Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182915204.792299.46850@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, Martin <phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: > On Jun 27, 3:10 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > I continue to believe that the citizens of a state should have a voice in > > deciding education policy. That is far better than unelected evolutionists > > deciding education policy by taking states to court if they disagree with > > how states are deciding education policy. > > You're taking a stand against academic freedom. > > academic freedom > -noun 1. freedom of a teacher to discuss or investigate any > controversial social, economic, or political problems without > interference or penalty from officials, organized groups, etc. > 2=2E freedom of a student to explore any field or hold any belief > without interference from the teacher. > Based on the Random House Unabridged Dictionary, =A9 Random House, Inc. > 2006. > > academic freedom > n=2E Liberty to teach, pursue, and discuss knowledge without > restriction or interference, as by school or public officials. > The American Heritage=AE Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth > Edition > Copyright =A9 2006 by Houghton Mifflin Company. > Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved. > > academic freedom > noun > the freedom of teachers and students to express their ideas in school > without religious or political or institutional restrictions > WordNet=AE 3.0, =A9 2006 by Princeton University. > > academic freedom > The right of teachers and students to express their ideas in the > classroom or in writing, free from political, religious, or > institutional restrictions, even if these ideas are unpopular. > The American Heritage=AE New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy, Third > Edition > Copyright =A9 2005 by Houghton Mifflin Company. > Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved. > > Martin Martin, In the county that I lived, the members of the school board were elected by the people that lived in that county. The teachers did not have control over the schools. The people in that county indirectly controlled the schools in that county by their votes. It appears to me that evolutionists want to control the schools. I continue to believe the people that live in a county or city should have a say (eg votes) in how the schools are run. Do you agree or disagree? Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <vfk383lau8cr3oq9f2kglqucrlkn8mgn5s@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 17:49:32 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com > (Jason) in > <Jason-2606071749330001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: > > [snip] > > >The poll indicated that over 60% of the people that live in Ohio wanted > >both ID and evolution be taught in the public schools. > > What if 60% wanted separate schools for blacks and whites? It would be illegal for a school board to do that. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182915727.010650.157910@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin <phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: > On Jun 27, 4:22 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <1182888250.489184.198...@n60g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > On 26 Jun., 03:04, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > In article <K3Zfi.7097$n9.2...@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > > > > > <mmman...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote in message > > > > >news:Jason-2506071704090001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > > > > > In article <1182813173.218982.308...@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, > > Martin > > > > > > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > >> On Jun 26, 3:17 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > >> > In article <1182773965.426707.320...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > >> > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > > > >> > > On 25 Jun., 03:18, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > >> > > > In article > > > > <DipthotDipthot-A725FE.16174624062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > > > > > >> > > > > In article > > > > > >> > > > > <Jason-2306071116110...@66-52-22-111.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > > > > > >> > > > > J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I want to make it legal for teachers > > > > > >> > > > > > to teach ID > > > > > > > >> > > > > But it is legal to do that... > > > > > > > >> > > > > ... in a comparative religions, class, for example. > > > > > > > >> > > > > So what's your problem? > > > > > > > >> > > > I was referring to high school science and biology classes. Of > > > > > >> > > > course, > > > > > >> > > > evolution should also be taught in those same classes. > > > > > > > >> > > Why should a person with no understanding of science > > (self-admitted) > > > > > >> > > decide what should be taught in a science class? Why should > > the US > > > > > >> > > give up religious freedom? > > > > > > > >> > I posted a poll yesterday which indicated that most of the > > people that > > > > > >> > live in Ohio want ID and Evolution to be taught in the public > > schools. > > > > > >> > I > > > > > >> > believe the people in Ohio should decide what subjects should > > be taught > > > > > >> > in > > > > > >> > the public schools. > > > > > > > >> What if people in Ohio wanted teachers to teach that the Earth was > > > > > >> flat? Do you think teachers should go along with it? I'd quit > > > > > >> outright. Their loss. > > > > > > > >> Martin > > > > > > > > The teachers that don't want to teach the established curriculum in a > > > > > > state school should quit. > > > > > > > You side-stepped the issue Jason, do we let the public dictate what > > science > > > > > is correct?? Take you Jason, you are what is known as a scientific > > > > > illiterate. Do we let you and people like you, chose the science > > curriculum? > > > > > > No-- > > > > > In that case what you say below must be wrong. > > > > > >but the people that live in Ohio should have a voice in deciding > > > > school curriculum. In this case over 60% of those people want both ID and > > > > evolution to be taught.- > > > > > And you just agreed that people ignorant of science should not > > > determine the science curriculum. > > > > I doubt that most judges are experts related to science. I believe that > > elected representatives should determine education policy--not unelected > > evolutionists. Its my opinion that evoltionists do not want ID to be > > taught since they are concerned the children would realize that ID makes > > more sense than evolution. > > That's a lie (as usual), Jason. ID is myth. It makes no sense at all > and does not belong in a science class. If I were a high school > principle in America and I caught a "teacher" promoting ID in class > then I would fire that person on the spot for violating the > constitutional separation of church and state. > > Martin You would have a right to do that since it's now illegal to teach ID in any state. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182912658.981044.211660@g37g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > On Jun 27, 2:10 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <1182873615.385634.169...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > On 26 Jun., 02:04, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > In article <1182813173.218982.308...@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin > > > > > > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > What if people in Ohio wanted teachers to teach that the Earth was > > > > > flat? Do you think teachers should go along with it? I'd quit > > > > > outright. Their loss. > > > > > > The teachers that don't want to teach the established curriculum in a > > > > state school should quit. > > > > > I didn't think you would answer the question. Apparently you are > > > afraid of it just like all the others you ignore. > > > > I did provide an answer--perhaps you were not satisfied with my > > answer--but I did provide an answer. > > I agree. You said that if the established curriculum stated that the > Earth were flat then you, as a teacher, would feel honour bound to > teach that. This is precisely why you should not presume to "teach", > especially to young kids. > > Martin If I was employed as a teacher, I would follow the established curriculum. I would quit my job if the established curriculum required me to teach that the earth was flat. Jason Quote
Guest Matt Silberstein Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 21:12:36 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com (Jason) in <Jason-2606072112370001@66-52-22-64.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: >In article <vfk383lau8cr3oq9f2kglqucrlkn8mgn5s@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein ><RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 17:49:32 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) in >> <Jason-2606071749330001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: >> >> [snip] >> >> >The poll indicated that over 60% of the people that live in Ohio wanted >> >both ID and evolution be taught in the public schools. >> >> What if 60% wanted separate schools for blacks and whites? > >It would be illegal for a school board to do that. > And it was illegal for the school board to put ID into the curriculum. I suggest you go and look up the history of complaint about legislation from the bench. They started in the '50s pretty much with Brown v Topeka Board of Education. When people complained about the Court making law what they specifically meant was when the Court ruled that separate but "equal" schools were illegal. -- Matt Silberstein Do something today about the Darfur Genocide http://www.beawitness.org http://www.darfurgenocide.org http://www.savedarfur.org "Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop" Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182914771.873163.36550@o11g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, Martin <phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: > On Jun 27, 2:54 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > Why is there a symbol of a crescent moon on top of every Muslim mosque in > > the world? > > Why does a halo appear on the head of every saint in pictures? Why > does sun symbolism continue to the present day on robes, banners, > icons, behind the cross in a ray of light, flames coming from the > heart of Jesus, etc.? Who do priests bow and kiss a monstrance which > is a gold statue of the sun on a pedestal during processions? Why do > Christians go to church on Sunday when the old testament claimed that > Jesus would rise after three days, ie three days after Friday and > therefore on Monday? > > Answer the damn questions, Jason. > > Martin I am not a Catholic so as a result have never done any research regarding Catholics. I don't why artists painted halos on the heads of saints. Perhaps it was part of the culture or a rule established by a Pope. You may want to visit the art department and ask that question to the professor that teaches courses related to the history of art. I suggest that you visit Wikipedia and type "Easter Sunday". It clearly states that Christ rose from the dead on Sunday. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <5ak383h71evkj2dr1l235m8fbdkbdsksad@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 19:02:11 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com > (Jason) in > <Jason-2606071902110001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: > > [snip] > > >I already know the basics of creation science and ID. > > How do they differ? The only major difference is related to the age of the earth. There may be other differences mentioned at the Discovery Institute website. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182912481.204273.80920@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > On Jun 27, 2:08 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <jp3283pji9203fg6293kfgmbpvrq443...@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein > > <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nos...@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > > > On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:04:24 -0700, in alt.atheism , J...@nospam.com > > > (Jason) in > > > <Jason-2506071804250...@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: > > > > > [snip] > > > > > >No--but the people that live in Ohio should have a voice in deciding > > > >school curriculum. > > > > > And they do, in every state even. > > > > > >In this case over 60% of those people want both ID and > > > >evolution to be taught. > > > > > I'll bite: what would the ID curriculum consist of? I guess that you > > > have not actually followed the Ohio situation. The state did decide to > > > teach ID and then ran into a serious problem: there is nothing to > > > teach. Nothing . The Discovery Institute, the major promoters of ID, > > > have said that they never meant for anyone to actually teach ID (even > > > though they called for teaching ID for years), they want schools to > > > "teach the controversy". It is an amusing idea: they have no content > > > to present, but they want the schools to teach a controversy over that > > > (non-existent) content. > > > > > So, please, tell me what would actually get taught in an Intelligent > > > Design course. I will help you get started: tell us what "Intelligent" > > > means, tell us what "Design" means, tell us how to detect intelligence > > > and design, tell us who the designers were, tell us when the designers > > > acted, tell us what the designers did, tell us what tools the > > > designers used, tell us something about the designers goals. That is, > > > answer any of those questions or, at the very least, give us a clue > > > on how someone would go about learning the answers to those questions. > > > I am sorry, Jason, but there is no ID to teach. > > > > The teachers would use a textbook entitled, "Of Pandas and People" which > > has no Biblical content. > > And no science content. > > If I were a high school principal, I would not hire anyone who thought > an "intelligent designer" created mankind and I would fire anybody who > would bring such nonsense into a science classroom. I'd replace that > person with a qualified teacher immediately. Nobody should call > themselves a "teacher" and lie to young kids. It's disgraceful! > > Martin I don't know whether or not such a teacher could file a religious discrimination lawsuit. Teachers may not be allowed to teach ID but they are allowed to be Christians. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <8di383tk4k8aadt0l1ac85ua22n1mmct4f@4ax.com>, Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > In alt.atheism On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 17:02:36 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > (Jason) let us all know that: > > >In article <trWdnVoGW5eUORzbnZ2dnUVZ_tDinZ2d@comcast.com>, John Popelish > ><jpopelish@rica.net> wrote: > > > >> Jason wrote: > >> > >> > It seems to me that the child would be more comforted knowing that the > >> > child's grandmother was in heaven than being told that her grandmother was > >> > lying in a casket buried in the dirt. > >> > >> It also seems that the child would be even more comforted > >> with a dose of morphine. Unfortunately, if you raise > >> children on doses of either lies or opiates, they grow up to > >> be adults with poorly developed minds. > > > >You may have to give the child a dose of morphine after telling the child > >that her grandmother was not in heaven but instead was still in the casket > >that was buried in the dirt. > > It's better to have the truth than a comfortable lie, don't > you agree? Comfortable lies come back to bite you later in life. > > > Don > --- > aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde > Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. > > "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" > Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" Christians do not consider it a lie. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182911634.201159.300140@d30g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, Martin Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > On Jun 27, 1:43 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <EU7gi.7357$n9.2...@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > <mmman...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote in message > > >news:Jason-2506072227160001@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > > > In article > > > > <DipthotDipthot-1DEF3B.19130325062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > > > > > >> In article > > > >> <Jason-2506071217400...@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > > > >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > >> > I posted a poll yesterday which indicated that most of the people that > > > >> > live in Ohio want ID and Evolution to be taught in the public schools > > > > > >> Scientific truth is not a popularity contest. > > > > > >> The masses, on average, are not too bright. Do you want that kind of > > > >> mediocre thinking foisted on our young? > > > > > >> Of course you do. And that's called thought control. > > > > > > I would much prefer the citizens of Ohio electing politicians that will do > > > > what the citizens of Ohio want them to do related to education policy than > > > > to have a group of unelected evolutionists deciding education policy. > > > > jason > > > > > Still prefer to remain scientifically illiterate, I see. > > > > If we trust them to elect members of Congress and serve on juries--we > > should trust them to elect the members of school boards and the state > > secratary of education. None of the these things matter--since the > > evolutionists will take the states to court if those elected > > representatives attempted to authorize the teaching of ID. In other words, > > unelected evolutionists are deciding school curriculum instead the > > politicians that represent the interests of the people that elected them. > > Having scientists decide what should be taught in science class is > entirely appropriate, Jason. I've never been in a situation where I > couldn't teach whatever I wanted in a science class, not even in > Catholic Philippines. > > Martin Martin, That's easy for you but imagine what it must be like for Science professor that is an advocate of Creation Science. Such a professor is NOT allowed to teach whatever he wanted in a science class. Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182911724.230962.192450@g37g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > On Jun 27, 1:47 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <5eclv9F38b9m...@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" > > <witchy...@broomstick.com> wrote: > > > "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote in message > > >news:Jason-2506072238410001@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > > > In article <1182828376.590242.59...@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin > > > > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > >> On Jun 26, 9:12 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > >> > In article <yAZfi.7126$n9.6...@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > > >> > <mmman...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > >> > > "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote in message > > > >> > >news:Jason-2406071818230001@66-52-22-6.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > > >> > > > In article > > > >> > > > <DipthotDipthot-A725FE.16174624062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > > > >> > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > > > > > >> > > >> In article > > > >> > > >> <Jason-2306071116110...@66-52-22-111.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > > > >> > > >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > >> > > >> > I want to make it legal for teachers > > > >> > > >> > to teach ID > > > > > >> > > >> But it is legal to do that... > > > > > >> > > >> ... in a comparative religions, class, for example. > > > > > >> > > >> So what's your problem? > > > > > >> > > > I was referring to high school science and biology classes. Of > > > >> > > > course, > > > >> > > > evolution should also be taught in those same classes. > > > > > >> > > Tell me Jason, just how would you propose teaching ID as science? > > > > Please be > > > >> > > specific in your reply. > > > > > >> > Teachers and students would use the textbook "Of Pandas and People" > > > >> > which > > > >> > has no Biblical content. > > > > > >> It also has no scientific content. And you can't argue that it does > > > >> because you've never seen it. > > > > > That's true--just a book review. > > > > > How can you advocate something you haven't even bothered to read? > > > > Since I know the basics of creation... > > So you, Jason, consider yourself qualified to teach a science class? > That's exactly the kind of travesty we want to avoid. > > Martin Martin, No--I don't have a degree in science. A graduate of the ICR college could teach a science class. Many of their students are high school biology and chemistry teachers. The ICR college only offers one degree--Master's Degree. I once saw the required classes--most were science classes. They offer summer classes so the high school science teachers can keep their jobs. Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182911875.817851.235980@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, "Bob T." <bob@synapse-cs.com> wrote: > On Jun 26, 7:06 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <5uf383532574a8lci3bngd22thrsgvk...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > > On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 18:02:02 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > > > J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > > > <Jason-2606071802020...@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > > > >In article <d6d383tpv8ln55bk4g3lp588704ta04...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > > > ><l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > > > > >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 21:50:05 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > > > >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > > > >> <Jason-2506072150060...@66-52-22-54.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > > > >> >In article <m6r083hfa4oebpf4a56skimde32a9it...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > > > >> ><l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > > > > >> >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:27:34 -0700, in alt.atheism > > > >> >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > > > >> >> <Jason-2506071827340...@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > > > >> >> >In article <mip083tkkqhcp757tku7i60mga5nmhp...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > > > >> >> ><l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > > > > >> >> >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:49:48 -0700, in alt.atheism > > > >> >> >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > > > >> >> >> <Jason-2506071749490...@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > > > >> >> >> >In article <r0n083d7l69bkbc3m7p60j3l60hlme9...@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > > > >> >> >> ><l...@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > > > > > >> >> >> >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:46:36 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > > > >> >> >> >> J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > > > >> >> >> >> <Jason-2506071046360...@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > > > >> >> >> >> >In article <stqv7396nu5e3jsncsntpea7hi1dvcr...@4ax.com>, > > John Baker > > > >> >> >> >> ><n...@bizniz.net> wrote: > > > > > >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 05:28:42 -0700, gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > > > >> >> >> >> >> >On 25 Jun., 03:35, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > >> >> >> >> ... > > > >> >> >> >> >> >> For those people that believe Yahweh and Allah are the same > > > >> >> >God--please > > > >> >> >> >> >> >> explain why there is a symbol of a crescent moon on top of > > > >> >> >every Mormon > > > >> >> >> >> >> >> Mosque in the world? > > > > > >> >> >> >> >> Sure, Jason. Just as soon as you tell me where I > > might find a > > > >> >> >> >> >> Mormon mosque. <G> > > > > > >> >> >> >> >Sorry--I meant Muslim Mosque. > > > > > >> >> >> >> Which Mosque would you be willing to go into and tell the > > worshippers > > > >> >> >> >> that they do not worship the God of Abraham? What evidence can you > > > >> >> >> >> provide them that you are right and that Mohammed lied to them? > > > > > >> >> >> >Hubal and Allah the Moon God? > > > > > >> >> >> >Islam: Truth or Myth? start page > > > > > >> >> >> >Introduction to basic facts of history: > > > > > >> >> >> > 1. Moon worship has been practiced in Arabia since 2000 BC. The > > > >> >> >> >crescent moon is the most common symbol of this pagan moon > > > >worship as far > > > >> >> >> >back as 2000 BC. > > > >> >> >> > 2. In Mecca, there was a god named Hubal who was Lord of > > the Kabah. > > > >> >> >> > 3. This Hubal was a moon god. > > > >> >> >> > 4. One Muslim apologist confessed that the idol of moon god > > > >Hubal was > > > >> >> >> >placed upon the roof of the Kaba about 400 years before Muhammad. > > > >This may > > > >> >> >> >in fact be the origin of why the crescent moon is on top of every > > > >minaret > > > >> >> >> >at the Kaba today and the central symbol of Islam atop of > > every mosque > > > >> >> >> >throughout the world: > > > > > >> >> >> > About four hundred years before the birth of > > Muhammad one Amr > > > >> >> >> >bin Lahyo ... a descendant of Qahtan and king of Hijaz, had > > put an idol > > > >> >> >> >called Hubal on the roof of the Kaba. This was one of the chief > > > >deities of > > > >> >> >> >the Quraish before Islam. (Muhammad The Holy Prophet, Hafiz > > > >Ghulam Sarwar > > > >> >> >> >(Pakistan), p 18-19, Muslim) > > > > > >> >> >> > 5. The moon god was also referred to as "al-ilah". This is not > > > >a proper > > > >> >> >> >name of a single specific god, but a generic reference meaning > > > >"the god". > > > >> >> >> >Each local pagan Arab tribe would refer to their own local > > tribal pagan > > > >> >> >> >god as "al-ilah". > > > >> >> >> > 6. "al-ilah" was later shortened to Allah before Muhammad began > > > >> >> >> >promoting his new religion in 610 AD. > > > >> >> >> > 7. There is evidence that Hubal was referred to as "Allah". > > > >> >> >> > 8. When Muhammad came along, he dropped all references to > > the name > > > >> >> >> >"Hubal" but retained the generic "Allah". > > > >> >> >> > 9. Muhammad retained almost all the pagan rituals of the Arabs > > > >at the > > > >> >> >> >Kaba and redefined them in monotheistic terms. > > > >> >> >> > 10. Regardless of the specifics of the facts, it is clear that > > > >Islam is > > > >> >> >> >derived from paganism that once worshiped a moon-god. > > > >> >> >> > 11. Although Islam is today a monotheist religion, its roots > > are in > > > >> >> >paganism. > > > > > >> >> >> > Hubal the moon god of the Kabah > > > > > >> >> >> > Allah the moon god of the Kabah > > > > > >> >> >> >Remnants of pagan Moon god worship in the Koran > > > > > >> >> >> >Pre-Islamic Origin of the word Allah > > > > > >> >> >> >Photogallery of the ancient history of Moon god worship > > > > > >> >> >> >Modern usage of moon god symbols in Islam today. > > > > > >> >> >> That does not show that they worship a moon god. > > > > > >> >> >> You wouldn't persuade anyone that you know what you are talking > > about. > > > > > >> >> >Why is there the symbol of a crescent moon on top of every mosque? > > > > > >> >> Why not? What does that have to do with the fact that they worship the > > > >> >> God of Abraham? > > > > > >> >> Christians use a cross. Does that mean that God is dead? > > > > > >> >Here is the answer to the question: > > > > > >> >> > 1. Moon worship has been practiced in Arabia since 2000 BC. The > > > >> >>> >crescent moon is the most common symbol of this pagan moon > > worship as far > > > >> >>> >back as 2000 BC. > > > >> >>> > 2. In Mecca, there was a god named Hubal who was Lord of the Kabah. > > > >> >>> > 3. This Hubal was a moon god. > > > >> >>> > 4. One Muslim apologist confessed that the idol of moon god > > Hubal was > > > >> >>> >placed upon the roof of the Kaba about 400 years before Muhammad. > > > >This may > > > >> >>> >in fact be the origin of why the crescent moon is on top of > > every minaret > > > >> >>> >at the Kaba today and the central symbol of Islam atop of every mosque > > > >> >>> >throughout the world: > > > > > >> No, that is not an answer to my question. Mohammed was a religious > > > >> reformer and part of his reform was to state that there was only one > > > >> god, the God of Abraham. You are lying about Islam. > > > > > >> I notice that you refused to respond to the fact that Easter was > > > >> borrowed from pagan worship. > > > > > >I stated in a post that I don't know about that issue. > > > > > Yet you have the arrogance, the gall to assert with the same ignorance > > > that Moslems worship a moon god. You really are disgusting. If I were > > > your pastor, I would be writing a sermon about hubris and > > > self-righteousness to deliver to you, and, since you refuse to ever > > > acknowledge any of your sins, I would be calling you directly, in > > > church, on such lies and how you are harming the Church with your > > > nonsense. > > > > > I've asked you dozens of times where God told you to lie, but we all > > > know that God didn't tell you to lie. You took it upon yourself to lie > > > to defend the doctrines that you want people to believe. You kept > > > telling those lies even after everyone pointed out that they were lies > > > and that you had no excuse to tell them. You are a pitiful excuse for a > > > man, a pitiful mockery of a Christian. > > > > Google "moon god". I first read about the moon god in a book that was > > written by a famous Christian preacher named John Hagee. He wrote about > > the moon god in this book: "Jerusalem Countdown". He has a television show > > that is broadcast every Sunday. He is a pastor of a church that has about > > 5000 members. > > Why should anybody take the word of a Christian evangelist about the > origins of Islam? Obviously he has an agenda. If you want to know > about Islam, study history - do not listen to preachers. Likewise, if > you want to know about Christianity, don't listen to Muslim preachers > - they have an agenda, too. > > - Bob T. > > > jason- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text - Yes--most everyone has an agenda. Jason Quote
Guest gudloos@yahoo.com Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On 26 Jun., 21:00, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <1182873774.679677.7...@u2g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > On 26 Jun., 02:12, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > In article <1182813471.492210.280...@n60g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > > On 25 Jun., 20:04, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > In article <1182770555.111873.24...@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Mar= > > tin > > > > > > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > On Jun 25, 2:31 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > In article <1182751329.065068.288...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups..com= > > >, "Bob > > > > > > > T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Jun 24, 9:31 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > > > In article > > > > <1182738013.400195.243...@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, "Bob > > > > > > > > > > T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > On Jun 24, 6:35 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Here is some information about the Christians in Iran. > > > > > > > > > > > <snip article> > > > > > > > > > > > Iran is an excellent example of what happens when religious > > > nutcases > > > > > > > > > > are allowed to rule a country. And you, Jason, clearly wis= > > h that > > > > > > > > > > America was more like Iran. > > > > > > > > > > > - Bob T. > > > > > > > > > > Yes, it would be wonderful if everyone in the world were Chri= > > stians. > > > > > > > > > Yes, then the world would be just like Iran - run by superstiti= > > ous > > > > > > > > fools who allow no dissent. How would you like to live under M= > > uslim > > > > > > > > religious law, Jason? Well, that's what the world you envision= > > would > > > > > > > > be like - we would all have to worry about the Inquisition knoc= > > king on > > > > > > > > our door at any moment to check on our sex lives. > > > > > > > > > I much prefer to live in America, which is still a land of free= > > dom, > > > > > > > > including freedom from religion. > > > > > > > > > - Bob T. > > > > > > > > I also like living in America. The end goal of the Muslims are to= > > take > > > > > > > over the world--one country at a time. > > > > > > > Oddly enough I don't see that many Muslim missionaries today. How > > > > > > many countries have muslims invaded over the past ten years? None. > > > > > > How many muslim countries has the US invaded over the past ten year= > > s? > > > > > > Two. > > > > > > > If at all possible, try to make statements actually supported by > > > > > > facts, Jason. > > > > > > > Martin > > > > > > Good point--our troops will eventually leave Iraq and Afghanistan.. If= > > the > > > > > leaders of either of those countries asked Bush to remove our troops = > > from > > > > > their countries--Bush would do it. > > > > > > The Muslims from the middle east are in the process of taking over the > > > > > Sudan. > > > > > In the real world Moslems have controlled the Sudan for centuries. > > > > > At present, they are committing genocide against the people in > > > > > Darfur. > > > > > People supposedly supported by the government of the Sudan are doing > > > > that not Moslems as a group, and Darfur is part of the Sudan. > > > > > >Various experts are concerned that once they have total control > > > > > over the Sudan--they will use the Sudan as a staging area to take ove= > > r the > > > > > surrounding African countries. > > > > > Name one of these experts. The Sudan is barely able to take over the > > > > Sudan. Many of the surrounding countries have been Moslem for a > > > > thousand years. Your experts seem to have missed a lot. > > > > > >You may want to google "genocide in Darfur" > > > > > if you don't believe me. > > > > > Nobody believes you. I doubt that you believe you. > > > > The muslims from the middle east want to have total contrl of the Sudan. > > > Upon request, I'll post an article about it.- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselste= > > gn - > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > The Moslems of the Middle East are not involved in the Sudan. You are > > making =EDt up as you go along. > > Are there any Arab Muslims in Darfur?- Skjul tekst i anf Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182913159.985342.95360@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > On Jun 27, 2:34 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <1182871741.750936.67...@m36g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > On 26 Jun., 01:05, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > In article <1182811351.557959.227...@u2g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > > > On 25 Jun., 06:51, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > In article <8oKdnUvAwJeWqeLbnZ2dnUVZ_qjin...@sti.net>, "David V." > > > > > > > > <s...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > Jason wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I disagree. Evolution is a theory. > > > > > > > > > As I explained to you before, you do not know the definition of > > > > > > > the word 'theory,' and you got it wrong even after seeing it in a > > > > > > > dictionary. > > > > > > > > > > I looked up the word Evolution in my Webster's Dictionary..... > > > > > > > > > And you still don't get it. > > > > > > > > > Is this feigned ignorance on purpose? > > > > > > > > These two words were found on page 6 of the November 2004 issue of > > > > > > National Geographic: > > > > > > > > EVOLUTIONARY THEORY... > > > > > > > Yes, the theories that explain the fact of evolution, just like the > > > > > theory of gravity explains the fact of gravity. You do understand > > > > > that, don't you? Too bad you are too dishonest and cowardly to stop > > > > > lying about it. > > > > > > I re-read the article related to evolution that was published in the > > > > Nov/2004 issue of National Geographic. The author of the article made it > > > > clear that evolution was a theory. > > > > > > He made this statement on page 8: > > > > > > "Evolution is both a beautiful concept and an important one, more crucial > > > > nowadays to human welfare, to medical science, and to our understanding of > > > > the world than ever before. It's also deeply persuasive--a theory you can > > > > take to the bank...." > > > > > > Various members of this newsgroup appear to believe that evolution is a > > > > fact but the author of the article that was printed in National Geographic > > > > disagrees with you. > > > > Jason- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > > > No he doesn't, but no amount of explanation will get you to see it. > > > It is a theory; the theory that explains the fact. Equivocation is a > > > favorite, dishonest tactic used by trolls like you. > > > > We are in agreement--evolution is a theory. Yes, the theory explains the > > facts that are backed up with evidence. > > Remember this the next time you claim there is no evidence supporting > evolution. > > Martin I have stated in other posts that I support Natural Selection. Quote
Guest gudloos@yahoo.com Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On 26 Jun., 21:01, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <1182873224.668805.269...@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > On 26 Jun., 01:46, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > In article <1182812406.148531.4...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > > On 25 Jun., 08:31, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > In article <1182751329.065068.288...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, "= > > Bob > > > > > > T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote: > > > > > > On Jun 24, 9:31 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > In article <1182738013.400195.243...@i38g2000prf.googlegroups..com= > > >, "=3D > > > > Bob > > > > > > > > T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Jun 24, 6:35 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Here is some information about the Christians in Iran. > > > > > > > > > <snip article> > > > > > > > > > Iran is an excellent example of what happens when religious nut= > > cases > > > > > > > > are allowed to rule a country. And you, Jason, clearly wish th= > > at > > > > > > > > America was more like Iran. > > > > > > > > > - Bob T. > > > > > > > > Yes, it would be wonderful if everyone in the world were Christia= > > ns. > > > > > > > Yes, then the world would be just like Iran - run by superstitious > > > > > > fools who allow no dissent. How would you like to live under Muslim > > > > > > religious law, Jason? Well, that's what the world you envision wou= > > ld > > > > > > be like - we would all have to worry about the Inquisition knocking= > > on > > > > > > our door at any moment to check on our sex lives. > > > > > > > I much prefer to live in America, which is still a land of freedom, > > > > > > including freedom from religion. > > > > > > > - Bob T. > > > > > > I also like living in America. The end goal of the Muslims are to take > > > > > over the world--one country at a time. > > > > > It is also the goal of Christians. You said so. > > > > There is a BIG difference. If people refuse to become Muslims, the Muslims > > > chop off thier heads. If people refuse to become Christians, we don't harm > > > them in any way. Has any Christian ever harmed you or threatened you? > > > > > They are presently committing > > > > > genocide on the people that live in Darfur. > > > > > All the Moslems are doing that? Even the ones that are at war with > > > > each other? Stop being such a fool. > > > > > After they take over control > > > > > of the Sudan, they will use the Sudan as a staging ground to take over > > > > > surrounding countries. > > > > > The Sudan is a Muslem country and has been for many centuries. > > > > The Muslims from Middle east are taking over the Sudan. They are either > > > killing the Black Muslims or forcing them to leave the country. > > > The ones doing the killing are nomadic tribesmen in the Sudan. The > > Blacks are animists and Christians. You are once again exposed as an > > ignorant liar. > > > > Google--Genocide in Darfur > > > Try it yourself idiot. > > > > > One expert believes they will eventually take over > > > > > Spain without firing a shot. Mullahs are encouraging young followers = > > to > > > > > move to Spain. After 55% of the population of Spain are Muslims, they= > > will > > > > > vote only for Muslims. Those politicians will vote to establish the s= > > ame > > > > > sorts of laws they now have in Moslem countries. > > > > > jason- Skjul tekst i anf=3DF8rselstegn - > > > > > Golly!- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=F8rselstegn -- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > Stop making up stuff. > > Are there any Arab Muslims in Darfur?- Skjul tekst i anf Quote
Guest gudloos@yahoo.com Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On 26 Jun., 22:16, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <1182887737.836228.164...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > On 26 Jun., 02:57, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > In article <1182816528.662652.63...@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, Martin > > > > snip > > > > Martin, > > > I recall learning that Easter Sunday was derived from the tradition that > > > Jesus rose from the dead on Sunday. Google "Easter Sunday" to find out the > > > reason it is called Easter Sunday and not Easter Monday. > > > Jason- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > And, according to your "logic", Christians must be pagans, since the > > word "Easter" comes from the name of a pagan goddess. > > This is from Wikipedia: > > Easter, the Sunday of the Resurrection, Pascha, or Resurrection Day, is > the most important religious feast of the Christian liturgical year, > observed at some point between late March and late April each year (early > April to early May in Eastern Christianity), following the cycle of the > moon. It celebrates the resurrection of Jesus, which Christians believe > occurred on the third day of his death by crucifixion some time in the > period AD 27 to 33. Easter also refers to the season of the church year, > called Eastertide or the Easter Season. Traditionally the Easter Season > lasted for the forty days from Easter Day until Ascension Day but now > officially lasts for the fifty days until Pentecost. The first week of the > Easter Season is known as Easter Week or the Octave of Easter. > > Today many families celebrate Easter in a completely secular way, as a > non-religious holiday. And, according to your "logic", Christians must be pagans, since the word "Easter" comes from the name of a pagan goddess. Quote
Guest gudloos@yahoo.com Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On 26 Jun., 22:22, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <1182888250.489184.198...@n60g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > On 26 Jun., 03:04, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > In article <K3Zfi.7097$n9.2...@bignews8.bellsouth.net>, "Ralph" > > > > <mmman...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > "Jason" <J...@nospam.com> wrote in message > > > >news:Jason-2506071704090001@66-52-22-98.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > > > > > In article <1182813173.218982.308...@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, > Martin > > > > > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > >> On Jun 26, 3:17 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > >> > In article <1182773965.426707.320...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, > > > > >> > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > > >> > > On 25 Jun., 03:18, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > >> > > > In article > > <DipthotDipthot-A725FE.16174624062...@newsclstr03.news.prodigy.net>, > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > 655321 <DipthotDipt...@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > > > > >> > > > > In article > > > > >> > > > > <Jason-2306071116110...@66-52-22-111.lsan.pw-dia.impulse..net>, > > > > >> > > > > J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > >> > > > > > I want to make it legal for teachers > > > > >> > > > > > to teach ID > > > > > >> > > > > But it is legal to do that... > > > > > >> > > > > ... in a comparative religions, class, for example. > > > > > >> > > > > So what's your problem? > > > > > >> > > > I was referring to high school science and biology classes.. Of > > > > >> > > > course, > > > > >> > > > evolution should also be taught in those same classes. > > > > > >> > > Why should a person with no understanding of science > (self-admitted) > > > > >> > > decide what should be taught in a science class? Why should > the US > > > > >> > > give up religious freedom? > > > > > >> > I posted a poll yesterday which indicated that most of the > people that > > > > >> > live in Ohio want ID and Evolution to be taught in the public > schools. > > > > >> > I > > > > >> > believe the people in Ohio should decide what subjects should > be taught > > > > >> > in > > > > >> > the public schools. > > > > > >> What if people in Ohio wanted teachers to teach that the Earth was > > > > >> flat? Do you think teachers should go along with it? I'd quit > > > > >> outright. Their loss. > > > > > >> Martin > > > > > > The teachers that don't want to teach the established curriculum in a > > > > > state school should quit. > > > > > You side-stepped the issue Jason, do we let the public dictate what > science > > > > is correct?? Take you Jason, you are what is known as a scientific > > > > illiterate. Do we let you and people like you, chose the science > curriculum? > > > > No-- > > > In that case what you say below must be wrong. > > > >but the people that live in Ohio should have a voice in deciding > > > school curriculum. In this case over 60% of those people want both ID and > > > evolution to be taught.- > > > And you just agreed that people ignorant of science should not > > determine the science curriculum. > > I doubt that most judges are experts related to science. I believe that > elected representatives should determine education policy--not unelected > evolutionists. Its my opinion that evoltionists do not want ID to be > taught since they are concerned the children would realize that ID makes > more sense than evolution.- Skjul tekst i anf Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1182920084.264354.52290@k29g2000hsd.googlegroups.com>, gudloos@yahoo.com wrote: > On 26 Jun., 21:00, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <1182873774.679677.7...@u2g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > On 26 Jun., 02:12, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > In article <1182813471.492210.280...@n60g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > > > > On 25 Jun., 20:04, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > In article <1182770555.111873.24...@j4g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,= > Mar=3D > > > tin > > > > > > > > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Jun 25, 2:31 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > > In article <1182751329.065068.288...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups= > .com=3D > > > >, "Bob > > > > > > > > T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Jun 24, 9:31 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > > > > In article > > > > > > <1182738013.400195.243...@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, "Bob > > > > > > > > > > > > T." <b...@synapse-cs.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > On Jun 24, 6:35 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Here is some information about the Christians in Iran. > > > > > > > > > > > > > <snip article> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Iran is an excellent example of what happens when relig= > ious > > > > nutcases > > > > > > > > > > > are allowed to rule a country. And you, Jason, clearly= > wis=3D > > > h that > > > > > > > > > > > America was more like Iran. > > > > > > > > > > > > > - Bob T. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, it would be wonderful if everyone in the world were = > Chri=3D > > > stians. > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, then the world would be just like Iran - run by supers= > titi=3D > > > ous > > > > > > > > > fools who allow no dissent. How would you like to live und= > er M=3D > > > uslim > > > > > > > > > religious law, Jason? Well, that's what the world you envi= > sion=3D > > > would > > > > > > > > > be like - we would all have to worry about the Inquisition = > knoc=3D > > > king on > > > > > > > > > our door at any moment to check on our sex lives. > > > > > > > > > > > I much prefer to live in America, which is still a land of = > free=3D > > > dom, > > > > > > > > > including freedom from religion. > > > > > > > > > > > - Bob T. > > > > > > > > > > I also like living in America. The end goal of the Muslims ar= > e to=3D > > > take > > > > > > > > over the world--one country at a time. > > > > > > > > > Oddly enough I don't see that many Muslim missionaries today. = > How > > > > > > > many countries have muslims invaded over the past ten years? N= > one. > > > > > > > How many muslim countries has the US invaded over the past ten = > year=3D > > > s? > > > > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > > If at all possible, try to make statements actually supported by > > > > > > > facts, Jason. > > > > > > > > > Martin > > > > > > > > Good point--our troops will eventually leave Iraq and Afghanistan= > . If=3D > > > the > > > > > > leaders of either of those countries asked Bush to remove our tro= > ops =3D > > > from > > > > > > their countries--Bush would do it. > > > > > > > > The Muslims from the middle east are in the process of taking ove= > r the > > > > > > Sudan. > > > > > > > In the real world Moslems have controlled the Sudan for centuries. > > > > > > > At present, they are committing genocide against the people in > > > > > > Darfur. > > > > > > > People supposedly supported by the government of the Sudan are doing > > > > > that not Moslems as a group, and Darfur is part of the Sudan. > > > > > > > >Various experts are concerned that once they have total control > > > > > > over the Sudan--they will use the Sudan as a staging area to take= > ove=3D > > > r the > > > > > > surrounding African countries. > > > > > > > Name one of these experts. The Sudan is barely able to take over t= > he > > > > > Sudan. Many of the surrounding countries have been Moslem for a > > > > > thousand years. Your experts seem to have missed a lot. > > > > > > > >You may want to google "genocide in Darfur" > > > > > > if you don't believe me. > > > > > > > Nobody believes you. I doubt that you believe you. > > > > > > The muslims from the middle east want to have total contrl of the Sud= > an. > > > > Upon request, I'll post an article about it.- Skjul tekst i anf=3DF8r= > selste=3D > > > gn - > > > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=3DF8rselstegn - > > > > > The Moslems of the Middle East are not involved in the Sudan. You are > > > making =3DEDt up as you go along. > > > > Are there any Arab Muslims in Darfur?- Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > The relevant question is why do you argue for a position that has > already been demonstrated to be wrong? The article you yourself > posted contradicts your description of the situation in Darfur. In > any event I would be very surprised if there were no Arabs in Darfur, > or Frenchmen or Americans etc., but you are still completely wrong; > and you have provided documentation that shows you are wrong. Yes, I found out from my web search that the Christians live in the southern part of the Sudan. I was under the impression there were some Christians living in Darfur but found out I was wrong. There are Arabs in Darfur that are funded by Arabs from the Middle East. The Arabs in the Middle East probably have a long range plan that involves taking over all oil wells in the Sudan. I only posted one of the reports that I read. Jason Quote
Guest gudloos@yahoo.com Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On 26 Jun., 22:28, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <1182888536.294395.68...@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: snip > > > Why is there the symbol of a crescent moon on top of every mosque?- Skjul= > > tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > Why do Christians celebrate a holiday named after a pagan goddess? > > You failed to answer the above question. I will try again (not that it will make any difference). Neither Christians or Moslems worship pagan deities. Both Christians and Moslems have both names and symbols derived from such worship. Try and see if you can understand that. > > I don't know if that is true. If it is true, I don't know the reason. I am > not an expert related to Bible history. A Jehovahs Witness told me > something about the origin of Christmas. I don't worship any pagan > goddesses.- Skjul tekst i anf Quote
Guest johac Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <1vj3835t86vajghq9n05jc1n7qdhe7ntud@4ax.com>, Michael Gray <mikegray@newsguy.com> wrote: > On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 15:58:27 -0700, johac > <jhachmann@remove.sbcglobal.net> wrote: > - Refer: <jhachmann-2EB388.15582726062007@news.giganews.com> > >In article > ><Jason-2506071038350001@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > >> In article <5ea5jrF383thsU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" > >> <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: > >> > >> > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote > >> > > >> > snip > >> > > >> > > If they read their Bibles, they will know all about the true God. > >> > > >> > What makes your god the "true" one? > >> > >> Books have been written on that subject. > > > >I read books on Greek mythology. Does that mean that Zeus is the true > >god? > > Of course. > The non-existent Zeus can kick the non-existent YHWH's butt any time! > With one thunderbolt tied behind his back. So could Odin. -- John #1782 "We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides." - Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order. Quote
Guest Jason Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 In article <fqp3839gge41v4q43tmsag4qdme6g95nts@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 21:12:36 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com > (Jason) in > <Jason-2606072112370001@66-52-22-64.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: > > >In article <vfk383lau8cr3oq9f2kglqucrlkn8mgn5s@4ax.com>, Matt Silberstein > ><RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > > > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 17:49:32 -0700, in alt.atheism , Jason@nospam.com > >> (Jason) in > >> <Jason-2606071749330001@66-52-22-20.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net> wrote: > >> > >> [snip] > >> > >> >The poll indicated that over 60% of the people that live in Ohio wanted > >> >both ID and evolution be taught in the public schools. > >> > >> What if 60% wanted separate schools for blacks and whites? > > > >It would be illegal for a school board to do that. > > > And it was illegal for the school board to put ID into the curriculum. > > I suggest you go and look up the history of complaint about > legislation from the bench. They started in the '50s pretty much with > Brown v Topeka Board of Education. When people complained about the > Court making law what they specifically meant was when the Court ruled > that separate but "equal" schools were illegal. Yes, we studied that case while I was in college. I understand your point. The ID people should have done a better job in making sure they had no religion mixed in--they failed. Perhaps they will do a better job the next time. Jason Quote
Guest gudloos@yahoo.com Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On 27 Jun., 01:26, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <1182892095.064389.276...@u2g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > On 26 Jun., 20:46, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > In article <1182873694.135711.325...@c77g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, > > > > gudl...@yahoo.com wrote: > > >snip > > > > > > I did not state that Christian Arabs are not really Christians. > Christian > > > > > Arabs are really Christians even if they call God by the name of > Allah.- = > > > > Skjul tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > > > > - Vis tekst i anf=F8rselstegn - > > > > > Good, you admit your entire argument has been invalid. > > > > Not true--The Christians Arabs will eventually understand (as a result of > > > reading their Bibles) that God is vastly different than the moon > > > god-- > > > Eventually understand? They do not believe in any moon god now. > > The Quran indicates that the moon god is unknowable. First of all that is irrelevant, since we are talking about Christian Arabs. Secondly it is not true; the Quran forbids worship of the Moon god. >The moon God is so > exalted that no man can ever personally know Allah. In his book that is > entitled, "Jesus and Muhammad, Mark Gabriel, a former devout Muslim, says: > "If you ask a Muslim, Do you how much Allah loves your? he will respond, > 'I don't know how much he loves me. Only Allah knows.' And he is not talking about the Moon god. > > Mark tells the story about a famous bumper sticker that is placed on the > cars and shops of former Muslims that are now Christians--the bumper > sticker states: > "Allah Mahabe" which means "God is Love". Those words are NEVER put > together in the Quran. He never understood the meaning of the bumper > sticker until after he became a Christian. > > In other words, Muslims that become Christians eventually understand as a > result of reading the Holy Bible that the true God is vastly different > than the God mentioned in the Quran. We were talking about Christian Arabs not Moslems who become Christians, and the god in the Quran is not the Moon god. > > > > > > > >which is a false God. If those Arabs call God "Allah" instead of > > > Jehovah or Yahweh--that is not a problem.- > > > And that would be because the god they believe in is the same as > > Allah, Jehovah, God, Gud, etc. Once again, thank you for admitting > > your entire argument is invalid, that it is not the name used but what > > is believed about the deity that matters. The fact that the word > > Easter is derived from pagan religions also does not mean Christians > > believers in fertility goddesses. Of course all of this also points > > out to all the copying and adapting that has occurred between > > religions.- You have totally ignored the above. Quote
Guest Martin Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Jun 27, 7:55 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > >People like yourself seem to have no regard for the wishes of the people > > >that live in Ohio and various other states. Over 60 percent of the > > >citizens of Ohio wanted Evolution and ID to be taught. > > Do they have any idea what to teach about ID? Do you? Don't give me a > > hand wave about the Discovery Institute, tell me what there is to > > teach about ID. > > > Oh, wait, that's right, you agree with the judge that ID is > > creationism and you want the government to promote your religion. > > I would prefer that laws be made by legislators that are elected by people > than be made as a result of "legislation my mandate (judicial fiat). > > In the Dover case, that state law was made by judicial fiat instead of by > the legislators that were elected by the citizens of Ohio. Judicial fiat is how George Bush became president in 2000. I imagine you didn't have a problem with that at the time. > Yes, the proper term was probably something like "judicial ruling" or > "court decision". However, in my opinion it was a law made by judicial > fiat. So you openly admit to lying. That doesn't make you honest, Jason. Martin Quote
Guest Martin Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 On Jun 27, 8:02 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > In article <trWdnVoGW5eUORzbnZ2dnUVZ_tDin...@comcast.com>, John Popelish > > <jpopel...@rica.net> wrote: > > Jason wrote: > > > > It seems to me that the child would be more comforted knowing that the > > > child's grandmother was in heaven than being told that her grandmother was > > > lying in a casket buried in the dirt. > > > It also seems that the child would be even more comforted > > with a dose of morphine. Unfortunately, if you raise > > children on doses of either lies or opiates, they grow up to > > be adults with poorly developed minds. > > You may have to give the child a dose of morphine after telling the child > that her grandmother was not in heaven but instead was still in the casket > that was buried in the dirt. Children can accept the truth. Why can't you? Martin Quote
Guest Christopher Morris Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 "johac" <jhachmann@remove.sbcglobal.net> wrote in message news:jhachmann-DB11DE.22155226062007@news.giganews.com... > In article <1vj3835t86vajghq9n05jc1n7qdhe7ntud@4ax.com>, > Michael Gray <mikegray@newsguy.com> wrote: > >> On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 15:58:27 -0700, johac >> <jhachmann@remove.sbcglobal.net> wrote: >> - Refer: <jhachmann-2EB388.15582726062007@news.giganews.com> >> >In article >> ><Jason-2506071038350001@66-52-22-83.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, >> > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> > >> >> In article <5ea5jrF383thsU1@mid.individual.net>, "Robibnikoff" >> >> <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote >> >> > >> >> > snip >> >> > >> >> > > If they read their Bibles, they will know all about the true God. >> >> > >> >> > What makes your god the "true" one? >> >> >> >> Books have been written on that subject. >> > >> >I read books on Greek mythology. Does that mean that Zeus is the true >> >god? >> >> Of course. >> The non-existent Zeus can kick the non-existent YHWH's butt any time! >> > > With one thunderbolt tied behind his back. So could Odin. Thor has thunderbolts not Odin, Odin is the God of War. Thor uses his hammer Mojnoir (excuse the spelling) to make lighting and thunder. > John #1782 > > "We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be > white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides." > > - Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order. Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.