Guest Ralph Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-0906072006580001@66-52-22-86.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article > <DipthotDipthot-E33034.16000109062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > >> In article >> <Jason-0906071313520001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > In article >> > <DipthotDipthot-294445.11505509062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> > >> > > In article >> > > <Jason-0906071219110001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> > > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> > > >> > > > What caused that leg to get longer if God did not heal her? >> > > >> > > Ahem. >> > > >> > > You are assuming that we accept your telling of the story. >> > > >> > > I, for one, do not. Provide an authoritative source to support it. >> > > Otherwise, my position is one of doubt. >> > >> > Do you believe the lady (a former Miss America) was lying when she >> > stated >> > that she was healed by God? >> >> Was I unclear? I repeat: You are assuming that we accept your telling >> of the alleged story. >> >> > If not, how do you explain why her legs are now the same size? >> >> I guess I was unclear. >> >> Look, fellow: You have not proven yourself a reliable source of fact >> about anything. You have shown yourself to be a fan of liars. Why >> should anyone trust that you have a story about a beauty queen and her >> magic leg? > > I copy and pasted the story from a website. If you think that I am not > telling the truth about Cheryl Prewitt--google that name. One of the of > members of this newsgroup told me that he googled her name and the result > was over 700 websites. Cheryl Prewitt is a former Miss America. It is her story that lacks evidence that I question. I would ask for evidence from anyone who told me such a story. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-0806072052430001@66-52-22-87.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <ukpj63pbk2ivnu6pvi0f1a7inuf3ir30og@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> On Fri, 08 Jun 2007 16:40:11 -0700, in alt.atheism >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> <Jason-0806071640120001@66-52-22-48.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >In article <gkkai.3212$Da.1907@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> ><mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> news:Jason-0806071550350001@66-52-22-48.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > In article <Dfjai.671$s9.194@bignews3.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> >> news:Jason-0706072012540001@66-52-22-14.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> > <DipthotDipthot-63ED4F.18324107062007@newsclstr02.news.prodigy.com>, >> >> >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> In article >> >> >> >> <Jason-0706071647400001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > I requested that you google "miracle healings" and if you had >> >> >> >> > done >> >> >> >> > that, >> >> >> >> > you would know that God is healing people today in much the > same way >> >> >> >> > that >> >> >> >> > God healed people while Jesus was on this earth. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> You are a sucker for a smooth-talkin' salesman, aren't you? If >> >> >> >> you >> >> >> >> had >> >> >> >> been raised in a Hindu community, what do you think you'd >> >> >> >> believe >> >> >> >> about >> >> >> >> who/what was responsible for "miracle healings"? >> >> >> > >> >> >> > God can heal anyone regardless of their religions. >> >> >> >> >> >> God can't heal anyone because he doesn't exist. If you take a look > at the >> >> >> world and it's condition that is a pretty clear indicator that >> >> >> there is >> >> >> no >> >> >> benevolent god. >> >> > >> >> > God is still in control. His prophets predicted that the end times >> >> > would >> >> > be really bad. Those prophets were correct. >> >> >> >> Jason, the end times have been here since Jesus was here. Jesus > predicted he >> >> would be back 'soon'. He didn't show! >> > >> >Many Christians are hoping that it will happen very soon. You are >> >correct-Christions were hoping that he would return when I was a child. >> >Even the first generation of Christians expected Jesus to rapture out >> >the >> >Christians. >> >Do you want to be left behind when the rapture takes place? I don't. >> >> Most Christians reject Rapture theology. Most Christians accept >> scientific evidence. Most Chrstians don't repeatedly tell lies after >> they have been called on those lies. >> >> Is there any reason for anyone to think you are a Christian? > > 2 Thes 4:14 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout > with voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God and the dead in > Christ shall rise first and then we who are alive and remain shall be > caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, > and thus we shall always be with the Lord. I think that point just sailed over his head. Quote
Guest Don Kresch Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 In alt.atheism On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 12:28:02 -0700, Jason@nospam.com (Jason) let us all know that: >In article <pb1o63pqlmfbbjub4g86db20g119obqair@4ax.com>, Don Kresch ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > >> In alt.atheism On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 21:14:26 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) let us all know that: >> >> >In article <12pm63dcjnuunio4aknb4i84ruo5v05diq@4ax.com>, Don Kresch >> ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: >> > >> >> In alt.atheism On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 13:05:09 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >> >> (Jason) let us all know that: >> >> >> >> >> >> >I will tell you the reason I mentioned the 12 percent figure in several >> >posts. >> >> >People (in various posts) were attempting to marginalize me. People in >> >> >various posts stated or at least implied that most people believed that >> >> >mankind evolved from lower life forms without involvement from God. I knew >> >> >that was not true but had no data to back it up. When I found out that >> >> >only 12 percent of Americans believed that mankind evolved from lower life >> >> >forms without involvement from God, I decided to post the figure everytime >> >> >someone else attempted to marginalize me and by opinions related to >> >> >abiogenesis. >> >> >> >> That's just means that 12% of the people are fucking morons. >> > >> > >> >Don, >> >I agree with you. >> >Jason >> > >> Hey--wow. I get a response from you when I throw out some bait >> for you. Look at that. Of course, you realize, I don't think that 12% >> of the people are morons, but it's just something to get you to >> respond. >> >> Now then: why haven't you responded to my answers to those 20 >> questions? And why do you think the number of people who believe >> something has anything to do with the truth of that thing? >> >I thanked you for responding. And what do you have to say about my responses? > The reason I posted the 12 percent number >was because several people tried to marginalize me. You are. Don --- aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Thu, 07 Jun 2007 20:41:38 -0700, Jason wrote: > Have you ever considered the possibility that the reason people respect > Dr. Gish and Dr. Morris is because they are telling us things in their > books and debates that we already knew were true. No, because little Gish or Morris have to say has any relation to the truth. > For example, I already > knew that God created the solar system No, you didn't; you can't even demonstrate God exists, let alone that he did anything. Stop lying. > even went to college. Millions of Christians also knew that God created > the solar system No, they didn't; they can't even demonstrate God exists, let alone that he did anything. Stop lying. > read his book, it confirmed many of the things that I already knew were > true. Things you believed without any justification whatsoever, you mean. > There are millions of Christians that are probably just like me. > We respect Dr. Gish and Dr. Morris since they are telling us things that > we already knew were true. They're lying to you and you're not smart enough to figure it out, or honest enough to admit it, you mean. > That is the main reason I will always respect > them regardless of what people tell me about them. I doubt that any of > the staff members at ICR even care what their critics say about > them--their audience is Christians. Who are willing to accept any lie as long as it promotes their beliefs. Yup. Good old Christian values - lie, cheat, defraud, it's all good as long as it's lying for the lord. -- “Look, I’m not trying to be ignorant.” -- Mickey Buchanan Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Thu, 07 Jun 2007 21:12:31 -0700, Jason wrote: >> There is no evidence that God healed anyone, no matter what their >> religion. > I disagree. I know people that have been healed. Correct - people who have been healed. Nobody is denying that. The point you persist in failing to deal with is the "by God" part. You fail, consistently, to show that God even exists, let alone was involved. Try again. -- Religion IS part of our evolution (now a vestigial organ). -Bob Burcham Quote
Guest Martin Phipps Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 On Jun 11, 12:47 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <1181469394.462447.51...@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin > > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > On Jun 10, 1:55 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > Since testimony is considered as evidence in court, I also consider the > > > testimony of Cheryl Prewitt as evidence. If you do not consider her > > > testimony as evidence, that is your choice. Have you provided in evidence > > > that indicates that it is possible for bacteria to naturally evolve into > > > an animal cell? > > > Physical evidence trumps testimony, Jason. It's the only thing that > > can be double checked and verified. > > That is true but would you acknowledge that testimony is also evidence? Not if the person giving the testimony is a "fucking moron" as you'd say. Martin Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 In article <DipthotDipthot-FBD374.13472010062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > In article > <Jason-1006070954070001@66-52-22-97.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > I still believe she is telling the truth. > > Of course you do. The voices in your head told you to. She came to our church and gave her testimony. She was a teenage girl. The other students teased her because she limped when she walked. That is the reason she asked God to heal her. She wanted to have a normal life. Is there anything wrong with a teenage girl wanting to have a normal life? The beauty contests came later in her life. She knows that she would never have won any of those beauty contests if God had not healed her. As a result of becoming Miss America, many doors were opened to her. She has witnessed to thousands of people. I could not help but laugh when someone told me that she lied about the healing. Of couse, she is telling the truth. Do you think that she faked a limp so that she could later claim that she was healed? The bottom line is that atheists would never believe that she was healed by God even if she produced a mountain of physical evidence to prove it. The reason is because a healing by God does not "fit" their belief system. However, they need no evidence to believe that a single cell (example: bacteria) evolved into a single animal cell (with DNA nucleus capable of sexual reproduction). Jason Quote
Guest Martin Phipps Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 On Jun 11, 12:53 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <1181469497.952758.49...@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com>, Martin > > > > > > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > On Jun 10, 1:23 pm, Free Lunch <l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > > > I've told you that not everything someone tells you can qualify as > > > testimony in court. Speculation about causes when you have no evidence > > > to support your speculation would be one such form of testimony that > > > would be barred in court. > > > > Cheryl Prewitt's guesses about what happened to her leg would never be > > > allowed in court, so you need to stop trying to claim that her opinion > > > matters. It doesn't. > > > Besides, it's very, very easy to stick one foot out in front of > > another and make it look as though one were longer than the other. > > Try it. If you were doped up on pain killers you can even fool > > yourself. Then you might set out to fool others. > In her testimony, she told us that she limped until after she was healed. > The students in her school teased her. Then she was lying. You people do it all the time because you think it will make a good story. It's not evidence in any way shape or form. You don't trust the word of scientists around the world but you trust the word of one crazy Godbot just simply because you also are a crazy Godbot. That's the highest form of prejudice and it just demonstrates how much you venemously hate rational people. Martin Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 In article <0%Zai.1096$R9.791@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1006071256480001@66-52-22-1.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <70mtj4-umv.ln1@spanky.localhost.net>, Kelsey Bjarnason > > <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote: > > > >> [snips] > >> > >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 20:48:39 -0700, Jason wrote: > >> > >> > Kelsey, > >> > In response to another post, I decided to google this term: BEFORE THE > >> > BIG > >> > BANG. > >> > >> And you found one as-yet unverified mathematical model. One which, I > >> should note, says that if the concept of "before the BB" is established > >> as > >> meaningful, it tosses you right into another universe... thus negating > >> the > >> need for God to explain the BB or the cosmic egg. > >> > >> Bully for you; you've just removed yet another gap to sneak God into. > >> Not > >> sure the point you were trying to achieve, but somehow I suspect that > >> wasn't it. > > > > Do you still believe that no experts believe that time did not exist prior > > to the Big Bang? > > I still know the scientific consensus is that there was no time before the > big bang. That is true. There will be even better theories in the years to come. Scientists know that the only way to win a Nobel Prize is by coming up with a newer and better theory. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1006071632060001@66-52-22-36.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <Ek_ai.1113$R9.8@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-0906072006580001@66-52-22-86.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article >> > <DipthotDipthot-E33034.16000109062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> > >> >> In article >> >> <Jason-0906071313520001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> > In article >> >> > <DipthotDipthot-294445.11505509062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > > In article >> >> > > <Jason-0906071219110001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> > > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > > >> >> > > > What caused that leg to get longer if God did not heal her? >> >> > > >> >> > > Ahem. >> >> > > >> >> > > You are assuming that we accept your telling of the story. >> >> > > >> >> > > I, for one, do not. Provide an authoritative source to support >> >> > > it. >> >> > > Otherwise, my position is one of doubt. >> >> > >> >> > Do you believe the lady (a former Miss America) was lying when she >> >> > stated >> >> > that she was healed by God? >> >> >> >> Was I unclear? I repeat: You are assuming that we accept your telling >> >> of the alleged story. >> >> >> >> > If not, how do you explain why her legs are now the same size? >> >> >> >> I guess I was unclear. >> >> >> >> Look, fellow: You have not proven yourself a reliable source of fact >> >> about anything. You have shown yourself to be a fan of liars. Why >> >> should anyone trust that you have a story about a beauty queen and her >> >> magic leg? >> > >> > I copy and pasted the story from a website. If you think that I am not >> > telling the truth about Cheryl Prewitt--google that name. One of the of >> > members of this newsgroup told me that he googled her name and the >> > result >> > was over 700 websites. Cheryl Prewitt is a former Miss America. >> >> It is her story that lacks evidence that I question. I would ask for >> evidence from anyone who told me such a story. > > I posted a report related to her testimony--that is all of the evidence > that I have. If you want more evidence, visit those 700 website. It would > be waste of time for me to search for medical evidence since atheists > still would not be convinced that God healed her since they don't believe > in God. Without a shred of evidence you are exactly right. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1006071622440001@66-52-22-36.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <6i_ai.1111$R9.256@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-0906072014530001@66-52-22-86.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <8kdm63t5jf41ougrgl7o47pmd7ams2ofkg@4ax.com>, Free Lunch >> > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> > >> >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 17:06:02 -0700, in alt.atheism >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> <Jason-0906071706030001@66-52-22-81.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >In article <0g9m63t8iakctu9orvkjpa1msg390daulc@4ax.com>, Free Lunch >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 15:06:01 -0700, in alt.atheism >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> >> <Jason-0906071506020001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >> >In article <li3m63djdskll0r6g1am2pr4mm92vela03@4ax.com>, Free >> >> >> >Lunch >> >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 14:13:26 -0700, in alt.atheism >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> >> >> <Jason-0906071413260001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >> >> >In article <j8vl63dgeb7gaek2iucf548hn3td0kqicc@4ax.com>, Free >> >> >> >> >Lunch >> >> >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 12:19:10 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism >> >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> >> >> >> <Jason-0906071219110001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ... >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >What caused that leg to get longer if God did not heal her? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Natural processes. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> God has never claimed credit for anything. People make >> >> >> >> >> unsupported >> >> >> >> >> assertions on His behalf. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >Do you have any evidence that anyone else (other than Cheryl >> > Prewitt) has >> >> >> >> >had a leg that was 2 or more inches shorter than the other leg >> > grow to the >> >> >> >> >point that it was identical to the size of the other leg. I >> >> >> >> >know >> > someone >> >> >> >> >that has one leg that is shorter than the other leg. One of his >> > shoes is a >> >> >> >> >platform shoe. Despite wearing that special shoe, he limps when >> > he walks. >> >> >> >> >Why has his short leg not grown to the point that it is >> >> >> >> >identical >> > to the >> >> >> >> >size of his other leg? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I don't have evidence that Cheryl Prewitt had a leg that was 2 >> >> >> >> inches >> >> >> >> shorter and grew to the same length. I have an assertion about >> >> >> >> something >> >> >> >> that happened under what are described as unusual circumstances. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> If God did this, as you assert, why is He so evil to other >> >> >> >> people? >> >> >> >> Why >> >> >> >> does He refuse to answer their prayers? Why doesn't He allow you >> >> >> >> to >> >> >> >> learn about science? >> >> >> > >> >> >> >Do you believe that Cheryl Prewitt is lying about her healing? >> >> >> > >> >> >> I have no evidence that she actually said this or that anything >> >> >> about >> >> >> it >> >> >> was true. >> >> > >> >> >This information was taken from the report that I posted yesterday: >> >> >> >> That's not the same as evidence. Don't keep repeating it. I asked for >> >> evidence. You've offered stories. >> >> >> >> >> >> >After a car accident at age 11, Cheryl Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Fri, 08 Jun 2007 15:48:12 -0700, Jason wrote: > I have detected the presence of the spirit of hate in some of the posts in > this thread. However, not all atheists have developed the spirit of hate. > It's possible that they attack me since I am a follower of God. If there's any attacking going on, it is out of frustration at your steadfast refusal to think or to apply even the minimal standards of basic honesty. -- “My impression of young-earthers, FWIW, is that they are not New Testament people at all, but rather Old Testament people. Their God is not a God of mercy and forgivenness and transcendence; rather, their God is a merciless authoritarian who will send people to Hell for the slightest infraction. At the risk of being completely tactless, it is my fervent wish that someday young-earthers will become Christians.” -- Keith Knapp Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1006071621010001@66-52-22-36.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <29_ai.1100$R9.677@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-1006071257370001@66-52-22-1.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <bg8o63lsgkbuk6ioqc8gr4lcjga1roruqt@4ax.com>, Free Lunch >> > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> > >> >> On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 09:47:58 -0700, in alt.atheism >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> <Jason-1006070947590001@66-52-22-97.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >In article <1181469394.462447.51330@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >Martin >> >> >Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> On Jun 10, 1:55 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> > Since testimony is considered as evidence in court, I also >> >> >> > consider >> >> >> > the >> >> >> > testimony of Cheryl Prewitt as evidence. If you do not consider >> >> >> > her >> >> >> > testimony as evidence, that is your choice. Have you provided in >> >> >> > evidence >> >> >> > that indicates that it is possible for bacteria to naturally >> >> >> > evolve >> >> >> > into >> >> >> > an animal cell? >> >> >> >> >> >> Physical evidence trumps testimony, Jason. It's the only thing >> >> >> that >> >> >> can be double checked and verified. >> >> >> >> >> >> Martin >> >> > >> >> >That is true but would you acknowledge that testimony is also >> >> >evidence? >> >> > >> >> Made up stories are not evidence. >> > >> > Is a testimony evidence? >> >> I'm sure as savvy as you are you have heard the old adage, extraordinary >> claims require extraordinary evidence. No Jason, for someone to claim >> such a >> ridiculous story is true requires more than their oral testimony. > > That is an excellent answer. If Cheryl Prewitt produced all of her medical > records (eg X Rays) and written statements from the medical staff that > were present when the doctor removed two inches of a leg bone--do you > believe that atheists would conceed that God healed her? > > My answer is NO--the reason--it does not fit their "belief system" to > believe that God healed her. They don't believe in God. They believe the > evidence that supports their belief system and do NOT accept or believe > evidence that does not support their belief system. Then as you have admitted above, there is no evidence that god healed her. That's all I have been saying all along. Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Fri, 08 Jun 2007 16:02:06 -0700, Jason wrote: > I know a lady that had one leg that was longer than the other leg. Yes, yes, she was healed. Marvelous. Now please demonstrate that God even exists; if you cannot show this, then you have no basis for saying God did anything. -- Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups. Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 20:06:58 -0700, Jason wrote: >> Look, fellow: You have not proven yourself a reliable source of fact >> about anything. You have shown yourself to be a fan of liars. Why >> should anyone trust that you have a story about a beauty queen and her >> magic leg? > > I copy and pasted the story from a website. And, of course, nobody ever posts anything but 100% absolute truth on a web site, right? -- “Then Hector, after I stuff it, would you please kiss my Holy, royal red American, Christian ass? Then I will do like Jesus said, I will turn the other cheek so you can kiss it to, you pompous little geek. Get a life.” -- Johnny Mckinney Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 In article <29_ai.1100$R9.677@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1006071257370001@66-52-22-1.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <bg8o63lsgkbuk6ioqc8gr4lcjga1roruqt@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > > >> On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 09:47:58 -0700, in alt.atheism > >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> <Jason-1006070947590001@66-52-22-97.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >In article <1181469394.462447.51330@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, > >> >Martin > >> >Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> > > >> >> On Jun 10, 1:55 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> > >> >> > Since testimony is considered as evidence in court, I also consider > >> >> > the > >> >> > testimony of Cheryl Prewitt as evidence. If you do not consider her > >> >> > testimony as evidence, that is your choice. Have you provided in > >> >> > evidence > >> >> > that indicates that it is possible for bacteria to naturally evolve > >> >> > into > >> >> > an animal cell? > >> >> > >> >> Physical evidence trumps testimony, Jason. It's the only thing that > >> >> can be double checked and verified. > >> >> > >> >> Martin > >> > > >> >That is true but would you acknowledge that testimony is also evidence? > >> > > >> Made up stories are not evidence. > > > > Is a testimony evidence? > > I'm sure as savvy as you are you have heard the old adage, extraordinary > claims require extraordinary evidence. No Jason, for someone to claim such a > ridiculous story is true requires more than their oral testimony. That is an excellent answer. If Cheryl Prewitt produced all of her medical records (eg X Rays) and written statements from the medical staff that were present when the doctor removed two inches of a leg bone--do you believe that atheists would conceed that God healed her? My answer is NO--the reason--it does not fit their "belief system" to believe that God healed her. They don't believe in God. They believe the evidence that supports their belief system and do NOT accept or believe evidence that does not support their belief system. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 In article <6i_ai.1111$R9.256@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-0906072014530001@66-52-22-86.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <8kdm63t5jf41ougrgl7o47pmd7ams2ofkg@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > > >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 17:06:02 -0700, in alt.atheism > >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> <Jason-0906071706030001@66-52-22-81.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >In article <0g9m63t8iakctu9orvkjpa1msg390daulc@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> > > >> >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 15:06:01 -0700, in alt.atheism > >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> <Jason-0906071506020001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >In article <li3m63djdskll0r6g1am2pr4mm92vela03@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 14:13:26 -0700, in alt.atheism > >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> >> <Jason-0906071413260001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >> >In article <j8vl63dgeb7gaek2iucf548hn3td0kqicc@4ax.com>, Free > >> >> >> >Lunch > >> >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 12:19:10 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> >> >> <Jason-0906071219110001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >> > >> >> >> ... > >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >What caused that leg to get longer if God did not heal her? > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> Natural processes. > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> God has never claimed credit for anything. People make > >> >> >> >> unsupported > >> >> >> >> assertions on His behalf. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >Do you have any evidence that anyone else (other than Cheryl > > Prewitt) has > >> >> >> >had a leg that was 2 or more inches shorter than the other leg > > grow to the > >> >> >> >point that it was identical to the size of the other leg. I know > > someone > >> >> >> >that has one leg that is shorter than the other leg. One of his > > shoes is a > >> >> >> >platform shoe. Despite wearing that special shoe, he limps when > > he walks. > >> >> >> >Why has his short leg not grown to the point that it is identical > > to the > >> >> >> >size of his other leg? > >> >> >> > >> >> >> I don't have evidence that Cheryl Prewitt had a leg that was 2 > >> >> >> inches > >> >> >> shorter and grew to the same length. I have an assertion about > >> >> >> something > >> >> >> that happened under what are described as unusual circumstances. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> If God did this, as you assert, why is He so evil to other people? > >> >> >> Why > >> >> >> does He refuse to answer their prayers? Why doesn't He allow you to > >> >> >> learn about science? > >> >> > > >> >> >Do you believe that Cheryl Prewitt is lying about her healing? > >> >> > > >> >> I have no evidence that she actually said this or that anything about > >> >> it > >> >> was true. > >> > > >> >This information was taken from the report that I posted yesterday: > >> > >> That's not the same as evidence. Don't keep repeating it. I asked for > >> evidence. You've offered stories. > >> > >> >> >> >After a car accident at age 11, Cheryl Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 14:13:26 -0700, Jason wrote: > Do you have any evidence that anyone else (other than Cheryl Prewitt) has > had a leg that was 2 or more inches shorter than the other leg grow to the > point that it was identical to the size of the other leg. Do we need it? No. Since God is wholly unevidenced, there is no basis for claiming God's involvement. Once you demonstrate God exists, then, maybe, you'll have a basis for making claims about what he did. Until then all you have is "I don't know why it happened" - which demonstrates ignorance , not gods. Try again. -- Maybe He did say something and it just was not recorded. -- Steve Bedard Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 20:14:53 -0700, Jason wrote: > A testimony is evidence in court houses in America almost every week day. > Her testimony is evidence. Even in courts, testimony is regarded as the least reliable source, as people lie, forget, misremember and on and on and on. They also tend to say things that are simply not supported by fact. A perfect example of that last bit is you - or her - claiming her leg was healed by God. Yes, fine, her leg healed, we'll buy that for the nonce, but you haven't demonstrated that God even exists, so any testimony that it was healed _by God_ is simply not supported by the facts, and thus is discarded. Feel free to demonstrate God exists. Until you do, you have no basis to claim he did anything. -- I see that you weren’t fully debugged before release. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 In article <hpso631b7f6gshd7pap15la4h7shjbu199@4ax.com>, Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > In alt.atheism On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 12:28:02 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > (Jason) let us all know that: > > >In article <pb1o63pqlmfbbjub4g86db20g119obqair@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > > > >> In alt.atheism On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 21:14:26 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > >> (Jason) let us all know that: > >> > >> >In article <12pm63dcjnuunio4aknb4i84ruo5v05diq@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > >> ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > >> > > >> >> In alt.atheism On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 13:05:09 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > >> >> (Jason) let us all know that: > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >I will tell you the reason I mentioned the 12 percent figure in several > >> >posts. > >> >> >People (in various posts) were attempting to marginalize me. People in > >> >> >various posts stated or at least implied that most people believed that > >> >> >mankind evolved from lower life forms without involvement from God. I knew > >> >> >that was not true but had no data to back it up. When I found out that > >> >> >only 12 percent of Americans believed that mankind evolved from lower life > >> >> >forms without involvement from God, I decided to post the figure everytime > >> >> >someone else attempted to marginalize me and by opinions related to > >> >> >abiogenesis. > >> >> > >> >> That's just means that 12% of the people are fucking morons. > >> > > >> > > >> >Don, > >> >I agree with you. > >> >Jason > >> > > >> Hey--wow. I get a response from you when I throw out some bait > >> for you. Look at that. Of course, you realize, I don't think that 12% > >> of the people are morons, but it's just something to get you to > >> respond. > >> > >> Now then: why haven't you responded to my answers to those 20 > >> questions? And why do you think the number of people who believe > >> something has anything to do with the truth of that thing? > >> > > >I thanked you for responding. > > And what do you have to say about my responses? > > > > The reason I posted the 12 percent number > >was because several people tried to marginalize me. > > You are. > > > Don 12 percent agree with you related to one aspect of evolution theory. 88 percent agree with me related to that same aspect of evolution theory. Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 22:55:12 -0700, Jason wrote: > Since testimony is considered as evidence in court, The least reliable source of information, useful only when consistent with and backed up by, actual facts. Fact: for your story to hold up, it would require God to exist. Fact: you have not demonstrated God exists. Fact: therefore you have no backing for the story. Fact: to assert that "God dunnit", without demonstrating God even exists, is to lie. Now, we know you're a liar, but really, don't pretend we're too stupid to see through your bullshit. We can. -- Pssss! Jesus is dead. Pass it on. - David Rice Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Fri, 08 Jun 2007 20:55:07 -0700, Jason wrote: >> You forgot to point out how God was involved. >> >> I assume that is because you have absolutely no evidence that God was >> involved. > > How do you explain why her legs are now the same size? Because I said they should be, and caused them to magically grow to equal length. My proof? The very same you give for your claim that God dunnit - not a single shred. Now, since you believe, absolutely, in claims without a shred of evidence, you will, of course, immediately believe that I was, in fact, responsible for her healing. Any other course requires that you invalidate your own standard of "evidence", namely accepting any half-assed claim that comes along as long as there's no justification for doing so. So, which way do you lie? Do you lie by asserting that it really was God, just cuz? Do you lie by pretending that her saying it was God means anything? Do you lie by invalidating your own position and expecting me to demonstrate I was responsible? Or do you pick a different mode of lying? -- They did not evolve. They were artifically genetically altered. - Ronald Stringfellow (Ass of god) Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 In article <Ek_ai.1113$R9.8@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-0906072006580001@66-52-22-86.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article > > <DipthotDipthot-E33034.16000109062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > > > >> In article > >> <Jason-0906071313520001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> > >> > In article > >> > <DipthotDipthot-294445.11505509062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > >> > > >> > > In article > >> > > <Jason-0906071219110001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > >> > > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> > > > >> > > > What caused that leg to get longer if God did not heal her? > >> > > > >> > > Ahem. > >> > > > >> > > You are assuming that we accept your telling of the story. > >> > > > >> > > I, for one, do not. Provide an authoritative source to support it. > >> > > Otherwise, my position is one of doubt. > >> > > >> > Do you believe the lady (a former Miss America) was lying when she > >> > stated > >> > that she was healed by God? > >> > >> Was I unclear? I repeat: You are assuming that we accept your telling > >> of the alleged story. > >> > >> > If not, how do you explain why her legs are now the same size? > >> > >> I guess I was unclear. > >> > >> Look, fellow: You have not proven yourself a reliable source of fact > >> about anything. You have shown yourself to be a fan of liars. Why > >> should anyone trust that you have a story about a beauty queen and her > >> magic leg? > > > > I copy and pasted the story from a website. If you think that I am not > > telling the truth about Cheryl Prewitt--google that name. One of the of > > members of this newsgroup told me that he googled her name and the result > > was over 700 websites. Cheryl Prewitt is a former Miss America. > > It is her story that lacks evidence that I question. I would ask for > evidence from anyone who told me such a story. I posted a report related to her testimony--that is all of the evidence that I have. If you want more evidence, visit those 700 website. It would be waste of time for me to search for medical evidence since atheists still would not be convinced that God healed her since they don't believe in God. Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 12:36:06 -0400, Mike wrote: > Strange that there's so little information on such an amazing event. Isn't it, though? I mean, really, if there were an honest-to-goodness, real-live, provable case of a miracle healing, why isn't every Christian in the world screaming this from here to the end of time, as some sort of absolute proof of God? Oh, right, because it's a steaming load of crap. -- “When did you decide to be arrogant?” - Ken Young “The day after I decided that meek people deserve what they get.” --- Preston Simpson Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 10, 2007 Posted June 10, 2007 [snips] On Sat, 09 Jun 2007 14:42:20 -0700, Jason wrote: >> Gish is a liar and you believe him. Why would I believe your story >> about Prewitt? What evidence is there that her story, if you relayed it >> correctly, is correct? > Her testimony is enough evidence for me. That wasn't the question. You are a known liar, and you hold up as respect-worthy other known liars, meaning that nobody can take anything you say as valid. Since you are, in fact, known to associate with known liars and even accept lying as perfectly acceptable behavior, this suggests that anyone you report on may well also be just as much of a liar as you or your other cohorts. Hence the question - why should we believe her ? -- Most the Dutch women I associate with have a sense of humor • Jim Staal At 30 guilders an hour, they had better. Then again, seeing who their John is... of course they do... -- Richard Smith Quote
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