Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed The Bible

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 8:12 pm, Libertarius <Libertar...@nothingbutthe.truth>

wrote:

> codebrea...@bigsecret.com wrote:

> > On Feb 15, 2:01 pm, Libertarius <Libertar...@nothingbutthe.truth>

> > wrote:

>

> >>codebrea...@bigsecret.com wrote:

>

> >>>On Feb 14, 11:20 am, Uncle Vic <addr...@withheld.com> wrote:

>

> >>>>"codebrea...@bigsecret.com" <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote innews:1171458165.012872.319100@k78g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

>

> >>>>>On Feb 14, 12:40 am, Christopher A.Lee <c...@optonline.net> wrote:

>

> >>>>>>On 13 Feb 2007 20:59:03 -0800, "Snowman" <jkel...@zoomnet.net> wrote:

>

> >>>>>>>On Feb 12, 3:06 pm, Uncle Vic <addr...@withheld.com> wrote:

>

> >>>>>>>http://www.jesusneverexisted.com

> >>>>>>>--

> >>>>>>>Try showing that site to an actual historian.

> >>>>>>>See how hard you get laughed at.

>

> >>>>>>Try finding a real historian who can provide any evidence outside the

> >>>>>>Christian tradition to corroborate Christian claims of an historic

> >>>>>>Jesus.

>

> >>>>>There would not be Christians without Christ/Messiah

>

> >>>>There would be no Christians without the religion, which is a BELIEF in

> >>>>Christ/Messiah myth.

>

> >>>>>And since it is prophecised that in this world Christ

> >>>>>would be born, then Christ was born in the form of Jesus.

>

> >>>>Circular argument. See if you can find evidence of an historic Jesus

> >>>>outside of the bible or the religion.

>

> >>>I don't think this is what evidence means. It is like asking

> >>>If we can find a record of Darwin of evolution outside the

> >>>Origin of the species by Darwin...

> >>>Yours is indeed a circular reasoning.

>

> >>===>That is STUPID!

>

> >>We know Darwin WROTE that book, we have his PICTURES,

> >>even pictures of his father and sister.

>

> >>The stories (Gospels) about "Christ" are pure fiction

> >>written by some unknown Christian authors. -- L.- Hide quoted text -

>

> > Let us wait 2000 years later and see If his books, his sisters, father

> > existence would not be questioned.

>

> ===>What an inane response!

Hey Historian, post your source from a first century Jerusalem

authority

who ever questioned Jesus existence.

The Talmud did not question it. It had interest in doing so.

The Jewish Council of Jamnia did not question it.

It had interst in doing so.

Our faith was born in fire and in fire it developped itself.

None of the Apostles contemporaries ever question Jesus existence.

Do you think you are the first enemy Jesus ever encountered

as the Christ/Messiah of Israel?

>

> > When Jesus was preached around the world nobody

> > ever questioned his existence,

>

> ===>Really?

> How do you know that? ;-) -- L.- Hide quoted text -

>

> - Show quoted text -

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 8:19 pm, Libertarius <Libertar...@nothingbutthe.truth>

wrote:

> codebrea...@bigsecret.com wrote:

> > On Feb 15, 1:57 pm, Libertarius <Libertar...@nothingbutthe.truth>

> > wrote:

>

> >>codebrea...@bigsecret.com wrote:

>

> >>>On Feb 14, 12:40 am, Christopher A.Lee <c...@optonline.net> wrote:

>

> >>>>On 13 Feb 2007 20:59:03 -0800, "Snowman" <jkel...@zoomnet.net> wrote:

>

> >>>>>On Feb 12, 3:06 pm, Uncle Vic <addr...@withheld.com> wrote:

>

> >>>>>http://www.jesusneverexisted.com

> >>>>>--

> >>>>>Try showing that site to an actual historian.

> >>>>>See how hard you get laughed at.

>

> >>>>Try finding a real historian who can provide any evidence outside the

> >>>>Christian tradition to corroborate Christian claims of an historic

> >>>>Jesus.

>

> >>> There would not be Christians without Christ/Messiah

> >>> And since it is prophecised that in this world Christ

> >>> would be born,

>

> >>===>NOWHERE is any such thing "prophecised". -- L.

>

> >>then Christ was born in the form of Jesus.

>

> > I will believe that If the Jewish Council Of Jamnia claimed it.

> > They are the gardiens and authority on this Jewish Scriptures.

> > And since their goal was to stop the spread of Christianity,

> > the system of belief grounded on Christ/Messiah, since their

> > agenda was to stop it, "Moses never said such thing"

> > would have been easier for them.

>

> ===>Is it that much easier for you to just LIE than to tell

> us WHERE "it is prophecised that in this world Christ

> would be born"? -- L.- Hide quoted text -

You are not a good historian. You take your opinion as history.

I quoted text from first century Christians. You quoted nothing

to support your view.

What is the official opinion of the children of Israel

on Jesus?

If you say he was a prophet. My question is this?

Why do you think they accepted a list of prophets

like a Isaiah, Jeremy, Daniel, Habbakuk, Zakkariah and j'en passe

and even compiled their books into a canonical writing, yet rejected

Jesus?

What rational explanation can you come up with?

The difference is that Jesus was not just a prophet, but the Messiah-

Prophet

foretold by Moses. You are such a jerk

>

> - Show quoted text -

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 9:29 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

> On Feb 15, 8:42 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> > On Feb 15, 1:41 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> > > On Feb 15, 8:39 am, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> > > <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> > > > On Feb 14, 6:31 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> > > > > On Feb 14, 4:17 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> > > > > <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> > > > > > On Feb 14, 1:46 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> > > > > > > On Feb 13, 6:36 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> > > > > > > <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

>

> > > > > > > Summing up the last 150 years of research by the finest minds in

> > > > > > > archaeology, historical text research, and anthropology is a "rush to

> > > > > > > conclusion"?

>

> > > > > > 150 years of what??????????????????? Fine mind?

> > > > > > You make me laugh indeed

>

> > > > > That's because you're an ignorant, illiterate waste of humanity. Even

> > > > > if you were smart enough to read the evidence, you're too scared of

> > > > > what it might say.

>

> > > > Atheists are best known as braggarts.

>

> > > You know nothing of atheism or atheists, you insipid twat. And it's

> > > not "bragging" if you can deliver the goods.

>

> > You have not delivered anything yet. All what you come up

> > is fossils say such and such.

>

> WTF? Fossils prove Jesus never existed? What the hell are you smoking?

> On the contrary, ancient texts prove if there was a historical Jesus,

> he was as much a nobody as you are.

>

> Fossils, OTOH, simply prove the Bible is not inerrant.

>

> > Fossils do not talk for themselves.

> > They say what you want them to say... That ain't nothing

>

> Now that doesn't even make sense. Why don't you call your local

> community college and see if they offer a night course in remedial

> English.

>

> > > > Putting down

> > > > is another form of bragging. Thank you for giving weight

> > > > to what we already know

>

> > > You know nothing, you putrid little pretender of a man. Every post

> > > attempting to defend your moronic mythology proves it.

>

> > I know that DARWIN, eternal damnation be upon, erred...

>

> Of course there were errors. The book was published over 100 years

> ago, moron. There's plenty we've learned since then. Darwin simply

> uncovered the mechanism.

>

> BTW: There is no "eternal damnation", either. The man is dead.

>

> > There is no worse mythology that a monkey turning into a human

>

> Idiot. Monkeys are just as "new" as men. We don't "come from monkeys".

> We share a common ancestor.

>

> > yet you swallow this garbage because its make look like

> > you are above average joe.

>

> No, I can observe what happened by the changes found in the bones of

> dead animals. It's obvious to someone without an agenda to advance.

>

> And in other parts of the world with indoor plumbing, I am not an

> "above average joe". Only here in the Land of Debris and Home of

> Depraved is an ignorant man such as myself considered "educated".

>

> > No you ain't. Darwin, eternal

> > Damnation be upon was no historian.

>

> That's right. He was a naturalist, moron.

>

> > He had no sense

> > of History

>

> That's because he was not a historian, dumbass. He studied biology .

>

> > > > > Sooo...you simply laugh at it. You laugh to cover up your ignorance,

> > > > > and you laugh to cover up your fear. A pathetic excuse for a human

> > > > > being, cringing in fear of what you don't know.

>

> > There is no fear. My faith was born is a fournace. Its worse enemies

> > failed lamentably.

>

> Bullshit. The Christian mythology enslaved Europe for more than a

> thousand years. Only after discarding it with the ashes of the Second

> World War were the Europeans able to build a thriving society with its

> nations at peace with one another.

>

> Your faith? Yeah, keep it. We'll put you in the zoo as the last living

> Christian, as your species goes extinct.

>

> > You too will meet with the same fate.

>

> Empty threats from an idiot who still clings to the dress of an Iron

> Age fertility god. All you've done is prove is that Christianity is a

> religion of hate. Beginning with hatred of those who don't believe

> xian mythology, and ending with hatred of the self. Wretched,

> tormented creatures, you are. You'd be easy to pity if your situation

> had been imposed by others, but since you only have yourselves to

> blame, sit down and shut up.

>

> > > > > A fine advertisement of what the disease called religion does to

> > > > > someone.

>

> > > > Just because you think I am ignorant does not make me so...

>

> > > No, your lack of knowledge or understanding makes you so. Here, maybe

> > > this will help:

>

> > > Main Entry: ig

February 16, 2007

>Reply to article by: "Warhol" <molarh_tree@hotmail.com>

>Date written: 14 Feb 2007 21:27:13 -0800

>MsgID:<1171517233.280845.9400@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>

>> >> In the OT, God prophecized to Jeremiah that no one would be a descendant of Jeconiah (Coniah), yet

>> >> Jesus was, therefore that disqualifies Jesus from being the Messiah.

>> >> Apparently the same people who don't read their Bible are the same ones who believe in it.

>Why do you translate the word of "Jeconiah" to "coniah"...

>WHILE ITS "JACOB's Daughter" YOU BLOODY VERMIN...

"Coniah is an abbreviation of Jeconiah (1 Chronicles 3:16), which is another form of the name

Jehoiachin (2 Kings 24:6). Coniah was the last king of Judah in the direct line from King David.

When he was deported to Babylon by Nebuchadnezzar (2 Chronicles 36:10), Coniah's uncle Zedekiah was

assigned to rule Judah for a brief reign, but he also was put down, and no later king was ever able

to regain the throne" (Dr. Henry M. Morris, The Defender's Study Bible, note for Jer. 22:24.).

If you had bothered to read the whole 22nd chapter of Jeremiah that I quoted from, you would have

read where the Jeremiah calls out the same exact person, geneologically speaking, as Matthew does,

leaving no doubt as to the equivalence of the two names...

"'As I live,' declares the LORD, 'even though Coniah the son of Jehoiakim king of Judah were a

signet ring on My right hand, yet I would pull you off" (Jer 22:24)

So there you have it: the Bible itself translates the word of "Jeconiah" to "Coniah".

Get a clue before posting next time!

The Sage

=============================================================

http://members.cox.net/the.sage/index.htm

"All those painted screens erected by man to shut out reality

-- history, religion, duty, social position --

all were illusions, mere opium fantasies"

John Fowles, The French Lieutenant's Woman

=============================================================

February 16, 2007

> Why do you think they accepted a list of prophets

> like a Isaiah, Jeremy, Daniel, Habbakuk, Zakkariah and j'en passe

> and even compiled their books into a canonical writing, yet rejected

> Jesus?

> What rational explanation can you come up with?

He didn't exist.

> The difference is that Jesus was not just a prophet, but the Messiah-

> Prophet

> foretold by Moses. You are such a jerk

The Jewish faith has never accepted Jesus as messiah/Christ.

Please quote a reference in accepted Jewish text that cites Jesus as the

messiah

February 16, 2007

> Did you ever meet Darwin in person? No

> Where you there when he was writing? No

That doesn't matter .. its not required to be credibel historical evidence.

There are standards and principles for what makes acceptable historical

evidence. You seem to have no idea of what counts as historical evidence,

or are deliberately ignoring it for your own convenience.

> Anything you know about Darwin has been handed down

> to you from previous generations.

No .. we have original information.

> You just believe it because it is written

Not at all, it requires historical proof, and that proof exists, not just in

the form of one particular book he wrote. We do not even have any writing

from Jesus himself at all.

> We trust

> those eye witness who were sent to teach in the name of

> Jesus the Savior

We have no records of what these alleged eye-witnesses said.

> just the way you trust anything written down about Darwin.

We must apply the same standard of historical proof to all cases .. and

there is no credible historical proof of Jesus. You certainly have not

provided any.

February 16, 2007

> YOU KNOW IT FROM WHO? NOT FROM DARWIN HIMSELF.

> You have his picture? How do you know If it is Darwin?

> Did you meet him in person before.

> You see again, somewhere you decide to trust someone who

> reported who Darwin was and wrote. We all depend

> on hearsay

You are being ridiculous now.

> The life of Jesus the Messiah was written by Christian and for

> Christians. If you are clueless as how to read it

> it is because you are not a Christian.

Rubbish. I know how to read. You don't need to be a christian to read or

understand the bible. Only to be brainwashed by it by not reading it

critically.

> Ask me what does the word Christian means.

I know what it means.

> The answer, the one who follow Christ.

Without any historical evidence that that person exists. It is purely

faith.

> Again there would be no christian without Christ

Yeup .. that's must be sad for you.

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 10:16 pm, "Jeckyl" <n...@nowhere.com> wrote:

> > Why do you think they accepted a list of prophets

> > like a Isaiah, Jeremy, Daniel, Habbakuk, Zakkariah and j'en passe

> > and even compiled their books into a canonical writing, yet rejected

> > Jesus?

> > What rational explanation can you come up with?

>

> He didn't exist.

How do you insult someone who never existed.

Read the Talmud in its pages where Jesus and his mother are

mentioned. It is even stupid to get angry at something which

not real.

Anyway, he existed, but they had issue with his claim that

he was the Messiah that Moses fortold.

"If you believe Moses, you would believe me because

he wrote about me." New Testament.

This the way of a sound scholarship.

The way of malice is yours with baseless claim

>

> > The difference is that Jesus was not just a prophet, but the Messiah-

> > Prophet

> > foretold by Moses. You are such a jerk

>

> The Jewish faith has never accepted Jesus as messiah/Christ.

Yet the Jewish faith is expected Messiah/Christ based on Deuteronnmy

18:15, this what the point was

>

> Please quote a reference in accepted Jewish text that cites Jesus as the

> messiah

The point was whether or not Moses foretold the Messiah/Christ not

whether

or not Jewish faith accepted Jesus as the Messiah/Christ

The point was whether or not Deuteronnmy 18:15 was about the Messiah/

Christ.

Get your mind straight,jerk.

February 16, 2007

> You are such a prentious little asshole...

Charming.

> The same way people are trained to explain the American

> Constitution, the same way there were people in Israel

> trained to read the Law of Moses and interprete it.

> You are not ONE of them, so why should I care about

> your PRIVATE OPINION.

So are you saying that the Jewish faith recognises Jesus as the messiah ?

> You are not a good Historian either

You ceratinly aren't .. you've not given one single bit of historial

evidence. Only hearsay from people who never new jesus when he was

supposedly alive.

> Go back to first Century Jerusalem and quote a Scribe or

> a doctor of the Mosaic Law who ever said that Deuteronomy

> 18:15 never was about a Messiah/Christ

Whether or not the Jews where expecting a promised messiah is beside the

point. The issue is whether jesus was that messiah. The old testament and

jewish scripture do not say that.

> Do you think that being historian mean reading the works

> by some Historians?

> Being historian means being able to investigate and find the cause

> and effect.

Exactly .. obviosuly not something you have done, otherwise you would cite

the credible contemporary evidence of Jesus existence.

> Hey it looks like History does not support your viewpoint.

It certainly does not support yours.

> JESUS IS THE CHRIST, NO JESUS, NO CHRIST

Shame that.

February 16, 2007

>> None has been found

> None has been find yet

Yes .. nothing yet

> And who is looking for that evidence?

Historians, theologians, archeologists. The person who could find real

evidence of Jesus would be famous (and most likely end up very wealthy as a

result). They would LOVE to find such evidence .. they have a very great

interest in finding it.

February 16, 2007

>> Its called doing research. You shoul try it sometime. There is credible

>> written contemporary evidence of John the Baptist (outside of the bible

> How do you decide this is credible and this is not?

There are standard for judging the creidbility of historical evidence.

> Just because something meets your fantazy does not make it credible

Right back at you hypocrite.

>> "2. Now some of the Jews thought that the destruction of Herod's army

>> came

>> from God, and that very justly, as a punishment of what he did against

>> John,

>> that was called the Baptist: for Herod slew him, who was a good man, and

> Who did he baptized and for what purpose did he baptize

Don't you know? Maybe you should do some more research.

Regardless, that has nothing to do with that being an example of independent

evidence for John the Baptist being a real historical figure.

February 16, 2007

> None of the Apostles contemporaries ever question Jesus existence.

That shows a lack of critical thinking on their part.

Of course, they didn't have the standard of historical evidence we have now,

nor the tools to research it. So one really can't blame them for accepting

what was told to them.

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 9:29 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

> On Feb 15, 8:42 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

this will help:

>

> > > Main Entry: ig

February 16, 2007

>> > What rational explanation can you come up with?

>> He didn't exist.

> How do you insult someone who never existed.

Good question .. not sure how its relevant, but there you go.

> Read the Talmud in its pages where Jesus and his mother are

> mentioned.

Can you please quote the relevant passage(s)? I don't happen to have a

Talmud handy.

Bear in mind, of course, that the Talmud was written many years after jesus

supposedly lived and died. So its not contemporary with Jesus life.

> Anyway, he existed, but they had issue with his claim that

> he was the Messiah that Moses fortold.

> This the way of a sound scholarship.

> The way of malice is yours with baseless claim

My claims are not baseless .. they are based on a lack of historical

evidence.

If you really can provide some, then that's fine .. I REALLY look forward to

it.

> Yet the Jewish faith is expected Messiah/Christ based on Deuteronnmy

> 18:15, this what the point was

Yes.. and they are still waiting.

> The point was whether or not Moses foretold the Messiah/Christ

I would certainly agree that the old testament fortells a prophet / messiash

/ christ. I've not said it doesn't, and it is not the point I was

addressing.

> The point was whether or not Deuteronnmy 18:15 was about the Messiah/

> Christ. Get your mind straight,jerk.

This thread seems to be on the subject of whether Jesus is the Christ (hence

the title "No Jesus, No Christ").

Another charming person. Sad that you have to resort to name calling to

make your point..

February 16, 2007

codebreaker@bigsecret.com wrote:

> On Feb 15, 9:29 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>> On Feb 15, 8:42 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>>

>> <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> this will help:

>>

>>>> Main Entry: ig

February 16, 2007

> No Jesus, No Christ.

There could be a Christ who is yet to come. No Jesus doesn't mean No

Christ.

> Christ had to be born into the world according to the Jewish Scriptures.

That doesn't mean that event ahs yet happened.

> It has been proven behond doubt that Jesus is tha Christ/Messiah

Where is the proof the Jesus (assuming he existed) is the promised Christ /

Messiah.

If that evidence is so well proven beyond any doubt, then are you saying the

Jewish faith accept Jesus as their promised Messiash?

> therefore Jesus was born into the world and existed in truth.

Just because you use the word 'therefore' that does not imply a logical

concluion.

There is no evidence that Jesus actually existed, other than stories written

after the time of his supposed death.

There is ceratinly no evidence that events surrounding his birth and death

happened (indeed the bible lacks consistency there)

> Now tell the real Christ to get up If you don't believe this

Get up where?

February 16, 2007

On 15 Feb 2007 17:53:18 -0800 there was an Ancient

"codebreaker@bigsecret.com" <Codebreaker@bigsecret.com> who stoppeth

one in alt.atheism

>On Feb 14, 7:29 pm, "Jeckyl" <n...@nowhere.com> wrote:

>>

>> If you ar etalking about whetehr Darwin existed, there is plenty of

>> contemporary evidence about him from the time he lived. Including the books

>> he wrote.

>

>Did you ever meet Darwin in person? No

>Where you there when he was writing? No

>Anything you know about Darwin has been handed down

>to you from previous generations. You have no mean to confirm

>or infirm it.

Actually, we have his original writings, in his own hand.

>You just believe it because it is written, If you believe any garbage

>just because it is written down, why don't you believe

>that you are a bastard and you don't know your real father

>as mother were in business to change men over night.

I have evidence that my parents were married when I was born, and that

I am in fact their natural child.

>Now to come back to the case at hand. We trust

>those eye witness who were sent to teach in the name of

>Jesus the Savior, just the way you trust anything

>written down about Darwin.

Except they weren't eye witnesses. The earliest Gospel was written

over a decade after the fact hundreds of miles from Judea. It is as

if the first report of Darwin's voyage on the Beagle was written in

Bavaria in the mid-1880s based on third hand reports.

>Somwhere at some point, you need to trust somebody.

>We trust the Apostles just the way you trust Darwin propagandists

Of course, we can back up Darwin with laboratory results.

--

Douglas Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail

Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5

Jason Gastrich is praying for me on 8 January 2011

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the

source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a

stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as

good as dead: his eyes are closed." - Albert Einstein

February 16, 2007

On 15 Feb 2007 18:29:00 -0800 there was an Ancient

"codebreaker@bigsecret.com" <Codebreaker@bigsecret.com> who stoppeth

one in alt.atheism

>> "2. Now some of the Jews thought that the destruction of Herod's army came

>> from God, and that very justly, as a punishment of what he did against John,

>> that was called the Baptist: for Herod slew him, who was a good man, and

>

>Who did he baptized and for what purpose did he baptize

According to your Bible he batized pretty everyone he could cajole

into the river (except for Pharisees and Sadducees) and he did it

because the Kingdom of Heaven was at hand. Matthew 3:2.

Don't you read the Bible? John was sure that the end times were here.

2000 years ago.

Guess he was wrong.

--

Douglas Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail

Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5

Jason Gastrich is praying for me on 8 January 2011

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the

source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a

stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as

good as dead: his eyes are closed." - Albert Einstein

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 11:54 pm, Douglas Berry <penguin_...@mindOBVIOUSspring.com>

wrote:

> On 15 Feb 2007 17:53:18 -0800 there was an Ancient

> "codebrea...@bigsecret.com" <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> who stoppeth

> one in alt.atheism

>

> >On Feb 14, 7:29 pm, "Jeckyl" <n...@nowhere.com> wrote:

>

> >> If you ar etalking about whetehr Darwin existed, there is plenty of

> >> contemporary evidence about him from the time he lived. Including the books

> >> he wrote.

>

> >Did you ever meet Darwin in person? No

> >Where you there when he was writing? No

> >Anything you know about Darwin has been handed down

> >to you from previous generations. You have no mean to confirm

> >or infirm it.

>

> Actually, we have his original writings, in his own hand.

>

How do you know it is his? Someone claimed it

How do you know it is ORIGINAL ? Someone told you so

You had no way to know

and this take us back to where we were. It take a trust

in someone no matter what to believe something. We all depends

on hearsay.

Don't get confused. Hearsay can be done in writing.

The claim that something is written down therefore it is not

a hearsay is bogus. Now If you can believe all that Hoopla

about Darwin, why do you demand a different standard for Jesus

and his trusted apostles?

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 10:23 pm, "Jeckyl" <n...@nowhere.com> wrote:

> > Did you ever meet Darwin in person? No

> > Where you there when he was writing? No

>

> That doesn't matter .. its not required to be credibel historical evidence.

So why you keep claiming that since Luke never met Jesus therefore

His report is not reliable

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 7:15 pm, "Jeckyl" <n...@nowhere.com> wrote:

>

> Its called doing research. You shoul try it sometime. There is credible

"Searching when you know nothing is like trying to sort weed from

scratch when you don't even know what the scratch is made of."

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 11:01 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

<Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> On Feb 15, 9:29 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> > On Feb 15, 8:42 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> > <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> this will help:

>

> > > > Main Entry: ig

February 16, 2007

On Feb 15, 9:49 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

<Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> On Feb 15, 9:29 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> > On Feb 15, 8:42 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> > <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> > > On Feb 15, 1:41 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> > > > On Feb 15, 8:39 am, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> > > > <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> > > > > On Feb 14, 6:31 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> > > > > > On Feb 14, 4:17 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> > > > > > <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

> > > > > > > On Feb 14, 1:46 pm, panamfl...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> > > > > > > > On Feb 13, 6:36 pm, "codebrea...@bigsecret.com"

>

> > > > > > > > <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote:

snip

> Fossils don't speak for themselves, people do with a hidden agenda

Your complete failure to present a counter-argument for any of my

points is noted. Is that the Christian way? To run away when the empty

threats don't scare anyone? I suppose it is, according to the

evidence:

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_prac2.htm

-Panama Floyd, Atlanta

aa#2015, Member Knights of BAAWA!

EAC Martian Commander

Plonked by Kadaitcha Man Sept 06

"..the prayer cloth of one aeon is the doormat of the next."

-Mark Twain

Religious societies are less moral than secular ones:

http://moses.creighton.edu/JRS/2005/2005-11.html

February 16, 2007

codebreaker@bigsecret.com wrote:

> On Feb 15, 2:01 pm, Libertarius <Libertar...@nothingbutthe.truth>

> wrote:

>

>>codebrea...@bigsecret.com wrote:

>>

>>>On Feb 14, 11:20 am, Uncle Vic <addr...@withheld.com> wrote:

>>

>>>>"codebrea...@bigsecret.com" <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote innews:1171458165.012872.319100@k78g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

>>

>>>>>On Feb 14, 12:40 am, Christopher A.Lee <c...@optonline.net> wrote:

>>

>>>>>>On 13 Feb 2007 20:59:03 -0800, "Snowman" <jkel...@zoomnet.net> wrote:

>>

>>>>>>>On Feb 12, 3:06 pm, Uncle Vic <addr...@withheld.com> wrote:

>>

>>>>>>>http://www.jesusneverexisted.com

>>>>>>>--

>>>>>>>Try showing that site to an actual historian.

>>>>>>>See how hard you get laughed at.

>>

>>>>>>Try finding a real historian who can provide any evidence outside the

>>>>>>Christian tradition to corroborate Christian claims of an historic

>>>>>>Jesus.

>>

>>>>>There would not be Christians without Christ/Messiah

>>

>>>>There would be no Christians without the religion, which is a BELIEF in

>>>>Christ/Messiah myth.

>>

>>>>>And since it is prophecised that in this world Christ

>>>>>would be born, then Christ was born in the form of Jesus.

>>

>>>>Circular argument. See if you can find evidence of an historic Jesus

>>>>outside of the bible or the religion.

>>

>>>I don't think this is what evidence means. It is like asking

>>>If we can find a record of Darwin of evolution outside the

>>>Origin of the species by Darwin...

>>>Yours is indeed a circular reasoning.

>>

>>===>That is STUPID!

>>

>>We know Darwin WROTE that book, we have his PICTURES,

>>even pictures of his father and sister.

>

> YOU KNOW IT FROM WHO? NOT FROM DARWIN HIMSELF.

> You have his picture? How do you know If it is Darwin?

> Did you meet him in person before.

> You see again, somewhere you decide to trust someone who

> reported who Darwin was and wrote. We all depend

> on hearsay

===>What inane questions you hide behind!

Only an idiot would think there is any comparison between

evidence for Darwin and evidence for "Jesus". -- L.

February 16, 2007

On Feb 16, 1:52 pm, Libertarius <Libertar...@nothingbutthe.truth>

wrote:

> codebrea...@bigsecret.com wrote:

> > On Feb 15, 2:01 pm, Libertarius <Libertar...@nothingbutthe.truth>

> > wrote:

>

> >>codebrea...@bigsecret.com wrote:

>

> >>>On Feb 14, 11:20 am, Uncle Vic <addr...@withheld.com> wrote:

>

> >>>>"codebrea...@bigsecret.com" <Codebrea...@bigsecret.com> wrote innews:1171458165.012872.319100@k78g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

>

> >>>>>On Feb 14, 12:40 am, Christopher A.Lee <c...@optonline.net> wrote:

>

> >>>>>>On 13 Feb 2007 20:59:03 -0800, "Snowman" <jkel...@zoomnet.net> wrote:

>

> >>>>>>>On Feb 12, 3:06 pm, Uncle Vic <addr...@withheld.com> wrote:

>

> >>>>>>>http://www.jesusneverexisted.com

> >>>>>>>--

> >>>>>>>Try showing that site to an actual historian.

> >>>>>>>See how hard you get laughed at.

>

> >>>>>>Try finding a real historian who can provide any evidence outside the

> >>>>>>Christian tradition to corroborate Christian claims of an historic

> >>>>>>Jesus.

>

> >>>>>There would not be Christians without Christ/Messiah

>

> >>>>There would be no Christians without the religion, which is a BELIEF in

> >>>>Christ/Messiah myth.

>

> >>>>>And since it is prophecised that in this world Christ

> >>>>>would be born, then Christ was born in the form of Jesus.

>

> >>>>Circular argument. See if you can find evidence of an historic Jesus

> >>>>outside of the bible or the religion.

>

> >>>I don't think this is what evidence means. It is like asking

> >>>If we can find a record of Darwin of evolution outside the

> >>>Origin of the species by Darwin...

> >>>Yours is indeed a circular reasoning.

>

> >>===>That is STUPID!

>

> >>We know Darwin WROTE that book, we have his PICTURES,

> >>even pictures of his father and sister.

>

> > YOU KNOW IT FROM WHO? NOT FROM DARWIN HIMSELF.

> > You have his picture? How do you know If it is Darwin?

> > Did you meet him in person before.

> > You see again, somewhere you decide to trust someone who

> > reported who Darwin was and wrote. We all depend

> > on hearsay

>

> ===>What inane questions you hide behind!

> Only an idiot would think there is any comparison between

> evidence for Darwin and evidence for "Jesus". -- L.- Hide quoted text -

>

> - Show quoted text -

Of course there is no comparison at all

Christ was foretold, Darwin not

Christ resurrected, Darwin not

Christ ascended in heaven, Darwin not

Christ open the gate of after life, Darwin can't even help himself

Christ will come again to judge Darwin, Darwin won't judge nobody

The last word belong to Christ and not to Darwin

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