Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 21:41:49 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-2506072141500001@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <1182825539.614729.233910@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin ><phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> On Jun 26, 8:29 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> > In article <m5l083tvho8aq1m7bplo13mv79ltbci...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch >> > <l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> > > So, aside from you huge ego, why do you claim that humans are special. >> > > The physical evidence shows otherwise. >> > >> > Because the Bible states that humans are special. >> >> So, aside from your huge ego, what possible reason do you have for >> believing anything in the Bible? You were asked before to find >> something -anything- in the Bible which is objectively true and you >> never answered (as usual). >> >> Martin > >Psalms 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart there is no God. That has nothing to do with your continual dishonesty. Did God tell you to lie? When? Where? If not, God and the rest of us deserve an apology for your indecent behavior. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-2606071130410001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <r24283phccc0drikiliee30i3vlkfegfo6@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein > <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:01:43 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) in >> <Jason-2506071801440001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: >> >> [snip] >> >> >I don't consider ID to be a lie. >> >> Ok. So tell us what ID means and tell us something about the >> designers. Tell us how ID is not just creationism with the identity of >> the designers kept hidden. > > You need to visit the Discovery Institute website. There are some > differences between ID and creation science. I don't know all of the > differences. I seem to recall reading that the IDers use the same figure > as the evolutionists related to the age of the earth. The advocates of > creation science believe the earth is less than 10,000 years old. Your textbook, "Of Pandas and People" was written with the name of god splattered throughout. When it became obvious that the courts were not going to let religion be taught in a science class they went though the book and deleted every reference to god. Therefore, there can't be substantial differences. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <ama383tt5lqob7ei5h7hgk4apsu7k62cj9@4ax.com>, Free Lunch <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:25:10 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > <Jason-2606071125110001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >In article <5eclilF37sb6pU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" > ><witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: > > > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> news:Jason-2506071804250001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> > In article <K3Zfi.7097$n9.2456@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> > > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > >> >> news:Jason-2506071704090001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> >> > In article <1182813173.218982.308140@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, > >> >> > Martin > >> >> > Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >> On Jun 26, 3:17 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> >> > In article <1182773965.426707.320...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, > >> >> >> > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > >> >> >> > > On 25 Jun., 03:18, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> >> > > > In article > >> >> >> > > > > ><DipthotDipthot-A725FE.16174624062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > >> >> >> > > > > In article > >> >> >> > > > > <Jason-2306071116110...@66-52-22-111.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > >> >> >> > > > > J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > > > I want to make it legal for teachers > >> >> >> > > > > > to teach ID > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > > But it is legal to do that... > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > > ... in a comparative religions, class, for example. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > > So what's your problem? > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > > I was referring to high school science and biology classes. Of > >> >> >> > > > course, > >> >> >> > > > evolution should also be taught in those same classes. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > Why should a person with no understanding of science > >> >> >> > > (self-admitted) > >> >> >> > > decide what should be taught in a science class? Why should the > >> >> >> > > US > >> >> >> > > give up religious freedom? > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > I posted a poll yesterday which indicated that most of the people > >> >> >> > that > >> >> >> > live in Ohio want ID and Evolution to be taught in the public > >> >> >> > schools. > >> >> >> > I > >> >> >> > believe the people in Ohio should decide what subjects should be > >> >> >> > taught > >> >> >> > in > >> >> >> > the public schools. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> What if people in Ohio wanted teachers to teach that the Earth was > >> >> >> flat? Do you think teachers should go along with it? I'd quit > >> >> >> outright. Their loss. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Martin > >> >> > > >> >> > The teachers that don't want to teach the established curriculum in a > >> >> > state school should quit. > >> >> > >> >> You side-stepped the issue Jason, do we let the public dictate what > >> >> science > >> >> is correct?? Take you Jason, you are what is known as a scientific > >> >> illiterate. Do we let you and people like you, chose the science > >> >> curriculum? > >> > > >> > No--but the people that live in Ohio should have a voice in deciding > >> > school curriculum. In this case over 60% of those people want both ID and > >> > evolution to be taught. > >> > >> Listen all ID is "God did it". So, when the kids come from home from > >> school, all the parents have to do is say that and it's taken care of. > >> There's no need for an entire course on the subject. > > > >There is more to it than that. The text book "Of Pandas and People" has > >170 pages. For example, two separate books have been written by the > >proponents of creation science related to fossils and bones. A summary of > >the fossil evidence is probably discussed in that text book. > > Jason, you are so easy to con that even the stupidest religious teacher > can get you to believe the biggest lie. Pandas and People is not a > science book. If you had ever read it and learned anything about > science, you would know that the authors of P&P are liars. > > >Perhaps the parents could tell their children: "Life evolved from > >non-life". So, when the kids come home from school, all the parents have > >to do is say that and it's taken care of. There's no need for an entire > >course on evolution. > > Evolution is about the change in life over time. You have been corrected > on that about a thousand times, yet still seem incapable of learning > such a simple fact. I made the evolution comment in response to this comment: > >> Listen all ID is "God did it". So, when the kids come from home from > >> school, all the parents have to do is say that and it's taken care of. > >> There's no need for an entire course on the subject. One the results of not teaching ID in the public schools is the rapid growth of the home schooling movement. In addition, many large churches has opened "Christian Schools". I once visited a large church that I don't attend. I noticed about 30 little children playing. I was told that they recently started a Christian school since the parents wanted the children to learn about God. Many Christian parents and rich parents have now given up on the public schools. Evolutionists are one of the reasons. One of reasons they do not want ID to be taught is because they are afraid that children would realize that it makes more sense than evolution. Of course, no poster in this newsgroup would admit that was one of the reasons. Jason Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 06:57:41 -0000, in alt.talk.creationism Martin <phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote in <1182841061.572745.121310@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com>: >On Jun 26, 2:08 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> csmonitor.com - The Christian Science Monitor Online > >Why do you never go to reputible sources and instead go to sources >that you know full well will lie to you and tell you what you want to >know? I guess it's because you're an idiot. > >Martin However strange the religion that supports it, the Monitor has long had a good reputation. Remember, the article makes it quite clear that Jason's original claim that this was Moslems attacking Christians, is completely false. I think this is a good first step on Jason's possible recovery from total delusion about his religious doctrines. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:36:41 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-2606071136410001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <5eclp9F37r3knU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" ><witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-2506072141500001@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <1182825539.614729.233910@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin >> > <phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: >> > >> >> On Jun 26, 8:29 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > In article <m5l083tvho8aq1m7bplo13mv79ltbci...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch >> >> > <l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >> >> > > So, aside from you huge ego, why do you claim that humans are >> >> > > special. >> >> > > The physical evidence shows otherwise. >> >> > >> >> > Because the Bible states that humans are special. >> >> >> >> So, aside from your huge ego, what possible reason do you have for >> >> believing anything in the Bible? You were asked before to find >> >> something -anything- in the Bible which is objectively true and you >> >> never answered (as usual). >> >> >> >> Martin >> > >> > Psalms 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart there is no God. >> >> If a fool can figure it out, what's your problem? > >My interpretation is difference: >Only fools believe there is not God. > But you like acting like a smug jerk, like the Pharisees as they were portrayed in the Gospels. I'm sure you can read what Jesus said about them -- and you. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-2606071228180001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <4cp2831rq5i8fqa37g7o1h82oc5qi3b2en@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein > <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:10:02 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) in >> <Jason-2606071210030001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: >> >> >In article <e5o283lotrdrd5vi4feve9upgb6gg585dh@4ax.com>, Matt >> >Silberstein >> ><RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: >> > >> >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:25:10 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com >> >> (Jason) in >> >> <Jason-2606071125110001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: >> >> >> >> >In article <5eclilF37sb6pU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" >> >> ><witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> >> news:Jason-2506071804250001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> >> > In article <K3Zfi.7097$n9.2456@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> >> >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> >> >> news:Jason-2506071704090001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> >> > <1182813173.218982.308140@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >> >> > Martin >> >> >> >> > Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 3:17 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> >> > In article > <1182773965.426707.320...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >> >> >> > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: >> >> >> >> >> > > On 25 Jun., 03:18, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> >> > > > In article >> >> >> >> >> > > > >> >> ><DipthotDipthot-A725FE.16174624062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> > > > > In article >> >> >> >> >> > > > > >> ><Jason-2306071116110...@66-52-22-111.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> >> >> >> > > > > J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > I want to make it legal for teachers >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > to teach ID >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > > > > But it is legal to do that... >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > > > > ... in a comparative religions, class, for example. >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > > > > So what's your problem? >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > > > I was referring to high school science and biology > classes. Of >> >> >> >> >> > > > course, >> >> >> >> >> > > > evolution should also be taught in those same classes. >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > > Why should a person with no understanding of science >> >> >> >> >> > > (self-admitted) >> >> >> >> >> > > decide what should be taught in a science class? Why >> >should the >> >> >> >> >> > > US >> >> >> >> >> > > give up religious freedom? >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > I posted a poll yesterday which indicated that most of the > people >> >> >> >> >> > that >> >> >> >> >> > live in Ohio want ID and Evolution to be taught in the >> >> >> >> >> > public >> >> >> >> >> > schools. >> >> >> >> >> > I >> >> >> >> >> > believe the people in Ohio should decide what subjects > should be >> >> >> >> >> > taught >> >> >> >> >> > in >> >> >> >> >> > the public schools. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> What if people in Ohio wanted teachers to teach that the >> >> >> >> >> Earth was >> >> >> >> >> flat? Do you think teachers should go along with it? I'd >> >> >> >> >> quit >> >> >> >> >> outright. Their loss. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Martin >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > The teachers that don't want to teach the established > curriculum in a >> >> >> >> > state school should quit. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> You side-stepped the issue Jason, do we let the public dictate >> >> >> >> what >> >> >> >> science >> >> >> >> is correct?? Take you Jason, you are what is known as a >> >> >> >> scientific >> >> >> >> illiterate. Do we let you and people like you, chose the science >> >> >> >> curriculum? >> >> >> > >> >> >> > No--but the people that live in Ohio should have a voice in >> >> >> > deciding >> >> >> > school curriculum. In this case over 60% of those people want > both ID and >> >> >> > evolution to be taught. >> >> >> >> >> >> Listen all ID is "God did it". So, when the kids come from home >> >> >> from >> >> >> school, all the parents have to do is say that and it's taken care >> >> >> of. >> >> >> There's no need for an entire course on the subject. >> >> > >> >> >There is more to it than that. The text book "Of Pandas and People" >> >> >has >> >> >170 pages. For example, two separate books have been written by the >> >> >proponents of creation science related to fossils and bones. A >> >> >summary of >> >> >the fossil evidence is probably discussed in that text book. >> >> >> >> Which is it, creation science, which is religious material, or >> >> Intelligent Design, which is pretend science. >> >> >> >> >Perhaps the parents could tell their children: "Life evolved from >> >> >non-life". So, when the kids come home from school, all the parents >> >> >have >> >> >to do is say that and it's taken care of. There's no need for an >> >> >entire >> >> >course on evolution. >> >> >> >> Sorry, but some of us are not interested in such simplistic answers. >> >> We want the real science and real evidence taught. We want children to >> >> learn about all the different kinds of evidence that shows that all >> >> life today evolved from a common ancestral population. >> > >> >I continue to believe that the citizens of a state should have a voice >> >in >> >deciding education policy. >> >> How nice. So does everyone else in this discussion, though. >> >> >That is far better than unelected evolutionists >> >deciding education policy by taking states to court if they disagree >> >with >> >how states are deciding education policy. >> >> Do you have an actual legal objection to the Dover case? > > > I don't believe there should have been a court case. It's my opinion that > evolutionists should NOT take states to court if they decide to teach ID. > The evolutionists should allow the representatives in each state to > determine education policy. Education policy should not be determined by > unelected evolutionists. For example, in the state of Ohio, the wishes of > the people were not taken into consideration by the evolutionists. I don't > know whether or not the judge took the wishes of the people or their > elected representatives into consideration prior to his decision--I doubt > it--but am only guessing. > Jason It is obvious by posting trash like this that you are really guessing. Does the school system tell accountants what to put in accounting textbooks? Isn't it amazing that only the TOE faces such problems. Judges also notice this in trials and always ask why is this the only challenge made to science. That way they can get to the religious nature of the problem rather quickly. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <MbydnUGQM6MSMBzbnZ2dnUVZ_vyunZ2d@comcast.com>, John Popelish <jpopelish@rica.net> wrote: > Jason wrote: > > In article <trWdnVoGW5eUORzbnZ2dnUVZ_tDinZ2d@comcast.com>, John Popelish > > <jpopelish@rica.net> wrote: > > > >> Jason wrote: > >> > >>> It seems to me that the child would be more comforted knowing that the > >>> child's grandmother was in heaven than being told that her grandmother was > >>> lying in a casket buried in the dirt. > >> It also seems that the child would be even more comforted > >> with a dose of morphine. Unfortunately, if you raise > >> children on doses of either lies or opiates, they grow up to > >> be adults with poorly developed minds. > > > > You may have to give the child a dose of morphine > > Have to? Or have what happen? > > > after telling the child > > that her grandmother was not in heaven but instead was still in the casket > > that was buried in the dirt. > > I can only assume that you are the child you are talking > about. Would you lose your mind and die of grief if someone > told you the truth about death? > > Life involves sorrow and happiness, pleasure and pain. > Making up lies to minimize the sorrow and pain also > diminishes the sweetness of their opposites. No--I was not the child--all my family members were Christians. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-2606071210030001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <e5o283lotrdrd5vi4feve9upgb6gg585dh@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein > <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:25:10 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) in >> <Jason-2606071125110001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: >> >> >In article <5eclilF37sb6pU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" >> ><witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: >> > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> news:Jason-2506071804250001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > In article <K3Zfi.7097$n9.2456@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> >> news:Jason-2506071704090001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> > <1182813173.218982.308140@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >> > Martin >> >> >> > Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 3:17 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> >> > <1182773965.426707.320...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >> >> > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: >> >> >> >> > > On 25 Jun., 03:18, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> > > > In article >> >> >> >> > > > >> ><DipthotDipthot-A725FE.16174624062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> >> >> > > > > In article >> >> >> >> > > > > > <Jason-2306071116110...@66-52-22-111.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> >> >> > > > > J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > > > I want to make it legal for teachers >> >> >> >> > > > > > to teach ID >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > > But it is legal to do that... >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > > ... in a comparative religions, class, for example. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > > So what's your problem? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > I was referring to high school science and biology >> >> >> >> > > > classes. Of >> >> >> >> > > > course, >> >> >> >> > > > evolution should also be taught in those same classes. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > Why should a person with no understanding of science >> >> >> >> > > (self-admitted) >> >> >> >> > > decide what should be taught in a science class? Why > should the >> >> >> >> > > US >> >> >> >> > > give up religious freedom? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > I posted a poll yesterday which indicated that most of the >> >> >> >> > people >> >> >> >> > that >> >> >> >> > live in Ohio want ID and Evolution to be taught in the public >> >> >> >> > schools. >> >> >> >> > I >> >> >> >> > believe the people in Ohio should decide what subjects should >> >> >> >> > be >> >> >> >> > taught >> >> >> >> > in >> >> >> >> > the public schools. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> What if people in Ohio wanted teachers to teach that the Earth >> >> >> >> was >> >> >> >> flat? Do you think teachers should go along with it? I'd quit >> >> >> >> outright. Their loss. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Martin >> >> >> > >> >> >> > The teachers that don't want to teach the established curriculum >> >> >> > in a >> >> >> > state school should quit. >> >> >> >> >> >> You side-stepped the issue Jason, do we let the public dictate what >> >> >> science >> >> >> is correct?? Take you Jason, you are what is known as a scientific >> >> >> illiterate. Do we let you and people like you, chose the science >> >> >> curriculum? >> >> > >> >> > No--but the people that live in Ohio should have a voice in deciding >> >> > school curriculum. In this case over 60% of those people want both >> >> > ID and >> >> > evolution to be taught. >> >> >> >> Listen all ID is "God did it". So, when the kids come from home from >> >> school, all the parents have to do is say that and it's taken care of. >> >> There's no need for an entire course on the subject. >> > >> >There is more to it than that. The text book "Of Pandas and People" has >> >170 pages. For example, two separate books have been written by the >> >proponents of creation science related to fossils and bones. A summary >> >of >> >the fossil evidence is probably discussed in that text book. >> >> Which is it, creation science, which is religious material, or >> Intelligent Design, which is pretend science. >> >> >Perhaps the parents could tell their children: "Life evolved from >> >non-life". So, when the kids come home from school, all the parents have >> >to do is say that and it's taken care of. There's no need for an entire >> >course on evolution. >> >> Sorry, but some of us are not interested in such simplistic answers. >> We want the real science and real evidence taught. We want children to >> learn about all the different kinds of evidence that shows that all >> life today evolved from a common ancestral population. > > I continue to believe that the citizens of a state should have a voice in > deciding education policy. That is far better than unelected evolutionists > deciding education policy by taking states to court if they disagree with > how states are deciding education policy. What you believe has no bearing on reality as has been shown to you in the past. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:55:44 -0400, in alt.talk.creationism Mike <prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com> wrote in <f5rcu0$p8o$1@news04.infoave.net>: >Michael Gray wrote: >> I managed to complete my entire Computer Sciewnce degree using IBM >> punched cards! (With 12 hour turnaround!) >> I remember having a subroutine that amounted to three of those 2 foot >> long boxes of cards, and dropping one of them on the way to the >> counter, shuffling its entire contents down the hallway. >> I nearly cried. > >You didn't number them???????????? > >(Neither did I.) For those too lazy to have sorting numbers, there was always the option of running a magic marker across the deck at an angle. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <95igi.114$ca.5@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-2606071631170001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > In article <1182891430.834265.109900@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > > gudloos@yahoo.com wrote: > > > >> On 26 Jun., 20:40, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> > In article <1182874101.911955.323...@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>, > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > >> > > On 26 Jun., 02:25, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> > > > In article <1182814064.453751.298...@n60g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > >> > > >> > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > >> > > > > On 25 Jun., 21:39, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> > > > > > In article > >> > > > > > <1182799149.323449.320...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com= > >> >, "Bob > >> > > snip > >> > > >> > > > > > My point is that various people rejected the evidence based > >> > > > > > upon > >> > what they > >> > > > > > already believe.- Skjul tekst i anf=3DF8rselstegn - > >> > > >> > > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=3DF8rselstegn - > >> > > >> > > > > Since there was no evidence to reject, you have no point. There > >> > > > > was > >> > > > > hearsay testimony. How could the doctor or the person cured > >> > > > > possib= > >> ly > >> > > > > know it was a miracle. This has been asked in various ways > >> > > > > repeate= > >> d, > >> > > > > and you are still ignoring it. > >> > > >> > > > I understand your question. The doctor knew that William Kent had > >> > > > bee= > >> n in > >> > > > a wheel chair for several years. The doctor had X-Rays and medical > >> > > > re= > >> cords > >> > > > related to the reason William Kent was disabled. That same doctor > >> > > > hea= > >> rd > >> > > > Willam Kent's testimony related to his healing. That doctor > >> > > > examined > >> > > > William Kent and determined that he was no longer disabled and > >> > > > could = > >> walk > >> > > > normally. The doctor believed the testimony of William Kent related > >> > > > t= > >> o the > >> > > > healing. Can William Kent or the doctor provide PROOF that God > >> > > > healed > >> > > > William Kent that would satisfy athiests? The answer is NO. Can > >> > > > Willam > >> > > > Kent and his doctor provide testimonies and statements that will > >> > > > conv= > >> ince > >> > > > other Christians and myself that William Kent was healed? The > >> > > > answer = > >> is > >> > > > Yes. Atheists do not believe the testimony of William Kent because > >> > > > of > >> > > > their belief system. > >> > > >> > > You have been told why we do not believe the testimony, which means > >> > > the above is a lie. > >> > > >> > > >Many Christians will believe the testimony of William > >> > > > Kent because of our belief system. I doubt that anyone will > >> > > > understan= > >> d my > >> > > > point.- > >> > > >> > > Your point is that you have no evidence and you lie about it, making > >> > > it worse by accusing atheists of being as dishonest as you. > >> > > >> > Your belief system causes you to reject or not believe the testimonies > >> > of > >> > those people. > >> > >> And you repeat your lie about my motivations. > >> > >> >My belief system causes me to accept and believe the > >> > testimonies.- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > >> > > >> > >> Since I have no belief system, I require evidence. Continue with your > >> delibrately insulting lies if they amuse you; they change nothing. > > > > You are the first adult person that has ever told me that they have no > > belief system. > > What belief systems do you think adults have? They have various beliefs about various things. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-2606071047380001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <5eclv9F38b9mhU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" > <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-2506072238410001@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <1182828376.590242.59740@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, >> > Martin >> > Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: >> > >> >> On Jun 26, 9:12 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > In article <yAZfi.7126$n9.6...@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> >> > <mmman...@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> > > "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> > >news:Jason-2406071818230001@66-52-22-6.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > > > In article >> >> > > > <DipthotDipthot-A725FE.16174624062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > > >> In article >> >> > > >> <Jason-2306071116110...@66-52-22-111.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> > > >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > >> >> > > >> > I want to make it legal for teachers >> >> > > >> > to teach ID >> >> > >> >> > > >> But it is legal to do that... >> >> > >> >> > > >> ... in a comparative religions, class, for example. >> >> > >> >> > > >> So what's your problem? >> >> > >> >> > > > I was referring to high school science and biology classes. Of >> >> > > > course, >> >> > > > evolution should also be taught in those same classes. >> >> > >> >> > > Tell me Jason, just how would you propose teaching ID as science? >> > Please be >> >> > > specific in your reply. >> >> > >> >> > Teachers and students would use the textbook "Of Pandas and People" >> >> > which >> >> > has no Biblical content. >> >> >> >> It also has no scientific content. And you can't argue that it does >> >> because you've never seen it. >> >> >> >> Martin >> > >> > That's true--just a book review. >> >> How can you advocate something you haven't even bothered to read? > > Since I know the basics of creation science and ID--I don't need to > re-learn the basics of creation science and ID by reading the book. It's > like a high school physics teacher not needing to read the high school > physics textbook cover to cover prior to teaching the first class. Of course you know the basics. You also know the details, 'god did it'. Hardly any way to teach science to the students. After all, that is all there is to CS and ID. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:18:56 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-2606071218570001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <f5rnk0$40j$1@news04.infoave.net>, Mike ><prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com> wrote: > >> Bob T. wrote: .... >> > <snicker> No, he wouldn't. >> >> He didn't listen when they asked him not to invade (at least in Iraq's >> case, he didn't. I'm not saying if the invasion was right or wrong; >> simply pointing out that it was against the wishes of the then-current >> leader(s) of the country.) so why would he listen when they ask him to >> leave? > >In Iraq--the current leaders are different than the former leaders. If the >current leaders asked Bush to remove the troops--I believe Bush would >remove the troops. I seem to recall that the citzens voted on this issue >about a year ago and they voted to keep our troops in their country. They >had to have their finger prints tested and they proudly held up their >inked fingers to the cameras to show they had freely voted. George Bush has made it abundantly clear that he will not remove the troops and that he has no use for democracy anywhere, not even in the US. .... Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:00:00 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-2606071200010001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <1182873774.679677.7820@u2g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, >gudloos@yahoo.com wrote: .... >> >> The Moslems of the Middle East are not involved in the Sudan. You are >> making =EDt up as you go along. > >Are there any Arab Muslims in Darfur? > The people in Khartoum and other areas of northern Sudan consider themselves to be Arabs. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-2606071742250001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <95igi.114$ca.5@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-2606071631170001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <1182891430.834265.109900@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, >> > gudloos@yahoo.com wrote: >> > >> >> On 26 Jun., 20:40, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > In article <1182874101.911955.323...@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>, >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: >> >> > > On 26 Jun., 02:25, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > > > In article >> >> > > > <1182814064.453751.298...@n60g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, >> >> > >> >> > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: >> >> > > > > On 25 Jun., 21:39, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > > > > > In article >> >> > > > > > <1182799149.323449.320...@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com= >> >> >, "Bob >> >> > > snip >> >> > >> >> > > > > > My point is that various people rejected the evidence based >> >> > > > > > upon >> >> > what they >> >> > > > > > already believe.- Skjul tekst i anf=3DF8rselstegn - >> >> > >> >> > > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=3DF8rselstegn - >> >> > >> >> > > > > Since there was no evidence to reject, you have no point. >> >> > > > > There >> >> > > > > was >> >> > > > > hearsay testimony. How could the doctor or the person cured >> >> > > > > possib= >> >> ly >> >> > > > > know it was a miracle. This has been asked in various ways >> >> > > > > repeate= >> >> d, >> >> > > > > and you are still ignoring it. >> >> > >> >> > > > I understand your question. The doctor knew that William Kent >> >> > > > had >> >> > > > bee= >> >> n in >> >> > > > a wheel chair for several years. The doctor had X-Rays and >> >> > > > medical >> >> > > > re= >> >> cords >> >> > > > related to the reason William Kent was disabled. That same >> >> > > > doctor >> >> > > > hea= >> >> rd >> >> > > > Willam Kent's testimony related to his healing. That doctor >> >> > > > examined >> >> > > > William Kent and determined that he was no longer disabled and >> >> > > > could = >> >> walk >> >> > > > normally. The doctor believed the testimony of William Kent >> >> > > > related >> >> > > > t= >> >> o the >> >> > > > healing. Can William Kent or the doctor provide PROOF that God >> >> > > > healed >> >> > > > William Kent that would satisfy athiests? The answer is NO. Can >> >> > > > Willam >> >> > > > Kent and his doctor provide testimonies and statements that will >> >> > > > conv= >> >> ince >> >> > > > other Christians and myself that William Kent was healed? The >> >> > > > answer = >> >> is >> >> > > > Yes. Atheists do not believe the testimony of William Kent >> >> > > > because >> >> > > > of >> >> > > > their belief system. >> >> > >> >> > > You have been told why we do not believe the testimony, which >> >> > > means >> >> > > the above is a lie. >> >> > >> >> > > >Many Christians will believe the testimony of William >> >> > > > Kent because of our belief system. I doubt that anyone will >> >> > > > understan= >> >> d my >> >> > > > point.- >> >> > >> >> > > Your point is that you have no evidence and you lie about it, >> >> > > making >> >> > > it worse by accusing atheists of being as dishonest as you. >> >> > >> >> > Your belief system causes you to reject or not believe the >> >> > testimonies >> >> > of >> >> > those people. >> >> >> >> And you repeat your lie about my motivations. >> >> >> >> >My belief system causes me to accept and believe the >> >> > testimonies.- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - >> >> > >> >> >> >> Since I have no belief system, I require evidence. Continue with your >> >> delibrately insulting lies if they amuse you; they change nothing. >> > >> > You are the first adult person that has ever told me that they have no >> > belief system. >> >> What belief systems do you think adults have? > > They have various beliefs about various things. Wow, ask a moron a question and get an answer like this. My bad, I should have known better. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <f0b383haha6keoc6or4mu5tg1cj462naci@4ax.com>, Free Lunch <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:28:17 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > <Jason-2606071228180001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >In article <4cp2831rq5i8fqa37g7o1h82oc5qi3b2en@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein > ><RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > > > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:10:02 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com > >> (Jason) in > >> <Jason-2606071210030001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: > ... > >> >That is far better than unelected evolutionists > >> >deciding education policy by taking states to court if they disagree with > >> >how states are deciding education policy. > >> > >> Do you have an actual legal objection to the Dover case? > > > > > >I don't believe there should have been a court case. It's my opinion that > >evolutionists should NOT take states to court if they decide to teach ID. > > The First Amendment tells us that your opinion is wrong. > > >The evolutionists should allow the representatives in each state to > >determine education policy. > > Citizens establish policy. The vast majority of citizens want science > taught. Only a few people want to destroy the Constitution. A poll in Ohio indicated that over 60% wanted both ID and evolution be taught in the public school system. > > >Education policy should not be determined by > >unelected evolutionists. > > It is not. > > > For example, in the state of Ohio, the wishes of > >the people were not taken into consideration by the evolutionists. I don't > >know whether or not the judge took the wishes of the people or their > >elected representatives into consideration prior to his decision--I doubt > >it--but am only guessing. > > The school board was thrown out after the trial. The people of Dover > were embarrassed that they had been used by their supposedly 'Christian' > friends. You are still advocating the destruction of the First > Amendment. > > Tell me, since you want creation myths taught in science class, will you > accept all of them or only the one you believe in? Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-2606071725240001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <gda383p79807j37f1ju8ibliueqh6kqp1e@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:08:43 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> <Jason-2606071108440001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >In article <jp3283pji9203fg6293kfgmbpvrq443r0u@4ax.com>, Matt >> >Silberstein >> ><RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: >> > >> >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:04:24 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com >> >> (Jason) in >> >> <Jason-2506071804250001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: >> >> >> >> [snip] >> >> >> >> >No--but the people that live in Ohio should have a voice in deciding >> >> >school curriculum. >> >> >> >> And they do, in every state even. >> >> >> >> >In this case over 60% of those people want both ID and >> >> >evolution to be taught. >> >> >> >> I'll bite: what would the ID curriculum consist of? I guess that you >> >> have not actually followed the Ohio situation. The state did decide to >> >> teach ID and then ran into a serious problem: there is nothing to >> >> teach. Nothing . The Discovery Institute, the major promoters of ID, >> >> have said that they never meant for anyone to actually teach ID (even >> >> though they called for teaching ID for years), they want schools to >> >> "teach the controversy". It is an amusing idea: they have no content >> >> to present, but they want the schools to teach a controversy over that >> >> (non-existent) content. >> >> >> >> So, please, tell me what would actually get taught in an Intelligent >> >> Design course. I will help you get started: tell us what "Intelligent" >> >> means, tell us what "Design" means, tell us how to detect intelligence >> >> and design, tell us who the designers were, tell us when the designers >> >> acted, tell us what the designers did, tell us what tools the >> >> designers used, tell us something about the designers goals. That is, >> >> answer any of those questions or, at the very least, give us a clue >> >> on how someone would go about learning the answers to those questions. >> >> I am sorry, Jason, but there is no ID to teach. >> > >> >The teachers would use a textbook entitled, "Of Pandas and People" which >> >has no Biblical content. Visit the Discovery Institute and read the >> >articles related to teaching ID in the public schools. If you want to >> >learn about the basics of ID and creation science--read this book: >> >"Origins: Creation or Evolution" by R.B. Bliss >> > >> Jason, you keep ignoring that Pandas does not have a shred of scientific >> content to support ID/Creationism and that it was a Creationist textbook >> first. > > They advertise the Pandas book in the ICR newsletter. SO WHAT??? Did you refute his statement? No. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 08:53:44 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism gudloos@yahoo.com wrote in <1182873224.668805.269050@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com>: >On 26 Jun., 01:46, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> In article <1182812406.148531.4...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >> >> >> >> gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: >> > On 25 Jun., 08:31, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> > > In article <1182751329.065068.288...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, "Bob >> >> > > T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote: >> > > > On Jun 24, 9:31 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> > > > > In article <1182738013.400195.243...@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, "= >> > Bob >> >> > > > > T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote: >> > > > > > On Jun 24, 6:35 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > > > > > > Here is some information about the Christians in Iran. >> >> > > > > > <snip article> >> >> > > > > > Iran is an excellent example of what happens when religious nutcases >> > > > > > are allowed to rule a country. And you, Jason, clearly wish that >> > > > > > America was more like Iran. >> >> > > > > > - Bob T. >> >> > > > > Yes, it would be wonderful if everyone in the world were Christians. >> >> > > > Yes, then the world would be just like Iran - run by superstitious >> > > > fools who allow no dissent. How would you like to live under Muslim >> > > > religious law, Jason? Well, that's what the world you envision would >> > > > be like - we would all have to worry about the Inquisition knocking on >> > > > our door at any moment to check on our sex lives. >> >> > > > I much prefer to live in America, which is still a land of freedom, >> > > > including freedom from religion. >> >> > > > - Bob T. >> >> > > I also like living in America. The end goal of the Muslims are to take >> > > over the world--one country at a time. >> >> > It is also the goal of Christians. You said so. >> >> There is a BIG difference. If people refuse to become Muslims, the Muslims >> chop off thier heads. If people refuse to become Christians, we don't harm >> them in any way. Has any Christian ever harmed you or threatened you? >> >> >> >> > They are presently committing >> > > genocide on the people that live in Darfur. >> >> > All the Moslems are doing that? Even the ones that are at war with >> > each other? Stop being such a fool. >> >> > After they take over control >> > > of the Sudan, they will use the Sudan as a staging ground to take over >> > > surrounding countries. >> >> > The Sudan is a Muslem country and has been for many centuries. >> >> The Muslims from Middle east are taking over the Sudan. They are either >> killing the Black Muslims or forcing them to leave the country. > >The ones doing the killing are nomadic tribesmen in the Sudan. The >Blacks are animists and Christians. You are once again exposed as an >ignorant liar. You are confusing two different wars. The war in the south was the Moslems of the north against the animists and Christians of the south. The war in Darfur is more tribal, but generally everyone involved is Moslem. This is a tribal war. There is some sense in which it is racist, but the supposedly Arab north and the Janjaweed are not notably lighter black than the blacks in Darfur who are being killed. .... Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-2606071738080001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <ama383tt5lqob7ei5h7hgk4apsu7k62cj9@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:25:10 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> <Jason-2606071125110001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >In article <5eclilF37sb6pU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" >> ><witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: >> > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> news:Jason-2506071804250001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > In article <K3Zfi.7097$n9.2456@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> >> news:Jason-2506071704090001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> > <1182813173.218982.308140@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >> > Martin >> >> >> > Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 3:17 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> > In article >> >> >> >> > <1182773965.426707.320...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, >> >> >> >> > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: >> >> >> >> > > On 25 Jun., 03:18, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> > > > In article >> >> >> >> > > > >> ><DipthotDipthot-A725FE.16174624062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: >> >> >> >> > > > > In article >> >> >> >> > > > > > <Jason-2306071116110...@66-52-22-111.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> >> >> >> > > > > J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > > > I want to make it legal for teachers >> >> >> >> > > > > > to teach ID >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > > But it is legal to do that... >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > > ... in a comparative religions, class, for example. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > > So what's your problem? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > > I was referring to high school science and biology >> >> >> >> > > > classes. Of >> >> >> >> > > > course, >> >> >> >> > > > evolution should also be taught in those same classes. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > Why should a person with no understanding of science >> >> >> >> > > (self-admitted) >> >> >> >> > > decide what should be taught in a science class? Why > should the >> >> >> >> > > US >> >> >> >> > > give up religious freedom? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > I posted a poll yesterday which indicated that most of the >> >> >> >> > people >> >> >> >> > that >> >> >> >> > live in Ohio want ID and Evolution to be taught in the public >> >> >> >> > schools. >> >> >> >> > I >> >> >> >> > believe the people in Ohio should decide what subjects should >> >> >> >> > be >> >> >> >> > taught >> >> >> >> > in >> >> >> >> > the public schools. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> What if people in Ohio wanted teachers to teach that the Earth >> >> >> >> was >> >> >> >> flat? Do you think teachers should go along with it? I'd quit >> >> >> >> outright. Their loss. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Martin >> >> >> > >> >> >> > The teachers that don't want to teach the established curriculum >> >> >> > in a >> >> >> > state school should quit. >> >> >> >> >> >> You side-stepped the issue Jason, do we let the public dictate what >> >> >> science >> >> >> is correct?? Take you Jason, you are what is known as a scientific >> >> >> illiterate. Do we let you and people like you, chose the science >> >> >> curriculum? >> >> > >> >> > No--but the people that live in Ohio should have a voice in deciding >> >> > school curriculum. In this case over 60% of those people want both >> >> > ID and >> >> > evolution to be taught. >> >> >> >> Listen all ID is "God did it". So, when the kids come from home from >> >> school, all the parents have to do is say that and it's taken care of. >> >> There's no need for an entire course on the subject. >> > >> >There is more to it than that. The text book "Of Pandas and People" has >> >170 pages. For example, two separate books have been written by the >> >proponents of creation science related to fossils and bones. A summary >> >of >> >the fossil evidence is probably discussed in that text book. >> >> Jason, you are so easy to con that even the stupidest religious teacher >> can get you to believe the biggest lie. Pandas and People is not a >> science book. If you had ever read it and learned anything about >> science, you would know that the authors of P&P are liars. >> >> >Perhaps the parents could tell their children: "Life evolved from >> >non-life". So, when the kids come home from school, all the parents have >> >to do is say that and it's taken care of. There's no need for an entire >> >course on evolution. >> >> Evolution is about the change in life over time. You have been corrected >> on that about a thousand times, yet still seem incapable of learning >> such a simple fact. > > I made the evolution comment in response to this comment: > >> >> Listen all ID is "God did it". So, when the kids come from home from >> >> school, all the parents have to do is say that and it's taken care of. >> >> There's no need for an entire course on the subject. > > One the results of not teaching ID in the public schools is the rapid > growth of the home schooling movement. In addition, many large churches > has opened "Christian Schools". I once visited a large church that I don't > attend. I noticed about 30 little children playing. I was told that they > recently started a Christian school since the parents wanted the children > to learn about God. Many Christian parents and rich parents have now > given up on the public schools. Evolutionists are one of the reasons. One > of reasons they do not want ID to be taught is because they are afraid > that children would realize that it makes more sense than evolution. Of > course, no poster in this newsgroup would admit that was one of the > reasons. > Jason You're dumber than they are. I hope we can get all Christians in Christian schools. That way those who are left can study science. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:37:19 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-2606071137190001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <xY7gi.7470$n9.4666@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" ><mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-2506072216280001@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <obWdnSoYvoJc6x3bnZ2dnUVZ_jKdnZ2d@sti.net>, "David V." >> > <spam@hotmail.com> wrote: >> > >> >> Jason wrote: >> >> > Gallup Poll: Two Thirds of Americans Believe God Created Them >> >> >> >> That's pretty sad, isn't it. In this supposedly advanced society >> >> so many people still believe in a myth. It is really embarrassing >> >> for our country. In no other advanced society, and many that >> >> aren't so advanced, is there so much scientific ignorance as >> >> there is here. 'Tis a very sad comment on our society. >> > >> > I disagree--I think that it's great news that so many people realize that >> > God is watching over them and will even take them to heaven when they die. >> > When Christian relatives and friends die, it's wonderful to realize that >> > we will join them in heaven when we die. I am looking forward to seeing my >> > parents and my sister when I make it to heaven. >> > Jason >> >> Won't happen Jason. > >I disagree. > Even though you don't have a shred of evidence to support any of your religious claims. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <l7b383p45gskdp0v9cdfe7e4c7qibd086t@4ax.com>, Free Lunch <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 13:10:53 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > <Jason-2606071310530001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >In article <fvq2835jq1l5hnd19r2chtq2071ckhaimt@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein > ><RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > .... > >> You really should try to learn something about the law rather than > >> guessing. Judges take things like the Constitution into account, not > >> votes. Some of us like the Constitution. Why do you hate America? > > > >I don't hate America. > > You are advocating the destruction of the Constitution. > > >People like yourself appear to me to want judges to > >determine the education policy in the various states. Was the judge in > >that Dover case elected or appointed? > > You never read anything people tell you. If you had, you would know that > Bush appointed him. He was a Federal District judge. This was a federal > case. > > >I would prefer that the elected representives determine school policy and > >not judges or evolutionists. > > So you don't care if the Bill of Rights is shredded. If a legislature > declares that your particular religious sect is a criminal organization, > that's fine with you. If you no longer have the Fifth Amendment to > protect you, that's fine with you. > > People who immigrated here without proper papers have more respect for > the law and for this country than you do. Maybe you should leave so we > can have room for more illegals. > > >People like yourself seem to have no regard for the wishes of the people > >that live in Ohio and various other states. Over 60 percent of the > >citizens of Ohio wanted Evolution and ID to be taught. > > It depends on how the question is asked. > > If the question were asked properly, they would say no. People do not > want religious doctrines taught in science class. The poll indicated that over 60% of the people that live in Ohio wanted both ID and evolution be taught in the public schools. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 13:14:36 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-2606071314370001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <J1egi.15745$19.7282@bignews5.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" ><mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:Jason-2606071137190001@66-52-22-67.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> > In article <xY7gi.7470$n9.4666@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" >> > <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: >> > >> >> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> news:Jason-2506072216280001@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> > In article <obWdnSoYvoJc6x3bnZ2dnUVZ_jKdnZ2d@sti.net>, "David V." >> >> > <spam@hotmail.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> Jason wrote: >> >> >> > Gallup Poll: Two Thirds of Americans Believe God Created Them >> >> >> >> >> >> That's pretty sad, isn't it. In this supposedly advanced society >> >> >> so many people still believe in a myth. It is really embarrassing >> >> >> for our country. In no other advanced society, and many that >> >> >> aren't so advanced, is there so much scientific ignorance as >> >> >> there is here. 'Tis a very sad comment on our society. >> >> > >> >> > I disagree--I think that it's great news that so many people realize >> >> > that >> >> > God is watching over them and will even take them to heaven when they >> >> > die. >> >> > When Christian relatives and friends die, it's wonderful to realize >> >> > that >> >> > we will join them in heaven when we die. I am looking forward to seeing >> >> > my >> >> > parents and my sister when I make it to heaven. >> >> > Jason >> >> >> >> Won't happen Jason. >> > >> > I disagree. >> >> You can disagree all you want, it still isn't going to happen. The concept >> of heaven and hell is another logical reason not to believe the bible. > >We will both know for sure on the day that we die. > >What do atheists tell small children when they ask questions like this one: > >I really miss Grandma and wish she had not died? Is she in heaven? I also don't engage in child abuse by threatening them with Hell. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-2606071719340001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <h793835evod0h2gogp22l9e83dgk7f533s@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein > <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 16:36:57 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) in >> <Jason-2606071636570001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >I doubt that most judges are experts related to science. >> >> >> >> Right, that is why both sides have expert witnesses. >> >> >> >> >I believe that >> >> >elected representatives should determine education policy--not >> >> >unelected >> >> >evolutionists. >> >> >> >> You misspelled judge yet again. >> >> >> >> >Its my opinion that evoltionists do not want ID to be >> >> >taught since they are concerned the children would realize that ID >> >> >makes >> >> >more sense than evolution. >> >> >> >> Your opinion does not outweigh facts. I don't want ID taught because >> >> it is either very bad science or religious teachings and I don't want >> >> either of those in the public schools. I don't think that any school >> >> should teach bad science, but private schools do have some freedom. >> >> >> >> You really should read the Dover decision. You may well be concerned >> >> about learning something about the topic, but publicizing ignorance is >> >> even worse. >> > >> >Matt, >> >I am not an excellent writer. This person makes my points much better >> >than >> >I could make them: >> >> Your issue is not writing, your problem is that you don't know the >> law. You did not even know that Federal judges were appointed rather >> than elected. > > My memory is not perfect. > > > >> >> >I found this article by conducting a google search for "Judicial Fiat" >> > >> > July, 2003 >> >"Judicial Fiat" >> > >> >Every clear-headed Christian/American should be righteously angry over >> >those federal court rulings that create law rather than interpret law. >> > >> >The most recent ruling by a federal judge to remove the Ten Commandments >> >> Which version did they use? Catholic, Protestant, or Jewish? >> >> >from school grounds at West Union, Peebles, North Adams, and Manchester >> >High Schools in Ohio is a clear example of "legislation by mandate" (or >> >fiat) by a single judge against the will of the democratic majority. >> >> Nothing to do with the creationism. >> >> >I'm as capable as any judge to read and understand the Constitution of >> >the >> >United States and nowhere in that document are there any such words as >> >"separation of church and state." Nowhere! >> >> Wow, as capable as any judge. I thought that humility was a Christian >> virtue. And it is too bad that the judges in those cases did not claim >> that the Constitution has the phrase "separation of church and state". >> It does have the Establishment Clause, however. >> >> >The truth is, the Constitution under Article I section 1 says: "All >> >legislative powers here-in granted shall be vested in a Congress of the >> >United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of >> >Representatives." Clearly those judges who mandate or make new law are >> >in >> >violation of Article I and should be impeached, tried and convicted of >> >high crimes. >> >> ROTFOLMAO. It is too bad that they did not make any laws. That >> arrogance thing is showing again. >> >> >Also, the first Amendment (Bill of Rights) says, "Congress shall make no >> >law respecting on establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free >> >exercise thereof Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 13:16:46 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-2606071316460001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <1182887737.836228.164980@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, >gudloos@yahoo.com wrote: > >> On 26 Jun., 02:57, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> > In article <1182816528.662652.63...@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin >> > >> > snip >> >> > Martin, >> > I recall learning that Easter Sunday was derived from the tradition that >> > Jesus rose from the dead on Sunday. Google "Easter Sunday" to find out the >> > reason it is called Easter Sunday and not Easter Monday. >> > Jason- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - >> > >> >> And, according to your "logic", Christians must be pagans, since the >> word "Easter" comes from the name of a pagan goddess. > >This is from Wikipedia: > >Easter, the Sunday of the Resurrection, Pascha, or Resurrection Day, is >the most important religious feast of the Christian liturgical year, >observed at some point between late March and late April each year (early >April to early May in Eastern Christianity), following the cycle of the >moon. It celebrates the resurrection of Jesus, which Christians believe >occurred on the third day of his death by crucifixion some time in the >period AD 27 to 33. Easter also refers to the season of the church year, >called Eastertide or the Easter Season. Traditionally the Easter Season >lasted for the forty days from Easter Day until Ascension Day but now >officially lasts for the fifty days until Pentecost. The first week of the >Easter Season is known as Easter Week or the Octave of Easter. > >Today many families celebrate Easter in a completely secular way, as a >non-religious holiday. > But the _name_ was still adopted from a secular fertility festival. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <Fiigi.120$ca.57@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: > <snipped for brevity> > ">> It was a Republican judge, nominated by Bush, that ruled in the Dover > >> case. > >> > >> >For example, in the state of Ohio, the wishes of > >> >the people were not taken into consideration by the evolutionists. > >> > >> You keep confusing "court" with "evolutionist". And in Ohio the > >> problem was that there is no ID curriculum to teach. Have you checked > >> the Discovery Institute yet on this? > >> > >> >I don't > >> >know whether or not the judge took the wishes of the people or their > >> >elected representatives into consideration prior to his decision--I > >> >doubt > >> >it--but am only guessing. > >> > >> You really should try to learn something about the law rather than > >> guessing. Judges take things like the Constitution into account, not > >> votes. Some of us like the Constitution. Why do you hate America? > > > > I don't hate America. People like yourself appear to me to want judges to > > determine the education policy in the various states. Was the judge in > > that Dover case elected or appointed? > > > > I would prefer that the elected representives determine school policy and > > not judges or evolutionists. > > > > People like yourself seem to have no regard for the wishes of the people > > that live in Ohio and various other states. Over 60 percent of the > > citizens of Ohio wanted Evolution and ID to be taught. > > Scientists will determine what courses will be considered as science. Do you > think people like you are qualified to do this? Sorry--I was under the impression that school boards and the state sectratary of education made decisions as to what courses should be taught. Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 21:50:05 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-2506072150060001@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >In article <m6r083hfa4oebpf4a56skimde32a9itmd5@4ax.com>, Free Lunch ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:27:34 -0700, in alt.atheism >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> <Jason-2506071827340001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >In article <mip083tkkqhcp757tku7i60mga5nmhp6tr@4ax.com>, Free Lunch >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> > >> >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:49:48 -0700, in alt.atheism >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> <Jason-2506071749490001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >In article <r0n083d7l69bkbc3m7p60j3l60hlme9aeh@4ax.com>, Free Lunch >> >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:46:36 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism >> >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> >> <Jason-2506071046360001@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >> >In article <stqv7396nu5e3jsncsntpea7hi1dvcrb8r@4ax.com>, John Baker >> >> >> ><nunya@bizniz.net> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 05:28:42 -0700, gudloos@yahoo.com wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >On 25 Jun., 03:35, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> >> ... >> >> >> >> >> For those people that believe Yahweh and Allah are the same >> >God--please >> >> >> >> >> explain why there is a symbol of a crescent moon on top of >> >every Mormon >> >> >> >> >> Mosque in the world? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Sure, Jason. Just as soon as you tell me where I might find a >> >> >> >> Mormon mosque. <G> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >Sorry--I meant Muslim Mosque. >> >> >> >> >> >> Which Mosque would you be willing to go into and tell the worshippers >> >> >> that they do not worship the God of Abraham? What evidence can you >> >> >> provide them that you are right and that Mohammed lied to them? >> >> > >> >> >Hubal and Allah the Moon God? >> >> > >> >> >Islam: Truth or Myth? start page >> >> > >> >> >Introduction to basic facts of history: >> >> > >> >> > 1. Moon worship has been practiced in Arabia since 2000 BC. The >> >> >crescent moon is the most common symbol of this pagan moon worship as far >> >> >back as 2000 BC. >> >> > 2. In Mecca, there was a god named Hubal who was Lord of the Kabah. >> >> > 3. This Hubal was a moon god. >> >> > 4. One Muslim apologist confessed that the idol of moon god Hubal was >> >> >placed upon the roof of the Kaba about 400 years before Muhammad. This may >> >> >in fact be the origin of why the crescent moon is on top of every minaret >> >> >at the Kaba today and the central symbol of Islam atop of every mosque >> >> >throughout the world: >> >> > >> >> > About four hundred years before the birth of Muhammad one Amr >> >> >bin Lahyo ... a descendant of Qahtan and king of Hijaz, had put an idol >> >> >called Hubal on the roof of the Kaba. This was one of the chief deities of >> >> >the Quraish before Islam. (Muhammad The Holy Prophet, Hafiz Ghulam Sarwar >> >> >(Pakistan), p 18-19, Muslim) >> >> > >> >> > 5. The moon god was also referred to as "al-ilah". This is not a proper >> >> >name of a single specific god, but a generic reference meaning "the god". >> >> >Each local pagan Arab tribe would refer to their own local tribal pagan >> >> >god as "al-ilah". >> >> > 6. "al-ilah" was later shortened to Allah before Muhammad began >> >> >promoting his new religion in 610 AD. >> >> > 7. There is evidence that Hubal was referred to as "Allah". >> >> > 8. When Muhammad came along, he dropped all references to the name >> >> >"Hubal" but retained the generic "Allah". >> >> > 9. Muhammad retained almost all the pagan rituals of the Arabs at the >> >> >Kaba and redefined them in monotheistic terms. >> >> > 10. Regardless of the specifics of the facts, it is clear that Islam is >> >> >derived from paganism that once worshiped a moon-god. >> >> > 11. Although Islam is today a monotheist religion, its roots are in >> >paganism. >> >> > >> >> > Hubal the moon god of the Kabah >> >> > >> >> > Allah the moon god of the Kabah >> >> > >> >> >Remnants of pagan Moon god worship in the Koran >> >> > >> >> >Pre-Islamic Origin of the word Allah >> >> > >> >> >Photogallery of the ancient history of Moon god worship >> >> > >> >> >Modern usage of moon god symbols in Islam today. >> >> > >> >> That does not show that they worship a moon god. >> >> >> >> You wouldn't persuade anyone that you know what you are talking about. >> > >> >Why is there the symbol of a crescent moon on top of every mosque? >> > >> Why not? What does that have to do with the fact that they worship the >> God of Abraham? >> >> Christians use a cross. Does that mean that God is dead? > >Here is the answer to the question: > >> > 1. Moon worship has been practiced in Arabia since 2000 BC. The >>> >crescent moon is the most common symbol of this pagan moon worship as far >>> >back as 2000 BC. >>> > 2. In Mecca, there was a god named Hubal who was Lord of the Kabah. >>> > 3. This Hubal was a moon god. >>> > 4. One Muslim apologist confessed that the idol of moon god Hubal was >>> >placed upon the roof of the Kaba about 400 years before Muhammad. This may >>> >in fact be the origin of why the crescent moon is on top of every minaret >>> >at the Kaba today and the central symbol of Islam atop of every mosque >>> >throughout the world: No, that is not an answer to my question. Mohammed was a religious reformer and part of his reform was to state that there was only one god, the God of Abraham. You are lying about Islam. I notice that you refused to respond to the fact that Easter was borrowed from pagan worship. Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.