Guest Free Lunch Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:40:34 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-1506071540340001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <1wCci.267$P8.79@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" ><mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-1506071200360001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... .... >> > We don't know. We are hoping that it will be soon. >> >> Well read the damn verses Jason, they say it will be soon. Just for your >> information, two thousand years isn't 'soon'. Before you go into a 'we don't >> know how soon it is in god's time' defense, read the verses and tell me when >> you think Jesus said he would come. Just one more of literally thousands of >> reasons to conclude that your god doesn't exist. > >Some of the prophecies related to the last days did not come true until >the past 10 to 20 years. Here is one of them: >2 Tim 4:3-5 > >For the time will come when [Christians] will not endure sound doctrine; >but after their own lusts shall heap to themselves teachers [and >preachers]. Those [preachers] will teach them not what the truth is but >instead what they want to hear > >My comment: That prophecy has come true in my life time. There is one >church in California called Unity Fellowship. The preachers are more like >psychologists than real preachers. There is a television show that is >broadcast on Sunday morning called the "Hour of Power". The preacher never >discusses Bible doctrines. He teaches messages related to psychology and >sociology. I have never heard him preach messages from the Bible. >Jason Jason, Christians have been claiming that they were in the last days ever since Christianity began. Your ignorance of history betrays you and gives you the foolish idea that only recently have these 'signs' been fulfilled. Once again I have to wonder if you are really a Christian. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <4672fa8c$0$20560$4c368faf@roadrunner.com>, "Christopher Morris" <Draccus@roadrunner.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1506071227220001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <NDyci.165$W9.27@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > Someone was trying to convince me that Allah and Jehovah were the same > > God. My point was that the Bible clearly states that Israel is the > > homeland for Jews. The Muslims believe that Israel should be under the > > control of Muslims. If they had the same God, they would only have one > > holy book. In this case, they have the Koran and we have the Old Testament > > and the New Testament. > > jason > > The > > > > Jason has been pointed out to you Allah is the Arabic word for God nothing > more nothing less. The Jews do not say the name of God at all, and > Christians just use the generic term God. Both the Christian and the Muslim > are offshoots of Judaism so you both have Jewish roots and all three groups > are in fact worshipping the same God. Furthermore you are also all > worshiping the same Ultimate God of all other Faiths as well as St. > Augustine said in "The City of God" the God we worship " is the God whom > Porphyry, the most learned of philosophers, although the fiercest of enemy > of the Christian, acknowledges to be a Great God..." Furthermore, the Pagan > Maximus of Tyre wrote: "In the midst of such contention and strife, and > disagreement you would see in all the earth one harmonious law and principle > that there is one God, king and father of all, and many gods, sons of God, > fellow rulers with God. The Greek says this and the barbarian says it, the > mainlander and the seafarer, the wise and the unwise." We have a different point of view related to this subject. I have read some of quotations from the Quran and found out that there are MAJOR differences between the Koran and the Bible. Here is just one example: From the Quran: Fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every strategem (of war). Surah 9:5 "...cutting off of hands and feet...." Surah 5:33 Needless to say, you will not find words like that in the New Testament. Jesus said, "Love your neighbor as yourself". Jesus never taught his followers to cut off the hands and feet of pagans or to slay pagans. Jason Quote
Guest gudloos@yahoo.com Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 On 15 Jun., 17:54, "Robibnikoff" <witchy...@broomstick.com> wrote: > <gudl...@yahoo.com> wrote in message > > news:1181909537.136427.148470@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com... > On 14 Jun., 18:11, "Robibnikoff" <witchy...@broomstick.com> wrote: > > > > > > > <gudl...@yahoo.com> wrote in message > > >news:1181831696.476643.218550@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com... > > > > On 14 Jun., 16:25, "Robibnikoff" <witchy...@broomstick.com> wrote: > > >> "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote in > > > >> snip > > > >> > No--not really. I now avoid going to the beach. It was easier in the > > >> > old > > >> > days when women wore 1 piece bathing suits. Have you been to a beach > > >> > or > > >> > swimming pool in recent years? > > > >> Are you turned off by women's bodies? > > >> -- > > >> Robyn > > >> Resident Witchypoo > > >> BAAWA Knight! > > >> #1557 > > > > I wonder how the poor schmuck would act on our beaches. Nudity is not > > > the rule, but it is very common. Of course it is very dangerous. One > > > hears that men have gotten er you know one of those really nasty > > > things. That really upsets me. In fact my entire body shivers and I > > > breathe fast and I....Oh never mind. > > > LOL! You okay, hon? > > -- > > Robyn > > Resident Witchypoo > > BAAWA Knight! > > #1557- Skjul tekst i anf Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 11:46:45 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-1506071146450001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <fHyci.169$W9.109@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" ><mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-1406072012490001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... .... >> > I am convinced that people only believe things that "fit" their belief >> > system. That is the reason I believed Cheryl Prewitt and William A. Kent. >> > It also explains the reason that atheists did not believe that God healed >> > Cheryl Prewitt and William A. Kent. It also explains why the rich man's >> > brothers (mentioned in Luke 16:19-21) would not have listened to the rich >> > man--even if he had returned from the dead. Do you agree or disagree? >> >> Quit attempting to open secondary discussions, Jason, it is dishonest. >> Everyone examines anything in light of their worldview. Some of us are able >> to see the truth even though we might be looking at something that is >> diametrically opposed to our worldview. Others can't see the splinter for >> the log. > >The advocates of creation science are able to do the same thing. > To do what? You didn't have a meaningful antecedent. I know that the advocates of creation science refuse to learn science or admit the facts that they know about, so you cannot possibly be saying that they are willing to look at the scientific evidence. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <GsCci.266$P8.179@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1506071212400001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <Lsyci.160$W9.143@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> news:Jason-1406072027180001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> > In article <j2t373d3n0dafs1r9ffao27cp6i1hi7qft@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > >> > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> > > >> >> On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 19:47:26 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> <Jason-1406071947270001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >In article <e4c37352rsu9akoeoi2jld8sdh7bpn28n3@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >> On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 01:35:14 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> >> <Jason-1406070135150001@66-52-22-114.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >> >In article <0c41731qbu3l8n3j7rhumqe3vmdvf5rvs7@4ax.com>, Free > >> >> >> >Lunch > >> >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 00:22:57 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> >> >> <Jason-1306070022570001@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >> >> >In article > >> > <1181708123.776350.23860@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>, Martin > >> >> >> >> ><phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> On Jun 13, 11:59 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> > In article > >> >> >> >> >> > <1181695356.967104.238...@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>, > >> >> >> >Martin > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> ... > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > > By the way, Genesis 1 says "El" created the universe and > >> > mankind but > >> >> >> >> >> > > Genesis 2 says it was "Yahweh". > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > Do you have the verses? El may be one of the many names of > >> >> >> >> >> > God. > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> In fact, Genesis 1 talks about the Elohim, which means > >> >> >> >> >> "gods", > >> >> >> >> >> in > >> >> >> >> >> plural. (e.g. Genesis 6:2, "... the sons of Elohim saw the > >> >> >> >> >> daughters > >> >> >> >> >> of men that they were fair; and they took them for wives... > >> >> >> >> >> ,") > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> Martin > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >This is in reference to the intermarriage among the Cainites > >> >> >> >> >and > >> > Sethites. > >> >> >> >> >The Cainites were sinful, evil people and the Sethites were > >> >> >> >> >devoted and > >> >> >> >> >consecrated to God. God became very upset with the Sethites for > >> >> >> >> >taking > >> >> >> >> >Cainite women as their wives since God wanted them to only > >> >> >> >> >marry > >> > Sethite > >> >> >> >> >women. > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >I copied most of the above info. from a footnote in my study > >> >> >> >> >Bible. > >> >> >> >> >Jason > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> The authors of your study bible note were making it up. They > >> >> >> >> have > >> >> >> >> no > >> >> >> >> evidence at all that their claim is correct. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >Should I believe you or the words of the W.A. Chriswell, Ph.D--the > >> >> >> >editor > >> >> >> >of my study Bible or yourself--take a guess on my choice. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> I know that you would be mistaken to believe those who make things > >> >> >> up > >> >> >> like this, but I also know that you have a demonstrated willingness > >> >> >> to > >> >> >> be led astray by those who tell you what you want to hear. > >> >> >> Chriswell > >> >> >> does not have _any_ evidence that "this is in reference to the > >> >> >> intermarriage among the Cainites and Sethites." > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Deal with facts. > >> >> > > >> >> >I have no reason to doubt Dr. Chriswell. > >> >> > > >> >> That's because you reject the whole concept of evidence. Anyone can > >> >> tell > >> >> you any lie as long as they claim God wants it. > >> >> > >> >> Still, I wouldn't be surprised if you misrepresented what Chriswell > >> >> said, you do have a long track record of misunderstanding what others > >> >> are trying to tell you and misrepresenting these things to others. > >> > > >> > Buy or read the Criswell Study Bible and see the evidence for yourself. > >> > >> I have many books on the study of the bible. I question each and every > >> one > >> when I read them. I then form my own conclusion on what I read. You could > >> use a little objective analysis. > > > > I have two study Bibles. One of them did not have a footnote about the > > scripture in question. I have a Bible dictionary but it was poorly written > > since many words that I have searched for are not in the dictionary. My > > 1000 page concordance has been really helpful. > > Jason > > What you need are a few books on textual criticism. That'll open your eyes. > Well, it would on an ordinary person. I once knew someone that had such a book. He loved to discuss various scriptures that he found in that book. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:03:10 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-1506071503110001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: .... >I doubt that is true. Who makes them sign the pledge? Ask the ICR, CRS and AIG. The ICR tells us that they won't let something as silly as facts get in the way of their teaching of doctrine: <http://icr.org/home/faq/> and scroll down a bit. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 14:59:20 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-1506071459200001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <5dg7koF34ssfaU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" ><witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in >> >> snip >> > >> > In the case of Cheryl Prewitt, the main witness would be Cheryl Prewitt. I >> > believed the testimony of Cheryl Prewitt. >> >> Why? > >After hearing her entire testimony, I found no reason to not believe her. >She mentioned how the children in her school teased her because of her >limp. One poster told me that she probably faked the limp so that she >could later claim that she was healed. That post made be laugh. Over the >years, I have heard lots of testimonies from people that were healed by >God. I recently heard a story about a man that was healed of brain cancer. >I did not need to see the brain scans to believe the story. >Jason > So you believe someone who is telling you a nearly unbelievable story without any actual evidence just because she is pretty and tells you that she is a Christian. You make Christians look bad. Quote
Guest Robibnikoff Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1506071459200001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <5dg7koF34ssfaU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" > <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in >> >> snip >> > >> > In the case of Cheryl Prewitt, the main witness would be Cheryl >> > Prewitt. I >> > believed the testimony of Cheryl Prewitt. >> >> Why? > > After hearing her entire testimony, I found no reason to not believe her. Why not? > She mentioned how the children in her school teased her because of her > limp. One poster told me that she probably faked the limp so that she > could later claim that she was healed. That post made be laugh. Over the > years, I have heard lots of testimonies from people that were healed by > God. I recently heard a story about a man that was healed of brain cancer. > I did not need to see the brain scans to believe the story. Why not? You seem to be easily duped. -- Robyn Resident Witchypoo BAAWA Knight! #1557 Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <1wCci.267$P8.79@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1506071200360001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <rpyci.158$W9.85@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> news:Jason-1406072142060001@66-52-22-95.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> > In article <1181876768.410178.262080@g37g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, > >> > Martin > >> > Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> > > >> >> On 6 15 , 6 15 , J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> > > > Bramble, > >> >> > > > You explained your point of view very well. Please tell me > >> >> > > > whether > >> >> > > > you > >> >> > > > think the other members of this newsgroup view abiogenesis as a > >> >> > > > theory > >> >> > > > that will be discarded when a better theory is developed? > >> >> > > >> >> > > I dont know. Most of the people interested in science know that > >> >> > > theories can be discarded if there are reasons to do it. Many > >> >> > > science > >> >> > > theories are defended > >> >> > > with passion, in a similar way religious people defend their > >> >> > > dogmas. > >> >> > > But if the persona has a basic knowledge of how science works, > >> >> > > then > >> >> > > he > >> >> > > knows that any theory is a temporary way to explain something. We > >> >> > > like to have answers, theories that explain phenomena. Sometimes, > >> >> > > we > >> >> > > have not the slightess idea about a subject, but sometimes it > >> >> > > seems > >> >> > > that we have attractive ideas. We like them and put passion to > >> >> > > defend > >> >> > > them. We are humans, remember? We like to have answers. > >> >> > > >> >> > > What you say about fundamentalist churches, I don't like it a > >> >> > > little > >> >> > > bit. You are working a lot to create the party of god. You want > >> >> > > to > >> >> > > reconquer the state, and to found a fundamentalist dictatorship. > >> >> > > And > >> >> > > these are very bad news for me. > >> >> > > Hitler started with much less that you, and look at the misery and > >> >> > > death he begot. You are creating the very foundations for the > >> >> > > next > >> >> > > civil war in the US. > >> >> > > Bramble > >> >> > > >> >> > Bramble, > >> >> > You have nothing to fear from Christians. You have much more to fear > >> >> > from > >> >> > the Moslems that want to take over the world. > >> >> > >> >> As if Christians don't want to take over the world! > >> >> > >> >> Martin > >> > > >> > Martin, > >> > Not until Jesus comes back to establish his kingdom on the earth. In > >> > the > >> > mean time, we have no plans to take over the world. The Muslims do plan > >> > to > >> > take over the world ASAP. They are in the process of taking over the > >> > Sudan. > >> > Jason > >> > >> When will he come, Jason? The bible says he will come 'soon'( my thanks > >> to > >> Jerry for this accumulation): > > > > We don't know. We are hoping that it will be soon. > > Well read the damn verses Jason, they say it will be soon. Just for your > information, two thousand years isn't 'soon'. Before you go into a 'we don't > know how soon it is in god's time' defense, read the verses and tell me when > you think Jesus said he would come. Just one more of literally thousands of > reasons to conclude that your god doesn't exist. Some of the prophecies related to the last days did not come true until the past 10 to 20 years. Here is one of them: 2 Tim 4:3-5 For the time will come when [Christians] will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall heap to themselves teachers [and preachers]. Those [preachers] will teach them not what the truth is but instead what they want to hear My comment: That prophecy has come true in my life time. There is one church in California called Unity Fellowship. The preachers are more like psychologists than real preachers. There is a television show that is broadcast on Sunday morning called the "Hour of Power". The preacher never discusses Bible doctrines. He teaches messages related to psychology and sociology. I have never heard him preach messages from the Bible. Jason > > >> > >> LOL. Depends on what the definition of "is" is? Don't attempt to > >> > parse words to wiggle out of what the verses mean and furthermore, what > >> > they mean IN CONTEXT. > >> > > >> > Let's try this a little more in depth. If this doesn't work we can > >> > take each one of these and break them down even more for you. > >> > > >> > > >> > MATTHEW 16 (KJV) > >> > 16:27 > >> > For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his > >> > angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. > >> > > >> > 16:28 > >> > Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not > >> > taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. > >> > > >> > 1 THESSALONIANS 4:15 (NIV) > >> > According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that WE WHO ARE STILL > >> > ALIVE, WE WHO ARE LEFT till the coming of the Lord, will certainly > >> > not precede those who have fallen asleep. > >> > > >> > > >> > Hebrews 10 (NIV) > >> > 36 > >> > You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you > >> > will receive what he has promised. > >> > > >> > 37 > >> > For in just a VERY LITTLE WHILE, "He who is coming will come and WILL > >> > NOT DELAY. > >> > > >> > > >> > JAMES 5:8 (KJV) > >> > Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord > >> > DRAWETH NIGH. > >> > > >> > > >> > I PETER 4:7 (KJV) > >> > But the END OF ALL THINGS IS AT HAND: be ye therefore sober, and watch > >> > unto prayer. > >> > > >> > > >> > I JOHN 2:18 (KJV) > >> > Little children, it is the LAST TIME: and as ye have heard that > >> > antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we > >> > know that it is the last time. > >> > > >> > > >> > REVELATION (KJV) > >> > 1:1 > >> > The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto > >> > his servants things which must SHORTLY COME TO PASS; and he sent and > >> > signified it by his angel unto his servant John: > >> > > >> > 1:3 > >> > Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this > >> > prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the > >> > TIME IS AT HAND. > >> > > >> > 3:11 > >> > Behold, I COME QUICKLY: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man > >> > take thy crown. > >> > > >> > 22:7 > >> > Behold, I COME QUICKLY: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the > >> > prophecy of this book. > >> > > >> > 22:12 > >> > And, behold, I COME QUICKLY; and my reward is with me, to give every > >> > man according as his work shall be. > >> > > >> > 22:20 > >> > He which testifieth these things saith, SURELY I COME QUICKLY. Amen. > >> > Even so, come, Lord Jesus. > >> > > >> > ++++++++++++ > >> > MATTHEW 10:23 (NIV) > >> > When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. I TELL YOU THE > >> > TRUTH, YOU WILL NOT FINISH GOING THROUGH THE CITIES OF ISRAEL BEFORE > >> > THE SON OF MAN COMES. > >> > > >> > COLOSSIANS 1:23 (NIV) > >> > if you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from > >> > the hope held out in the gospel. This is the gospel that you heard > >> > and THAT HAS BEEN PROCLAIMED TO EVERY CREATURE UNDER HEAVEN, and of > >> > which I, Paul, have become a servant. > >> > > >> > Romans 10:18 > >> > "Their voice has gone out into the all the > >> > earth, their words to the ends of the world." > >> > > >> > Matthew 24:14 (NIV) > >> > "And this gospel will be preached in the > >> > whole world as a testimony to all nations, > >> > AND THEN THE END WILL COME." > >> > ++++++++++++ > >> > > > > > Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <YfCci.259$P8.189@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1506071232280001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <f4u6pm$3i7$1@news04.infoave.net>, Mike > > <prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com> wrote: > > > >> Jason wrote: > >> > In article <f4s386$se9$3@news04.infoave.net>, Mike > >> > <prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com> wrote: > >> >> Then by what logic are those who ARE healed "evidence for god?" > >> > > >> > It's a case by case basis. In the case of Cheryl Prewitt and William > >> > Kent, > >> > it is my opinion that it is evidence of God. That does not mean that > >> > all > >> > healings are evidence for God. For example, if someone develops a > >> > common > >> > cold and the man prays--and the cold goes away in three weeks---that is > >> > not evidence for God. > >> > >> I.e. "If I think it's evidence for god, then it's evidence for god. If I > >> don't, then it's not." > > > > Each person has to come to their own conclusions. > > Each person needs to examine the evidence before coming to their own > conclusions. I realize this is counterintuitive for you but you really need > to try it. The advocates of abiogenesis should do the same thing. Some of the advocates of abiogenesis know the difference between speculation and evidence. However, it became apparent to me from reading various posts that some of the advocates of abiogenesis do NOT know the difference between speculation and evidence. One person stated something like this: "We now have living cells so it is logical to conclude that they evolved naturally". That is NOT evidence--it's speculation. Extra-ordinary claims need extra-ordinary evidence--it's not present in regard to abiogenesis. There are at least two other possibilities about how living cells came to be: intelligent design and ancient astronauts. Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <4672ff41$0$30643$4c368faf@roadrunner.com>, "Christopher Morris" <Draccus@roadrunner.com> wrote: > > > > There is a scripture that says something like this: > > God's ways are not our ways. God's thoughts are not our thoughts. > > > > The point is that God has a reason for every action he takes. We don't > > know his reasons. The most that we can do is to make guesses based upon > > various situations. Examples: rainstorm; the healing of Cheryl Prewitt and > > William A. Kent. > > > It is Paul when looking to the scriptures to discover the will of God we all > see through a glass darkly. Yes--that scripture also explains it. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <blDci.283$P8.159@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1506071503110001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <QnCci.263$P8.150@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> news:Jason-1506071146450001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> > In article <fHyci.169$W9.109@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> > > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> >> news:Jason-1406072012490001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> >> > In article > >> >> > <DipthotDipthot-24078C.18333014062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > >> >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >> In article > >> >> >> <Jason-1406070132130001@66-52-22-114.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > In article > >> >> >> > <DipthotDipthot-CCA16E.18144813062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > >> >> >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > In article > >> >> >> > > <Jason-1306071628360001@66-52-22-38.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > >> >> >> > > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > > Bramble, > >> >> >> > > > You are leaving out an important issue--several different > >> >> >> > > > posters > >> >> > told me > >> >> >> > > > that even if I produced info. about physical evidence that > >> >> >> > > > proved > >> >> > her leg > >> >> >> > > > bone grew two inches--they still would not be convinced that > >> >> >> > > > God > >> >> >> > > > healed > >> >> >> > > > her. > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > First off, you are lying again. Skeptics respond to evidence. > >> >> >> > > If > >> >> >> > > reliable evidence is produced of some claim, then the claim > >> >> >> > > becomes > >> >> >> > > more > >> >> >> > > credible as a result... and skeptics will take a step toward > >> >> >> > > being > >> >> >> > > convinced of that claim. > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > Second, you're mixing two things: > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > 1. Whether the leg actually became longer, and > >> >> >> > > 2. Whether some god or gods caused it to happen. (Built into > >> >> >> > > this > >> >> >> > > question is, of course, the question of whether any gods > >> >> >> > > exist.) > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > You believe both. At this point, you have provided reliable > >> >> >> > > evidence > >> >> >> > > of > >> >> >> > > neither . Your second-hand testimony about a verbal claim > >> >> >> > > given > >> >> >> > > in > >> >> >> > > a > >> >> >> > > church is not reliable. > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > Providing evidence for 1 is probably easier than providing > >> >> >> > > evidence > >> >> >> > > for > >> >> >> > > 2. > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > Actually, a THIRD question comes up. Even if you show evidence > >> >> >> > > for 1 > >> >> >> > > and 2, as hard as that will be, your next assignment would be > >> >> >> > > to > >> >> >> > > show > >> >> >> > > evidence for the following claim: > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > 3. That your Biblical god (named "God") was the god that > >> >> >> > > caused > >> >> >> > > it > >> >> >> > > to > >> >> >> > > happen. (Built into that claim, of course, is the claim that > >> >> >> > > this > >> >> >> > > particular god exists.) > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > Got that? Can you see the need to walk us through the evidence > >> >> >> > > for > >> >> >> > > all > >> >> >> > > three claims? > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > Good luck with that. > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > > I ask you Bramble > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > I'm not Bramble, but.... > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > >--what good would it do for me to spend time visiting > >> >> >> > > > websites in search of information about physical evidence? > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > Well, for one, you might learn something yourself. > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > > If you were in my shoes, > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > ...and with your malfunctioning sense of logic? > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > > would you waste time finding evidence? > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > What would make finding evidence a waste of time? > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > Maybe you'd learn that there is none, and that you were wrong > >> >> >> > > all > >> >> >> > > along. > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> > > Don't be afraid that learning such a thing could shake your > >> >> >> > > faith > >> >> >> > > in > >> >> >> > > your god. I know that wouldn't happen. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > I asked at least two people a question like this: > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > If I produced physical evidence that proved that Cheryl's leg > >> >> >> > bone > >> >> >> > grew > >> >> >> > two inches, would you agree that God healed her? > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > Both posters told be that even if I proved that Cheryl's leg bone > >> >> >> > grew > >> >> >> > two > >> >> >> > inches, that it would NOT mean that God healed her. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> And that is a sensible, logical response. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> If you actually paid attention to what I wrote above, you would > >> >> >> understand why. If you could see that claim #1 is separate from > >> >> >> claim > >> >> >> #2, that proving #1 is not the same thing as proving #2, then you > >> >> >> would understand that the posters were answering you in a way that > >> >> >> is > >> >> >> consistent with logic. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> But seeing as you are deliberately obtuse and dishonest, I cannot > >> >> >> imagine you would take the necessary steps to see that. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > All of the various questions related to the THE MIRACLE HEALING > >> >> >> > TESTIMONY > >> >> >> > OF WILLIAM A. KENT AND CHERYL PREWITT reminded me of a story in > >> >> >> > the > >> >> >> > Bible. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Irrelevant. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > See Luke 16:19-31. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Bad start, Bible-Boy. Atheists don't consider the Bible a reliable > >> >> >> source of truth. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > The rich man was in the place of torment and requested > >> >> >> > permission to return to the earth so that he could warn his > >> >> >> > brothers > >> >> >> > about > >> >> >> > the place of torment. Abraham said to him, "They have Moses and > >> >> >> > the > >> >> >> > prophets; let them hear them [Moses and the prophets]. The rich > >> >> >> > man > >> >> >> > said > >> >> >> > to Abraham: "No, father Abraham, but if one went from the dead, > >> >> >> > they > >> >> >> > will > >> >> >> > repent." And Abraham said to the rich man: "IF THEY HEAR NOT > >> >> >> > MOSES > >> >> >> > AND > >> >> >> > THE PROPHETS, NEITHER WILL THEY BE PERSUADED, THOUGH ONE ROSE > >> >> >> > FROM > >> >> >> > THE > >> >> >> > DEAD. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Extremely irrelevant. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I hope that you now get the point. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Yes. The point is that you value the irrelevant and discard the > >> >> >> inconvenient. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> All because you hate science, reason and logic with every fiber of > >> >> >> your > >> >> >> being. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > If you don't believe the words of Moses > >> >> >> > and the Prophets, > >> >> >> > >> >> >> You have to prove that these fellows existed and said anything . > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Your Bible lacks credibility. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> YOU lack credibility. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Live with it. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > neither will you listen to William A. Kent, Cheryl > >> >> >> > Prewitt or myself. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> That much is true. > >> >> > > >> >> > I am convinced that people only believe things that "fit" their > >> >> > belief > >> >> > system. That is the reason I believed Cheryl Prewitt and William A. > >> >> > Kent. > >> >> > It also explains the reason that atheists did not believe that God > >> >> > healed > >> >> > Cheryl Prewitt and William A. Kent. It also explains why the rich > >> >> > man's > >> >> > brothers (mentioned in Luke 16:19-21) would not have listened to the > >> >> > rich > >> >> > man--even if he had returned from the dead. Do you agree or > >> >> > disagree? > >> >> > >> >> Quit attempting to open secondary discussions, Jason, it is dishonest. > >> >> Everyone examines anything in light of their worldview. Some of us are > >> >> able > >> >> to see the truth even though we might be looking at something that is > >> >> diametrically opposed to our worldview. Others can't see the splinter > >> >> for > >> >> the log. > >> > > >> > The advocates of creation science are able to do the same thing. > >> > >> Is that why your creation 'scientists' sign a pledge that if science > >> produces evidence that the bible is wrong then that evidence is to be > >> ignored? > > > > I doubt that is true. Who makes them sign the pledge? > > You doubt that is true???????? Where have you been, Jason? I can't believe > that you have been around for at least a couple of years and are not aware > of the pledges that these morons sign. > > No one 'makes' them sign it, they sign it of their own free will. What organization or person provides the paperwork and keeps records related to the signed pledges? I'll email them and ask them about it. Quote
Guest John Baker Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:03:10 -0700, Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >In article <QnCci.263$P8.150@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" ><mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-1506071146450001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <fHyci.169$W9.109@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> news:Jason-1406072012490001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > In article >> >> > <DipthotDipthot-24078C.18333014062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> In article >> >> >> <Jason-1406070132130001@66-52-22-114.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> > <DipthotDipthot-CCA16E.18144813062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> > > In article >> >> >> > > <Jason-1306071628360001@66-52-22-38.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> >> > > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > Bramble, >> >> >> > > > You are leaving out an important issue--several different >> >> >> > > > posters >> >> > told me >> >> >> > > > that even if I produced info. about physical evidence that >> >> >> > > > proved >> >> > her leg >> >> >> > > > bone grew two inches--they still would not be convinced that God >> >> >> > > > healed >> >> >> > > > her. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > First off, you are lying again. Skeptics respond to evidence. If >> >> >> > > reliable evidence is produced of some claim, then the claim >> >> >> > > becomes >> >> >> > > more >> >> >> > > credible as a result... and skeptics will take a step toward being >> >> >> > > convinced of that claim. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Second, you're mixing two things: >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > 1. Whether the leg actually became longer, and >> >> >> > > 2. Whether some god or gods caused it to happen. (Built into this >> >> >> > > question is, of course, the question of whether any gods exist.) >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > You believe both. At this point, you have provided reliable >> >> >> > > evidence >> >> >> > > of >> >> >> > > neither . Your second-hand testimony about a verbal claim given >> >> >> > > in >> >> >> > > a >> >> >> > > church is not reliable. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Providing evidence for 1 is probably easier than providing >> >> >> > > evidence >> >> >> > > for >> >> >> > > 2. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Actually, a THIRD question comes up. Even if you show evidence >> >> >> > > for 1 >> >> >> > > and 2, as hard as that will be, your next assignment would be to >> >> >> > > show >> >> >> > > evidence for the following claim: >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > 3. That your Biblical god (named "God") was the god that caused >> >> >> > > it >> >> >> > > to >> >> >> > > happen. (Built into that claim, of course, is the claim that this >> >> >> > > particular god exists.) >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Got that? Can you see the need to walk us through the evidence >> >> >> > > for >> >> >> > > all >> >> >> > > three claims? >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Good luck with that. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > I ask you Bramble >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > I'm not Bramble, but.... >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >--what good would it do for me to spend time visiting >> >> >> > > > websites in search of information about physical evidence? >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Well, for one, you might learn something yourself. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > If you were in my shoes, >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > ...and with your malfunctioning sense of logic? >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > would you waste time finding evidence? >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > What would make finding evidence a waste of time? >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Maybe you'd learn that there is none, and that you were wrong all >> >> >> > > along. >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Don't be afraid that learning such a thing could shake your faith >> >> >> > > in >> >> >> > > your god. I know that wouldn't happen. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I asked at least two people a question like this: >> >> >> > >> >> >> > If I produced physical evidence that proved that Cheryl's leg bone >> >> >> > grew >> >> >> > two inches, would you agree that God healed her? >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Both posters told be that even if I proved that Cheryl's leg bone >> >> >> > grew >> >> >> > two >> >> >> > inches, that it would NOT mean that God healed her. >> >> >> >> >> >> And that is a sensible, logical response. >> >> >> >> >> >> If you actually paid attention to what I wrote above, you would >> >> >> understand why. If you could see that claim #1 is separate from claim >> >> >> #2, that proving #1 is not the same thing as proving #2, then you >> >> >> would understand that the posters were answering you in a way that is >> >> >> consistent with logic. >> >> >> >> >> >> But seeing as you are deliberately obtuse and dishonest, I cannot >> >> >> imagine you would take the necessary steps to see that. >> >> >> >> >> >> > All of the various questions related to the THE MIRACLE HEALING >> >> >> > TESTIMONY >> >> >> > OF WILLIAM A. KENT AND CHERYL PREWITT reminded me of a story in the >> >> >> > Bible. >> >> >> >> >> >> Irrelevant. >> >> >> >> >> >> > See Luke 16:19-31. >> >> >> >> >> >> Bad start, Bible-Boy. Atheists don't consider the Bible a reliable >> >> >> source of truth. >> >> >> >> >> >> > The rich man was in the place of torment and requested >> >> >> > permission to return to the earth so that he could warn his brothers >> >> >> > about >> >> >> > the place of torment. Abraham said to him, "They have Moses and the >> >> >> > prophets; let them hear them [Moses and the prophets]. The rich man >> >> >> > said >> >> >> > to Abraham: "No, father Abraham, but if one went from the dead, they >> >> >> > will >> >> >> > repent." And Abraham said to the rich man: "IF THEY HEAR NOT MOSES >> >> >> > AND >> >> >> > THE PROPHETS, NEITHER WILL THEY BE PERSUADED, THOUGH ONE ROSE FROM >> >> >> > THE >> >> >> > DEAD. >> >> >> >> >> >> Extremely irrelevant. >> >> >> >> >> >> > I hope that you now get the point. >> >> >> >> >> >> Yes. The point is that you value the irrelevant and discard the >> >> >> inconvenient. >> >> >> >> >> >> All because you hate science, reason and logic with every fiber of >> >> >> your >> >> >> being. >> >> >> >> >> >> > If you don't believe the words of Moses >> >> >> > and the Prophets, >> >> >> >> >> >> You have to prove that these fellows existed and said anything . >> >> >> >> >> >> Your Bible lacks credibility. >> >> >> >> >> >> YOU lack credibility. >> >> >> >> >> >> Live with it. >> >> >> >> >> >> > neither will you listen to William A. Kent, Cheryl >> >> >> > Prewitt or myself. >> >> >> >> >> >> That much is true. >> >> > >> >> > I am convinced that people only believe things that "fit" their belief >> >> > system. That is the reason I believed Cheryl Prewitt and William A. >> >> > Kent. >> >> > It also explains the reason that atheists did not believe that God >> >> > healed >> >> > Cheryl Prewitt and William A. Kent. It also explains why the rich >> >> > man's >> >> > brothers (mentioned in Luke 16:19-21) would not have listened to the >> >> > rich >> >> > man--even if he had returned from the dead. Do you agree or disagree? >> >> >> >> Quit attempting to open secondary discussions, Jason, it is dishonest. >> >> Everyone examines anything in light of their worldview. Some of us are >> >> able >> >> to see the truth even though we might be looking at something that is >> >> diametrically opposed to our worldview. Others can't see the splinter >> >> for >> >> the log. >> > >> > The advocates of creation science are able to do the same thing. >> >> Is that why your creation 'scientists' sign a pledge that if science >> produces evidence that the bible is wrong then that evidence is to be >> ignored? > >I doubt that is true. You doubt a lot of things that are true, Jason. And believe a lot of things that aren't. >Who makes them sign the pledge? The ICR for one. The Discovery Institute for another. > Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1506071558590001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <blDci.283$P8.159@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-1506071503110001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <QnCci.263$P8.150@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> news:Jason-1506071146450001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > In article <fHyci.169$W9.109@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> >> news:Jason-1406072012490001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> > <DipthotDipthot-24078C.18333014062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> In article >> >> >> >> <Jason-1406070132130001@66-52-22-114.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> >> > > <DipthotDipthot-CCA16E.18144813062007@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> >> >> > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > In article >> >> >> >> > > <Jason-1306071628360001@66-52-22-38.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> >> >> > > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > > Bramble, >> >> >> >> > > > You are leaving out an important issue--several different >> >> >> >> > > > posters >> >> >> > told me >> >> >> >> > > > that even if I produced info. about physical evidence that >> >> >> >> > > > proved >> >> >> > her leg >> >> >> >> > > > bone grew two inches--they still would not be convinced >> >> >> >> > > > that >> >> >> >> > > > God >> >> >> >> > > > healed >> >> >> >> > > > her. >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > First off, you are lying again. Skeptics respond to >> >> >> >> > > evidence. >> >> >> >> > > If >> >> >> >> > > reliable evidence is produced of some claim, then the claim >> >> >> >> > > becomes >> >> >> >> > > more >> >> >> >> > > credible as a result... and skeptics will take a step toward >> >> >> >> > > being >> >> >> >> > > convinced of that claim. >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > Second, you're mixing two things: >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > 1. Whether the leg actually became longer, and >> >> >> >> > > 2. Whether some god or gods caused it to happen. (Built >> >> >> >> > > into >> >> >> >> > > this >> >> >> >> > > question is, of course, the question of whether any gods >> >> >> >> > > exist.) >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > You believe both. At this point, you have provided reliable >> >> >> >> > > evidence >> >> >> >> > > of >> >> >> >> > > neither . Your second-hand testimony about a verbal claim >> >> >> >> > > given >> >> >> >> > > in >> >> >> >> > > a >> >> >> >> > > church is not reliable. >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > Providing evidence for 1 is probably easier than providing >> >> >> >> > > evidence >> >> >> >> > > for >> >> >> >> > > 2. >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > Actually, a THIRD question comes up. Even if you show >> >> >> >> > > evidence >> >> >> >> > > for 1 >> >> >> >> > > and 2, as hard as that will be, your next assignment would >> >> >> >> > > be >> >> >> >> > > to >> >> >> >> > > show >> >> >> >> > > evidence for the following claim: >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > 3. That your Biblical god (named "God") was the god that >> >> >> >> > > caused >> >> >> >> > > it >> >> >> >> > > to >> >> >> >> > > happen. (Built into that claim, of course, is the claim >> >> >> >> > > that >> >> >> >> > > this >> >> >> >> > > particular god exists.) >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > Got that? Can you see the need to walk us through the >> >> >> >> > > evidence >> >> >> >> > > for >> >> >> >> > > all >> >> >> >> > > three claims? >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > Good luck with that. >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > > I ask you Bramble >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > I'm not Bramble, but.... >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >--what good would it do for me to spend time visiting >> >> >> >> > > > websites in search of information about physical evidence? >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > Well, for one, you might learn something yourself. >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > > If you were in my shoes, >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > ...and with your malfunctioning sense of logic? >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > > would you waste time finding evidence? >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > What would make finding evidence a waste of time? >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > Maybe you'd learn that there is none, and that you were >> >> >> >> > > wrong >> >> >> >> > > all >> >> >> >> > > along. >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > Don't be afraid that learning such a thing could shake your >> >> >> >> > > faith >> >> >> >> > > in >> >> >> >> > > your god. I know that wouldn't happen. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > I asked at least two people a question like this: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > If I produced physical evidence that proved that Cheryl's leg >> >> >> >> > bone >> >> >> >> > grew >> >> >> >> > two inches, would you agree that God healed her? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Both posters told be that even if I proved that Cheryl's leg >> >> >> >> > bone >> >> >> >> > grew >> >> >> >> > two >> >> >> >> > inches, that it would NOT mean that God healed her. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> And that is a sensible, logical response. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> If you actually paid attention to what I wrote above, you would >> >> >> >> understand why. If you could see that claim #1 is separate from >> >> >> >> claim >> >> >> >> #2, that proving #1 is not the same thing as proving #2, then >> >> >> >> you >> >> >> >> would understand that the posters were answering you in a way >> >> >> >> that >> >> >> >> is >> >> >> >> consistent with logic. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> But seeing as you are deliberately obtuse and dishonest, I >> >> >> >> cannot >> >> >> >> imagine you would take the necessary steps to see that. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > All of the various questions related to the THE MIRACLE >> >> >> >> > HEALING >> >> >> >> > TESTIMONY >> >> >> >> > OF WILLIAM A. KENT AND CHERYL PREWITT reminded me of a story >> >> >> >> > in >> >> >> >> > the >> >> >> >> > Bible. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Irrelevant. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > See Luke 16:19-31. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Bad start, Bible-Boy. Atheists don't consider the Bible a >> >> >> >> reliable >> >> >> >> source of truth. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > The rich man was in the place of torment and requested >> >> >> >> > permission to return to the earth so that he could warn his >> >> >> >> > brothers >> >> >> >> > about >> >> >> >> > the place of torment. Abraham said to him, "They have Moses >> >> >> >> > and >> >> >> >> > the >> >> >> >> > prophets; let them hear them [Moses and the prophets]. The >> >> >> >> > rich >> >> >> >> > man >> >> >> >> > said >> >> >> >> > to Abraham: "No, father Abraham, but if one went from the >> >> >> >> > dead, >> >> >> >> > they >> >> >> >> > will >> >> >> >> > repent." And Abraham said to the rich man: "IF THEY HEAR NOT >> >> >> >> > MOSES >> >> >> >> > AND >> >> >> >> > THE PROPHETS, NEITHER WILL THEY BE PERSUADED, THOUGH ONE ROSE >> >> >> >> > FROM >> >> >> >> > THE >> >> >> >> > DEAD. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Extremely irrelevant. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > I hope that you now get the point. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Yes. The point is that you value the irrelevant and discard the >> >> >> >> inconvenient. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> All because you hate science, reason and logic with every fiber >> >> >> >> of >> >> >> >> your >> >> >> >> being. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > If you don't believe the words of Moses >> >> >> >> > and the Prophets, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> You have to prove that these fellows existed and said >> >> >> >> anything . >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Your Bible lacks credibility. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> YOU lack credibility. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Live with it. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > neither will you listen to William A. Kent, Cheryl >> >> >> >> > Prewitt or myself. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> That much is true. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I am convinced that people only believe things that "fit" their >> >> >> > belief >> >> >> > system. That is the reason I believed Cheryl Prewitt and William >> >> >> > A. >> >> >> > Kent. >> >> >> > It also explains the reason that atheists did not believe that >> >> >> > God >> >> >> > healed >> >> >> > Cheryl Prewitt and William A. Kent. It also explains why the >> >> >> > rich >> >> >> > man's >> >> >> > brothers (mentioned in Luke 16:19-21) would not have listened to >> >> >> > the >> >> >> > rich >> >> >> > man--even if he had returned from the dead. Do you agree or >> >> >> > disagree? >> >> >> >> >> >> Quit attempting to open secondary discussions, Jason, it is >> >> >> dishonest. >> >> >> Everyone examines anything in light of their worldview. Some of us >> >> >> are >> >> >> able >> >> >> to see the truth even though we might be looking at something that >> >> >> is >> >> >> diametrically opposed to our worldview. Others can't see the >> >> >> splinter >> >> >> for >> >> >> the log. >> >> > >> >> > The advocates of creation science are able to do the same thing. >> >> >> >> Is that why your creation 'scientists' sign a pledge that if science >> >> produces evidence that the bible is wrong then that evidence is to be >> >> ignored? >> > >> > I doubt that is true. Who makes them sign the pledge? >> >> You doubt that is true???????? Where have you been, Jason? I can't >> believe >> that you have been around for at least a couple of years and are not >> aware >> of the pledges that these morons sign. >> >> No one 'makes' them sign it, they sign it of their own free will. > > What organization or person provides the paperwork and keeps records > related to the signed pledges? I'll email them and ask them about it. You can start with the ICR, wise-ass. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1506071641330001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <tvDci.289$P8.76@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-1506071520450001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <4672fa8c$0$20560$4c368faf@roadrunner.com>, "Christopher >> > Morris" <Draccus@roadrunner.com> wrote: >> > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> news:Jason-1506071227220001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > In article <NDyci.165$W9.27@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > Someone was trying to convince me that Allah and Jehovah were the >> >> > same >> >> > God. My point was that the Bible clearly states that Israel is the >> >> > homeland for Jews. The Muslims believe that Israel should be under >> >> > the >> >> > control of Muslims. If they had the same God, they would only have >> >> > one >> >> > holy book. In this case, they have the Koran and we have the Old >> >> > Testament >> >> > and the New Testament. >> >> > jason >> >> > The >> >> > >> >> >> >> Jason has been pointed out to you Allah is the Arabic word for God >> >> nothing >> >> more nothing less. The Jews do not say the name of God at all, and >> >> Christians just use the generic term God. Both the Christian and the >> >> Muslim >> >> are offshoots of Judaism so you both have Jewish roots and all three >> >> groups >> >> are in fact worshipping the same God. Furthermore you are also all >> >> worshiping the same Ultimate God of all other Faiths as well as St. >> >> Augustine said in "The City of God" the God we worship " is the God >> >> whom >> >> Porphyry, the most learned of philosophers, although the fiercest of >> >> enemy >> >> of the Christian, acknowledges to be a Great God..." Furthermore, the >> >> Pagan >> >> Maximus of Tyre wrote: "In the midst of such contention and strife, >> >> and >> >> disagreement you would see in all the earth one harmonious law and >> >> principle >> >> that there is one God, king and father of all, and many gods, sons of >> >> God, >> >> fellow rulers with God. The Greek says this and the barbarian says it, >> >> the >> >> mainlander and the seafarer, the wise and the unwise." >> > >> > We have a different point of view related to this subject. I have read >> > some of quotations from the Quran and found out that there are MAJOR >> > differences between the Koran and the Bible. Here is just one example: >> > >> > From the Quran: >> > Fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, >> > beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every strategem (of war). >> > Surah 9:5 >> > >> > "...cutting off of hands and feet...." Surah 5:33 >> > >> > Needless to say, you will not find words like that in the New >> > Testament. >> > >> > Jesus said, "Love your neighbor as yourself". Jesus never taught his >> > followers to cut off the hands and feet of pagans or to slay pagans. >> > Jason >> >> Ever read the Old Testament. That is part of your bible, isn't it? > > Yes Well then,you should know that it is replete with incidents just like the ones you are ascribing to the Muslims! Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <1iv573117ivs5agfgk2di9kjs5qim6jsqn@4ax.com>, Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > In alt.atheism On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 19:12:37 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > (Jason) let us all know that: > > >In article <pue373hcaj30bj1jcgp9lfvpf27cuklsab@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > > > >> In alt.atheism On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 12:44:42 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > >> (Jason) let us all know that: > >> > >> >In article <k9h273p8806sfnq9i3hevsje8qufrapnca@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > >> ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > >> > > >> >> In alt.atheism On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 00:24:58 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > >> >> (Jason) let us all know that: > >> >> > >> >> >In article <eig17358isldvc4vhf9pg2rromvhsrn7q2@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > >> >> ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >> In alt.atheism On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 16:22:05 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > >> >> >> (Jason) let us all know that: > >> >> >> > >> >> >> >In article <46n0735npa5v05vudinp6rpte4i50rr7p3@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > >> >> >> ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> In alt.atheism On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 13:03:30 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > >> >> >> >> (Jason) let us all know that: > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >In article <f4pa1r$vpv$1@news04.infoave.net>, Mike > >> >> >> >> ><prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com> wrote: > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> Jason wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> > In article <opc3k4-7or.ln1@spanky.localhost.net>, Kelsey > >Bjarnason > >> >> >> >> >> > <kbjarnason@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> >> [snips] > >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, 12 Jun 2007 10:42:26 -0700, Jason wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >>> Yes, that is true. If I provided physical evidence which > >> >> >indicated that > >> >> >> >> >> >>> her leg bone grew 2 inches--how would you explain how it > >> >happened? > >> >> >> >> >> >> Honestly, by stating the cause - if any, you haven't validated > >> >> >> >even this > >> >> >> >> >> >> much yet - simply isn't known yet. > >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> "I don't know" is not the same as "Yes, there really is a super > >> >> >> >being who, > >> >> >> >> >> >> of all the thousands of such beings described, just happens to > >> >> >> >match this > >> >> >> >> >> >> particular one and he really does heal people, but does it > >> >magically > >> >> >> >> >> >> without leaving any evidence he did it - or even that he > >exists." > >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> You see how those differ? Maybe, some day, you'll let it > >sink in. > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > Have you considered that God is giving you evidence that he > >> >exists by > >> >> >> >> >> > healing people? Maybe, some day, you'll let it sink in. > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> Are all the people that aren't healed evidence that there is > >no god? > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> BTW, if I went to a doctor that had as bad of a healing rate > >as your > >> >> >> >> >> god, I'd sue him for malpractice. > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >The people (like Cheryl Prewitt) that are healed by God > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> She was healed by god because you say so. That doesn't fly. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >Cheryl Prewitt told me that she was healed by God. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> So what? > >> >> >> > >> >> >> And I reposted my responses to your 20 questions. Are you > >> >> >> going to address them? > >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >Thank you for answering the questions. > >> >> > > >> >> When will you address them? Here: let me repost them AGAIN. In > >> >> fact, every response to you from now on will include those answers. > >> >> Every. Single. Response. From. Me. > >> >> > >> >> > 20 Questions for Evolutionists > >> >> > > >> >> > 1. Where has macro evolution ever been observed? > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-speciation.html > >> >> > >> >> > What's the mechanism > >> >> >for getting new complexity such as new vital organs? > >> >> > >> >> Mutation. Natural selection > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >How, for example, > >> >> >could a caterpillar evolve into a butterfly? > >> >> > >> >> It transforms, dumbshit. > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 2. Where are the billions of transitional fossils that should be there > >> >> >if your theory is right? > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CC/CC200.html > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > 3. Who are the evolutionary ancestors of the insects? > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CC/CC220_1.html > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > 4. What evidence is there that information, such as that in DNA, could > >> >> >ever assemble itself? > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CF/CF003.html > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > 5. How could organs as complicated as the eye > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB301.html > >> >> > >> >> > or the ear > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB302.html > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > or the brain of even a tiny bird ever come about by chance or natural > >> >processes? > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB303.html > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > How could a bacterial motor evolve? > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB200_1.html > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 6. If the solar system evolved, why do three planets spin backwards? > >> >> > >> >> Oh for fucks sake, Hovind: this has nothing to do with > >> >> evolution. 7 and 8 have nothing to do with evolution, either. That is > >> >> in the field of COSMOLOGY and ASTROPHYSICS, moron. Stop believing Kent > >> >> Hovind. He's a liar and a con-artist. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > 9. How did sexual reproduction evolve? > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/origins/feedback/dec98.html > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 10. If the big bang occurred, where did all the information > >> >> > >> >> It's not information. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > 11. Why do so many of the earth's ancient cultures have flood legends? > >> >> > >> >> Because the started near rivers. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 12. Where did matter come from? > >> >> > >> >> Where did god come from? > >> >> > >> >> > What about space, time, energy, and even the laws of physics? > >> >> > > >> >> > 13. How did the first living cell begin? > >> >> > >> >> No one really knows, but it's not a miracle. > >> >> > >> >> How did god begin? Yes, god began. No, god didn't not begin. > >> >> Yes, god began. No, god didn't not begin. I'll keep repeating that > >> >> until you understand that you can't special plead. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > 14. Just before life appeared, did the atmosphere have oxygen or did > >> >> >it not have oxygen? > >> >> > >> >> Didn't. > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 15. Why aren't meteorites found in supposedly old rocks? > >> >> > >> >> We do find them there in their remnants. Search for "iridium > >> >> layer" in google. You'll find something interesting. > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 16. If it takes intelligence to make an arrowhead, why doesn't it take > >> >> >vastly more intelligence to create a human? > >> >> > >> >> Why doesn't it take vastly more intelligence than that to > >> >> create god? > >> >> > >> >> > Do you really believe that > >> >> >hydrogen will turn into people if you wait long enough? > >> >> > >> >> Only if you want to strawman evolution, which clearly you do. > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 17. Which came first, DNA or the proteins needed by DNA--which can > >> >> >only be produced by DNA? > >> >> > >> >> http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB015.html > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 18. Can you name one reasonable hypothesis on how the moon got > >> >> >there > >> >> > >> >> http://csep10.phys.utk.edu/astr161/lect/moon/moon_formation.html > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >--any hypothesis that is consistent with all the data? Why aren't > >> >> >students told the scientific reasons for rejecting all the evolutionary > >> >> >theories for the moon's origin? > >> >> > >> >> There AREN'T any evolutionary theories for it because IT'S NOT > >> >> PART OF EVOLUTION, YOU IGNORANT FUCK. IT'S PART OF > >> >> ASTROPHYSICS/COSMOLOGY, YOU IGNORANT FUCK. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > 19. Why won't qualified evolutionists enter into a written, scientific > >> >> >debate? > >> >> > >> >> Because they don't want to dirty themselves with the laughable > >> >> bullshit of creationists. > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > 20. Would you like to explain the origin of any of the following > >> >> >twenty-one features of the earth: > >> >> > >> >> No. I've humored you enough > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > If so, I will point out some obvious problems with your > >> >> >explanation > >> >> > >> >> No, you won't. You will just point us to a place that closes > >> >> its eyes and screams "gawddidit" over and over. > >> > >> >thanks for your answers--you get a grade of A. > >> > >> That's nice. Now respond to my answers. > >> > > >Did your teachers in high school and professors in college respond to > >every answer you gave on every test or exam? > > Yes. Now respond to my answers. Do you want me to write "excellent answer" next to each answer. I'll do that if you want me to do it. My first grade teacher made use of check marks and x marks. > > > Don > --- > aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde > Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. > > "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" > Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1506071621450001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <OxDci.291$P8.214@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-1506071523550001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <GsCci.266$P8.179@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> news:Jason-1506071212400001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > In article <Lsyci.160$W9.143@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> >> news:Jason-1406072027180001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> >> > In article <j2t373d3n0dafs1r9ffao27cp6i1hi7qft@4ax.com>, Free >> >> >> > Lunch >> >> >> > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 19:47:26 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> >> >> <Jason-1406071947270001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >> >> >In article <e4c37352rsu9akoeoi2jld8sdh7bpn28n3@4ax.com>, Free >> >> >> >> >Lunch >> >> >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 01:35:14 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism >> >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> >> >> >> <Jason-1406070135150001@66-52-22-114.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >> >> >> >In article <0c41731qbu3l8n3j7rhumqe3vmdvf5rvs7@4ax.com>, >> >> >> >> >> >Free >> >> >> >> >> >Lunch >> >> >> >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 00:22:57 -0700, in >> >> >> >> >> >> alt.talk.creationism >> >> >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> >> >> >> >> <Jason-1306070022570001@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >> >> >> >> >In article >> >> >> > <1181708123.776350.23860@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>, Martin >> >> >> >> >> >> ><phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Jun 13, 11:59 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > <1181695356.967104.238...@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >> >> >> >Martin >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ... >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > By the way, Genesis 1 says "El" created the >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > universe >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > and >> >> >> > mankind but >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > Genesis 2 says it was "Yahweh". >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Do you have the verses? El may be one of the many >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > names >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > of >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > God. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> In fact, Genesis 1 talks about the Elohim, which means >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "gods", >> >> >> >> >> >> >> in >> >> >> >> >> >> >> plural. (e.g. Genesis 6:2, "... the sons of Elohim saw >> >> >> >> >> >> >> the >> >> >> >> >> >> >> daughters >> >> >> >> >> >> >> of men that they were fair; and they took them for >> >> >> >> >> >> >> wives... >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ,") >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Martin >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >This is in reference to the intermarriage among the >> >> >> >> >> >> >Cainites >> >> >> >> >> >> >and >> >> >> > Sethites. >> >> >> >> >> >> >The Cainites were sinful, evil people and the Sethites >> >> >> >> >> >> >were >> >> >> >> >> >> >devoted and >> >> >> >> >> >> >consecrated to God. God became very upset with the >> >> >> >> >> >> >Sethites >> >> >> >> >> >> >for >> >> >> >> >> >> >taking >> >> >> >> >> >> >Cainite women as their wives since God wanted them to >> >> >> >> >> >> >only >> >> >> >> >> >> >marry >> >> >> > Sethite >> >> >> >> >> >> >women. >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >I copied most of the above info. from a footnote in my >> >> >> >> >> >> >study >> >> >> >> >> >> >Bible. >> >> >> >> >> >> >Jason >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> The authors of your study bible note were making it up. >> >> >> >> >> >> They >> >> >> >> >> >> have >> >> >> >> >> >> no >> >> >> >> >> >> evidence at all that their claim is correct. >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >Should I believe you or the words of the W.A. Chriswell, >> >> >> >> >> >Ph.D--the >> >> >> >> >> >editor >> >> >> >> >> >of my study Bible or yourself--take a guess on my choice. >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> I know that you would be mistaken to believe those who make >> >> >> >> >> things >> >> >> >> >> up >> >> >> >> >> like this, but I also know that you have a demonstrated >> >> >> >> >> willingness >> >> >> >> >> to >> >> >> >> >> be led astray by those who tell you what you want to hear. >> >> >> >> >> Chriswell >> >> >> >> >> does not have _any_ evidence that "this is in reference to >> >> >> >> >> the >> >> >> >> >> intermarriage among the Cainites and Sethites." >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Deal with facts. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >I have no reason to doubt Dr. Chriswell. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> That's because you reject the whole concept of evidence. Anyone >> >> >> >> can >> >> >> >> tell >> >> >> >> you any lie as long as they claim God wants it. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Still, I wouldn't be surprised if you misrepresented what >> >> >> >> Chriswell >> >> >> >> said, you do have a long track record of misunderstanding what >> >> >> >> others >> >> >> >> are trying to tell you and misrepresenting these things to >> >> >> >> others. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Buy or read the Criswell Study Bible and see the evidence for >> >> >> > yourself. >> >> >> >> >> >> I have many books on the study of the bible. I question each and >> >> >> every >> >> >> one >> >> >> when I read them. I then form my own conclusion on what I read. You >> >> >> could >> >> >> use a little objective analysis. >> >> > >> >> > I have two study Bibles. One of them did not have a footnote about >> >> > the >> >> > scripture in question. I have a Bible dictionary but it was poorly >> >> > written >> >> > since many words that I have searched for are not in the dictionary. >> >> > My >> >> > 1000 page concordance has been really helpful. >> >> > Jason >> >> >> >> What you need are a few books on textual criticism. That'll open your >> >> eyes. >> >> Well, it would on an ordinary person. >> > >> > I once knew someone that had such a book. He loved to discuss various >> > scriptures that he found in that book. >> >> Why don't you buy a copy of Misquoting Jesus and read it? > > I have no desire to read such a book. A book written by Tom Clancy would > be more interesting to me. Someone suggested that I read a book related to > Quantum Physics--that made me laugh. I barely passed the college math 101 > class. > Jason If you don't care to read 'such a book',then you have no authority to argue with others when it comes to your bible. Don't be ignorant all of your life, do something about it! Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <1181942250.892866.217350@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, bramble <leopoldo.perdomo@gmail.com> wrote: > On 15 jun, 03:10, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <1181855287.946802.104...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > > > bramble <leopoldo.perd...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > On 14 jun, 20:40, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > In article <5dd120F32b33...@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" > > > > > > <witchy...@broomstick.com> wrote: > > > > > "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote i > > > > > > > snip > > > > > > > > Cheryl Prewitt told me that she was healed by God. > > > > > > > So? You believe every thing you're told? > > > > > > In relation to some people, including Chery Prewitt, I do believe what > > > > they say. I don't believe everything that many people say---such as B= > ill > > > > Clinton. Did you believe him when he stated, "I did not have sex with= > that > > > > woman"? > > > > > No. But I felt much worse with the men asking Clinton that personal > > > thing, than with the stupid answer of the president. Here, in Europe, > > > we have the pervasive idea that Clinton should have said, "fuck off, > > > jerk!" > > > If the journalists insisted in the same question, he should have said, > > > "go hell, bastard!" No any need to pay tribute to all the hypocrites > > > that hoped him to say this stupid answer. > > > Francois Mitterand was president of France for many years. He was > > > living with a misses without being divorced, had a daughter with the > > > facy woman he was cohabitating and nobody ever dared to ask him, "are > > > you living in concubinage?" At the burying ceremony were present both > > > women and all his children. This is a civilization. A civilization > > > the fundies want to obliterate. > > > This is a war, Jason. You digging the foundations for the next civil > > > war in the US. It is sad to me. I loved much America, till I began > > > to heard the fundies making war noises. > > > Bramble > > > > Bramble, > > Christians have very little power in America. At least one state wanted to > > teach Intelligent Design in the public school system. If we had the power > > that you think we have, we would have been able to do it. We failed. The > > advocates of evolution have more power than we have. The countries in > > Europe has as much to fear from Muslems as America. I have read that the > > Muslim's goal is to eventually take over Spain. They have major problems > > in London related to terrorists. You probably know more about it than I do > > since you live in Europe. What country do you live in--is it France? > > Jason > > > At present, it seems that you have not enough power yet. We we better > keep you on a tight watch. Fanatics can be very dangerous. > Ok, you got a case with Muslims. But the idea of submitting Europa, > or even Am=E9rica, is but a dream of a few fanatics. In general, it > seems the common Muslims are a little scared of them and did not dare > to speak against this fanatics. We simple have to build a system of > "human inteligence" to fend off terrorists. This can be done. I > supossed there are enough moderate Muslims to help us carry out this > work. > I live in France. I have read your new leader is a friend of America--is that true? The article that I read indicated that various Mullahs are encouraging various followers to move to Spain. After Muslims become the majority of the population, they will vote in Muslim politicians that will eventually establish Spain as a Muslim country and establish the same sorts of laws that they now have in Iran. Do you know anything about that subject? jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <OxDci.291$P8.214@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1506071523550001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <GsCci.266$P8.179@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> news:Jason-1506071212400001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> > In article <Lsyci.160$W9.143@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> > > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> >> news:Jason-1406072027180001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> >> > In article <j2t373d3n0dafs1r9ffao27cp6i1hi7qft@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > >> >> > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >> On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 19:47:26 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> >> <Jason-1406071947270001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >> >In article <e4c37352rsu9akoeoi2jld8sdh7bpn28n3@4ax.com>, Free > >> >> >> >Lunch > >> >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 01:35:14 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> >> >> <Jason-1406070135150001@66-52-22-114.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >> >> >In article <0c41731qbu3l8n3j7rhumqe3vmdvf5rvs7@4ax.com>, Free > >> >> >> >> >Lunch > >> >> >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 00:22:57 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> >> >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> >> >> >> <Jason-1306070022570001@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >> >> >> >In article > >> >> > <1181708123.776350.23860@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>, Martin > >> >> >> >> >> ><phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> >> On Jun 13, 11:59 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> >> > In article > >> >> >> >> >> >> > <1181695356.967104.238...@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>, > >> >> >> >> >Martin > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> ... > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> > > By the way, Genesis 1 says "El" created the universe > >> >> >> >> >> >> > > and > >> >> > mankind but > >> >> >> >> >> >> > > Genesis 2 says it was "Yahweh". > >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> > Do you have the verses? El may be one of the many names > >> >> >> >> >> >> > of > >> >> >> >> >> >> > God. > >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> In fact, Genesis 1 talks about the Elohim, which means > >> >> >> >> >> >> "gods", > >> >> >> >> >> >> in > >> >> >> >> >> >> plural. (e.g. Genesis 6:2, "... the sons of Elohim saw > >> >> >> >> >> >> the > >> >> >> >> >> >> daughters > >> >> >> >> >> >> of men that they were fair; and they took them for > >> >> >> >> >> >> wives... > >> >> >> >> >> >> ,") > >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim > >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> Martin > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> >This is in reference to the intermarriage among the Cainites > >> >> >> >> >> >and > >> >> > Sethites. > >> >> >> >> >> >The Cainites were sinful, evil people and the Sethites were > >> >> >> >> >> >devoted and > >> >> >> >> >> >consecrated to God. God became very upset with the Sethites > >> >> >> >> >> >for > >> >> >> >> >> >taking > >> >> >> >> >> >Cainite women as their wives since God wanted them to only > >> >> >> >> >> >marry > >> >> > Sethite > >> >> >> >> >> >women. > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> >I copied most of the above info. from a footnote in my study > >> >> >> >> >> >Bible. > >> >> >> >> >> >Jason > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> The authors of your study bible note were making it up. They > >> >> >> >> >> have > >> >> >> >> >> no > >> >> >> >> >> evidence at all that their claim is correct. > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >Should I believe you or the words of the W.A. Chriswell, > >> >> >> >> >Ph.D--the > >> >> >> >> >editor > >> >> >> >> >of my study Bible or yourself--take a guess on my choice. > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> I know that you would be mistaken to believe those who make > >> >> >> >> things > >> >> >> >> up > >> >> >> >> like this, but I also know that you have a demonstrated > >> >> >> >> willingness > >> >> >> >> to > >> >> >> >> be led astray by those who tell you what you want to hear. > >> >> >> >> Chriswell > >> >> >> >> does not have _any_ evidence that "this is in reference to the > >> >> >> >> intermarriage among the Cainites and Sethites." > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> Deal with facts. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >I have no reason to doubt Dr. Chriswell. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> That's because you reject the whole concept of evidence. Anyone can > >> >> >> tell > >> >> >> you any lie as long as they claim God wants it. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Still, I wouldn't be surprised if you misrepresented what Chriswell > >> >> >> said, you do have a long track record of misunderstanding what > >> >> >> others > >> >> >> are trying to tell you and misrepresenting these things to others. > >> >> > > >> >> > Buy or read the Criswell Study Bible and see the evidence for > >> >> > yourself. > >> >> > >> >> I have many books on the study of the bible. I question each and every > >> >> one > >> >> when I read them. I then form my own conclusion on what I read. You > >> >> could > >> >> use a little objective analysis. > >> > > >> > I have two study Bibles. One of them did not have a footnote about the > >> > scripture in question. I have a Bible dictionary but it was poorly > >> > written > >> > since many words that I have searched for are not in the dictionary. My > >> > 1000 page concordance has been really helpful. > >> > Jason > >> > >> What you need are a few books on textual criticism. That'll open your > >> eyes. > >> Well, it would on an ordinary person. > > > > I once knew someone that had such a book. He loved to discuss various > > scriptures that he found in that book. > > Why don't you buy a copy of Misquoting Jesus and read it? I have no desire to read such a book. A book written by Tom Clancy would be more interesting to me. Someone suggested that I read a book related to Quantum Physics--that made me laugh. I barely passed the college math 101 class. Jason Quote
Guest 655321 Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 Jason wrote: > The article that I read indicated that various Mullahs are encouraging > various followers to move to Spain. After Muslims become the majority of > the population, they will vote in Muslim politicians that will eventually > establish Spain as a Muslim country and establish the same sorts of laws > that they now have in Iran. Are you actually concerned about this? In what source did this article appear? What political agenda does the author have? -- 655321 Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <5fv57314fnidrhvm30gm4rp9seh2i4k2v3@4ax.com>, Jim07D7 <Jim07D7@nospam.net> wrote: > "Christopher Morris" <Draccus@roadrunner.com> said: > > > >Jason has been pointed out to you Allah is the Arabic word for God nothing > >more nothing less. The Jews do not say the name of God at all, and > >Christians just use the generic term God. Both the Christian and the Muslim > >are offshoots of Judaism so you both have Jewish roots and all three groups > >are in fact worshipping the same God. Furthermore you are also all > >worshiping the same Ultimate God of all other Faiths as well as St. > >Augustine said in "The City of God" the God we worship " is the God whom > >Porphyry, the most learned of philosophers, although the fiercest of enemy > >of the Christian, acknowledges to be a Great God..." Furthermore, the Pagan > >Maximus of Tyre wrote: "In the midst of such contention and strife, and > >disagreement you would see in all the earth one harmonious law and principle > >that there is one God, king and father of all, and many gods, sons of God, > >fellow rulers with God. The Greek says this and the barbarian says it, the > >mainlander and the seafarer, the wise and the unwise." > > > In order for different people to worship the same god, that god has to > exist. Without this, all that can be said is that their depictions of > the god are general enough to coincide. Please provide reasons to > believe a god exists. First, I don't agree that Muslims and Christians worship the same God. There are vast differences between the Christian religion and the Muslim Religion. I don't have the proof that you are asking about. A belief in God is based on faith. It's difficult to explain faith. I will try to explain it like this: I read an article in a magazine indicating that they located a planet in deep space that was similar to the earth. That astronomer stated that he believed there were hundreds of similar planets in the solar system. For the sake of discussion, lets say that we were able to demand EVIDENCE about those hundreds of planets. He would probably say, "I don't have the evidence". He has "faith" that those planets exist. Just because I have no evidence that God exists, I am certain that God exists. When I heard a testimony from Cheryl Prewitt--that was evidence for God's existence for me. However, I can easily understand why atheists would not believe her testimony since they don't believe in God. jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 In article <tvDci.289$P8.76@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1506071520450001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <4672fa8c$0$20560$4c368faf@roadrunner.com>, "Christopher > > Morris" <Draccus@roadrunner.com> wrote: > > > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> news:Jason-1506071227220001@66-52-22-34.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> > In article <NDyci.165$W9.27@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> > > >> > Someone was trying to convince me that Allah and Jehovah were the same > >> > God. My point was that the Bible clearly states that Israel is the > >> > homeland for Jews. The Muslims believe that Israel should be under the > >> > control of Muslims. If they had the same God, they would only have one > >> > holy book. In this case, they have the Koran and we have the Old > >> > Testament > >> > and the New Testament. > >> > jason > >> > The > >> > > >> > >> Jason has been pointed out to you Allah is the Arabic word for God > >> nothing > >> more nothing less. The Jews do not say the name of God at all, and > >> Christians just use the generic term God. Both the Christian and the > >> Muslim > >> are offshoots of Judaism so you both have Jewish roots and all three > >> groups > >> are in fact worshipping the same God. Furthermore you are also all > >> worshiping the same Ultimate God of all other Faiths as well as St. > >> Augustine said in "The City of God" the God we worship " is the God whom > >> Porphyry, the most learned of philosophers, although the fiercest of > >> enemy > >> of the Christian, acknowledges to be a Great God..." Furthermore, the > >> Pagan > >> Maximus of Tyre wrote: "In the midst of such contention and strife, and > >> disagreement you would see in all the earth one harmonious law and > >> principle > >> that there is one God, king and father of all, and many gods, sons of > >> God, > >> fellow rulers with God. The Greek says this and the barbarian says it, > >> the > >> mainlander and the seafarer, the wise and the unwise." > > > > We have a different point of view related to this subject. I have read > > some of quotations from the Quran and found out that there are MAJOR > > differences between the Koran and the Bible. Here is just one example: > > > > From the Quran: > > Fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, > > beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every strategem (of war). > > Surah 9:5 > > > > "...cutting off of hands and feet...." Surah 5:33 > > > > Needless to say, you will not find words like that in the New Testament. > > > > Jesus said, "Love your neighbor as yourself". Jesus never taught his > > followers to cut off the hands and feet of pagans or to slay pagans. > > Jason > > Ever read the Old Testament. That is part of your bible, isn't it? Yes Quote
Guest Kelsey Bjarnason Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 [snips] On Fri, 15 Jun 2007 00:33:23 -0700, Jason wrote: > That is a excellent question. My answer is that I believe that God created > the universe; the earth; some plants; some animals and mankind. That's nice. Got any evidence showing God exists? No? Then there's no reason to take your belief seriously - completely apart from your lies and your respect of known liars. > After the creation process was finished I'm sure you'll demonstrate that there was such a process, right? Oh, no, for some reason you skip that part. > Natural Selection took over. I have > yet to see any posts or new information that has caused me to change my > mind. Actually you have, but, like a typical theist type, you simply ignore reality whenever it's convenient. > I have seen no evidence to indicate that abiogenesis is how life > came to be. Whereas you have seen evidence that God exists, and evidence he created life, right? If not, then you're simply dishonest in even mentioning lack of evidence of abiogenesis as having any bearing. Of course, if you do have such evidence of God, I'm sure you'll trot it out. Oh, whoops, you forgot that part again. > Even if every scientist in the world was convinced that > abiogenesis was how life came to be Once again demonstrating your fundamental cluelessness. Reality is not defined by counting noses. I do wish you would learn that lesson, if no other. > The > only thing that would cause me to believe that abiogenesis was how life > came to be is if various scientists done experiments to prove that all > of these steps could happen in a lab. And of course, you have scientists who have proved, in a lab, that God exists and also every step of the creation process he used. Oh, no, you don't, but you believe that. Funny. you believe that with no evidence whatsoever, yet you reject science unless it meets a standard it doesn't even try to meet itself. That would be called dishonesty, Jason, demanding ridiculous standards on one side and none at all on the other. -- Avoid the Tate's Compass: "He who has a Tate's is lost!" Quote
Guest Martin Phipps Posted June 15, 2007 Posted June 15, 2007 > "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1406071947270001@66-52-22-82.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <e4c37352rsu9akoeoi2jld8sdh7bpn2...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > > <l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > >> On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 01:35:14 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> <Jason-1406070135150...@66-52-22-114.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >In article <0c41731qbu3l8n3j7rhumqe3vmdvf5r...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > >> ><l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > >> >> On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 00:22:57 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > >> >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > >> >> <Jason-1306070022570...@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >> >> >In article <1181708123.776350.23...@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>, > >> >> >Martin > >> >> ><phippsmar...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > >> >> >> On Jun 13, 11:59 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> >> > In article > >> >> >> > <1181695356.967104.238...@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com>, > >> >Martin > > >> >> ... > > >> >> >> > > By the way, Genesis 1 says "El" created the universe and > >> >> >> > > mankind but > >> >> >> > > Genesis 2 says it was "Yahweh". > > >> >> >> > Do you have the verses? El may be one of the many names of God. > > >> >> >> In fact, Genesis 1 talks about the Elohim, which means "gods", in > >> >> >> plural. (e.g. Genesis 6:2, "... the sons of Elohim saw the > >> >> >> daughters > >> >> >> of men that they were fair; and they took them for wives... ,") > > >> >> >> Seehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim > > >> >> >> Martin > > >> >> >This is in reference to the intermarriage among the Cainites and > >> >> >Sethites. > >> >> >The Cainites were sinful, evil people and the Sethites were devoted > >> >> >and > >> >> >consecrated to God. God became very upset with the Sethites for > >> >> >taking > >> >> >Cainite women as their wives since God wanted them to only marry > >> >> >Sethite > >> >> >women. > > >> >> >I copied most of the above info. from a footnote in my study Bible. > >> >> >Jason > > >> >> The authors of your study bible note were making it up. They have no > >> >> evidence at all that their claim is correct. > > >> >Should I believe you or the words of the W.A. Chriswell, Ph.D--the > >> >editor > >> >of my study Bible or yourself--take a guess on my choice. > > >> I know that you would be mistaken to believe those who make things up > >> like this, but I also know that you have a demonstrated willingness to > >> be led astray by those who tell you what you want to hear. Chriswell > >> does not have _any_ evidence that "this is in reference to the > >> intermarriage among the Cainites and Sethites." > > >> Deal with facts. > > > I have no reason to doubt Dr. Chriswell. He's Christian, isn't he? Then you plenty of reason to believe he's just as much a lying scumbag as you are. Martin Quote
Guest Martin Phipps Posted June 16, 2007 Posted June 16, 2007 On Jun 15, 11:56 pm, "Ralph" <mmman...@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Martin" <phippsmar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message > > news:1181866254.662302.244500@q19g2000prn.googlegroups.com... > > > I have a theory: perhaps "Jason" is more than one person and they are > > being paid to post here. That would explain how they have been going > > for a year and a half without saying anything new > > You mention that Jason has been around for a year and a half. In the group I > read this he hasn't been here that long. From which group do you read his > posts? He was saying the same thing in alt.atheism back in November of 2005. Check his profile. Martin Quote
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