Morgan Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 So inspite of being knee-deep in work right now I thought I would jump on here and ask you guys a few questions. Who here would be interested in learning some more about building motors and learning new things about how to set deck height, clay checking, cam timing, etc. We had a couple customers recently complain about our CNC head, but neither could tell me where the deck height was set, where the cam timing was set at, where the ignition timing was, NOTHING! Bugs me beyond belief. I walked one guy through all the small details that all add up when building a motor and guess what, motor went from 56 to 62 as a stockbore. Motors are all about components used, and how they work together, the numbers will always reflect that. Quote Morgan Russell Demon Industries- Owner Facebook- Demon Industries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F-Red Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 Please, be the Professor. How would you indulge that information? Quote http://450rhq.com/data/MetaMirrorCache/be5b07af4c27fc1c6c9beaaea87ef233.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loud450man Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 sure all the info helps! Quote 450r mx quad ...sb, st, flux capacitor :headbang: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big D Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 Here to learn :gr_cheers: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Mamito USMC Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 im willing to donate my atv to be the test subject for this class.. let me know and ill drive it all the way from Las Cruces to Phoenix.. :wavey: Quote http://www.offtopic.forum/data/MetaMirrorCache/06f1a7ba567102d307e3f721efc437ad.jpg Zorros racing.. #123A - Baja 500, 2014 FINISHER !!! Subscribe to us on FB http://www.facebook.com/zorros.rt http://www.offtopic.forum/data/MetaMirrorCache/91c75944b97d47249f183869c9875a9e.gif http://www.offtopic.forum/data/MetaMirrorCache/5639c3ecf3b34b1f1e26b660950f9785.gif Join the http://www.Marines.com travel to exotic lands, meet exciting unusual people and kill them.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TP Racing Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 :metoo: Quote http://450rhq.com/data/MetaMirrorCache/21fc0f0e32f71137992534b10cc306cc.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baileyguns Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 Is a frogs ass water tight?? Does a bear shit in the woods?? Do we want to read good tech??? YES, YES and YES!! Quote Live Free or Die http://450rhq.com/data/MetaMirrorCache/9429fda0882ce39582aff21a740157c0.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burke Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 This would be great info to have Quote Your bike smells like a Chinese Restaurant - John Dyer 08 450R Mods: Moto Death Grips Powerjet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTMTRX Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 Is a frogs ass water tight?? Does a bear shit in the woods?? Do we want to read good tech??? YES, YES and YES!! :stupid: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StonedInNy Posted May 19, 2012 Share Posted May 19, 2012 All 3 you mentioned morgan would be great to know for us backyard mechanics. Thanks. Quote http://450rhq.com/data/MetaMirrorCache/6b18ba3659cf943b54f355288f1e5e07.jpg http://450rhq.com/data/MetaMirrorCache/4ea86facfccf17b627d7287f9ada1ff0.jpg Fuckin half the size and 3 times the price...... No shit! My You tube vids. http://www.youtube.com/user/jdellav73?feature=mhee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanbmx Posted May 20, 2012 Share Posted May 20, 2012 I am kinda slow I need pictures:metoo: :secret2: Quote http://450rhq.com/data/MetaMirrorCache/92ac89484251c63d73340458b54ac18b.jpg By alanbmx at 2012-04-16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bvet4dog Posted May 20, 2012 Share Posted May 20, 2012 beginner here. Has some tools and can borrow some technical tools. I'm down! heavy pics and tech write ups should do the trick for us. If this is not a place for a beginner to learn.... i'll donate my bike and i'll wait to have it returned here with some love done to it Quote 07 trx450r http://450rhq.com/data/MetaMirrorCache/cd3b5c0a9ec786930d0a92290fd034b5.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
want2bfast Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Lets get to posting... Quote I dont ride dick? So whats your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zibilich Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 awww yeaa im all eyes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ridinredjav Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 and ears! Quote 04 honda TRX450R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chronicsmoke Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 :smokin::popcorn: Quote CRASHTEST RACING IMMORTAL ATV http://www.offtopic.forum/data/MetaMirrorCache/7cbc5acb2a1ab76eac286e7fe5b4520d.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Deven Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 Morgan has been VERY busy lately. Im sure when he gets some free time he will chime in here and post up. Lots to learn from someone who makes tons of power out of the Hondas and other machines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zibilich Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 Im sure hes in the works of getting something together for a copy/past ordeal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted June 4, 2012 Author Share Posted June 4, 2012 Finally had a little time to get some of this together for you guys. This motor is for one of my QuadCross Pro riders that we just finished up, so here goes... Disclaimer: The deck height was already set on this motor before I remembered to have someone take pics as it went together, so I put a couple base gaskets back under the cylinder to simulate an incorrect deck height. Setting the deck height: Install the base gasket with the alignment dowels on the cases, and install the piston onto the rod. Next, slide the cylinder on, rings are not needed at this point. I use a couple old wrist pins to tighten the cylinder down to ensure that the cylinder is nice and flat. Quote Morgan Russell Demon Industries- Owner Facebook- Demon Industries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted June 4, 2012 Author Share Posted June 4, 2012 Next, take out the timing plug on the clutch side cover (10mm allen head) and you will be looking for a punch mark on the crank gear. Rotate the crank with an 8mm allen to align the punch mark with the arrow on the side cover. Quote Morgan Russell Demon Industries- Owner Facebook- Demon Industries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted June 4, 2012 Author Share Posted June 4, 2012 Now that the motor is on TDC we will measure the piston on the intake and exhaust sides. When measuring the intake side, push down on the exhaust side, to account for piston rock. We shoot for .040 total and that includes the .027 OEM or Cometic style MLS head gasket. So, we want the piston to be roughly .013 in the hole. I don't see any reason to run it any closer than .040, you decrease Piston to Valve clearance, increase the chance of the piston hitting the head, which will break the rod, and rod stretch. We use a set of digital calipers, Vernier or dial calipers, and a depth gauge will work fine as well. Quote Morgan Russell Demon Industries- Owner Facebook- Demon Industries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted June 4, 2012 Author Share Posted June 4, 2012 This illustrates an incorrect deck height at .041 on our calipers. We want .040 total so we know our current deck height is .041+.027 with our headgasket. With .068 we now know that .028 needs to come off the bottom of the cylinder for a correct deck height measurement. At this point remove the cylinder, and find a local machine shop that has means to cut the bottom of the cylinder. Do not try to cut the top of the cylinder, it will chip the Nikasil. Chucked up in the lathe to cut and after cutting we smooth out any sharp edges with a piece of Scotchbrite. Quote Morgan Russell Demon Industries- Owner Facebook- Demon Industries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted June 4, 2012 Author Share Posted June 4, 2012 Re-install the cylinder in the same order as before, tighten down, and measure the deck height again. This time we come up with .013 on our calipers. We add the .027 for the headgasket and wind up right where we wanted at our .040. The usual amount removed from the bottom of the cylinder is .010-.015 for most pistons depending on manufacturer, please remember I added base gaskets to get the illustrations. Quote Morgan Russell Demon Industries- Owner Facebook- Demon Industries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted June 4, 2012 Author Share Posted June 4, 2012 Now that our deck height is set we can move onto clay checking the motor. This step is very important, none of us want to see the valves throw a party in the combustion chamber. We clay check with an old headgasket to get a more accurate reading, and new headgaskets should not be torqued down numerous times. We have our Demon Pro head all shimmed up and ready to install on the motor with running lash .006/.009. Shimming a new head on the bench is always recommended if possible to avoid dropping shims down into the cam chain galley. For this head we will be running/clay checking with the Web 208/921, 36 Del West flat face Ti and Ferrea 31 stainless exhaust. Quote Morgan Russell Demon Industries- Owner Facebook- Demon Industries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted June 4, 2012 Author Share Posted June 4, 2012 Place a small piece of modeling clay or Play Doh in the valve pockets of the piston. Overlap the clay over the edge of the valve relief to ensure that your piston will clear oversize valves if you are running them. Spray a small amount of WD-40 or oil on your finger and coat the top of the clay so that the valves leave their impression in the clay, but do not pick it up off the piston. Quote Morgan Russell Demon Industries- Owner Facebook- Demon Industries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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