensive, I would have deleted it. But then again, the Danish cartoon drawings of Muhammad are incredibly offensive to the Muslim people. Yes, they were published well before the Muslims saw it, but the cartoonists could of at least said they were sorry, but no. Yes, freedom of press, but when you use that to make fun of other people and it leads to riots, then I think you should rethink how you do something. And I think the picture pissed people, but now you might have an understanding of where the Muslim people come from.

 

I agree with you Wakka, sex should not be the sole reason why people get married. I also don't think praying will help your relationships either, if thats the only thing you do. You have to adress the problems and deal with them, not ask a higher being to sort everything out for you.

 

Yeah, but as you can imagine, the Muslims will take it more offensively because the portrayal of Mohammed is very bad no-no in their religion. I don't think that they have a specific passage in Christianity saying, "Don't draw JC, aight?"

 

Of course praying isn't gonna help your relationship problems. It might help you feel better about your partner and give you some confidence, but love, romance, sex, and marriage, is really a whole nother topic aside from religion.

 

I jus searched and saw the Bible warning thing. The middle notes are true; you can't deny that those subjects ARE told in the Bible. But the bottom notes are a little over the line. Maybe if it specified, If you take this literally, so and so. But it's true in that if you take any piece of literature literally, you're going to have problems, especially with the Bible.

 

But I can see Fort's argument because there are many, many, Bible thumping, sister humping Southerners specifically, who praised the Mohammed cartoon as an act of patriotism.

[Jeezy]

Unless you were being sarcastic, I think he was saying how people should have sex before marriage to see if that is the right person.

 

Jeezy, sex isn't the most important part of a marriage and relationships based on it will inevitably fail.

 

 

I never said that sex is the most important thing in a relationship, but it's important! If I would meet a girl that I realy love and she want's to wait untill we are married then I would respect that...but it would be hard though...

[Fort_Underground]

And that gives you an excuse to put down Christianity? I didn't make that cartoon. Nobody in LPF made that cartoon. So, no matter what you say, you were out of line. Just admit it. I admitted it when I was.

 

Why don't you be the bigger man and admit it too?

 

How exactly was I out of line? I posted a pic which did say what the bible teaches, minus the exposure warning. I didn't publish that drawing, I merely posted it. So if you want to shoot the messenger, then go ahead. But you need to give me a reason to apoligize first before I will.

 

And Jeezey, if thats how you think, then fine by me. I guess I won't ever be able to comment on it, soley because I don' think I will ever marry. But that's fine with me, I like life alone, being able to think clearly about things that matter to me, not in a relationship were you have to sacrifice things. And yes, a good marriage shouldn't sacrifice things, but it's almost always the case were you change something when you get married.

 

And to everyone: I did not use the picture to put down Christianity. I merely just posted it. If that did offend you, then I will say sorry, but you dont have my empathy or sympathy. Scinetolgist get put down constantly, and almost every religion does. It is just something that happens in life, and hopefuly you learn how to deal with it.

 

Also, whoever deleted that post, just PM me. You don't have to post here, just PM with a reason why. That's all I ask. Also, ShinodaBear, you were right. That post of mine got deleted with in a day, prob less than 12 hours after I posted it. Mods or Admins are really watching this thread.