Guest Jason Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 In article <dg5e43lqgk5tl2gaeba9vvpjeq4opcap5q@4ax.com>, Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 22:39:14 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > (Jason) let us all know that: > > > >Have you ever considered that you could be wrong? In this case, if you are > >wrong--you could end up in heaven or hell--the choice is up to you. > > Have you ever considered that you could be wring? In this > case, if you're wrong, you could end up in the hell of someone else's > religion. You should now believe in every god JUST IN CASE. > > If you don't, then you're a hypocrite. > > Don > --- > aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde > Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. > > "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" > Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" Hello, When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians or the advocates of creation science. Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 In article <5ao12tF2prnivU1@mid.individual.net>, "Steve O" <spamhere@nowhere.com> wrote: > "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:Jason-1305070128240001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > >> > It's a complex > >> > doctrine. I do believe all people have free will. God and the angels > >> > also > >> > have free will. God has the power to know what I will do but that does > >> > not > >> > mean he will force me to change my behavior. He may take actions to > >> > cause > >> > me to change my behavior. I'll tell you a true story that involved God > >> > taking actions to change a person's behavior. This happened when the > >> > assistant pastor of my church and his wife was traveling to another > >> > state > >> > to visit relatives. The wife developed food poisoning and he had to > >> > pull > >> > over at several gas stations so that she could vomit. They were about > >> > two > >> > hours behind schedule. They drove past several overturned tractor > >> > trailors > >> > and overturned automobiles. They turned on the radio and found out that > >> > a > >> > tornado had crossed the same road they were on about two hours before > >> > they > >> > arrived to that part of the freeway. She stopped having nausea after > >> > they > >> > passed the overturned tractor trailors. You may say the tornado and > >> > food > >> > poisoning was unrelated but that pastor and I believe that God was able > >> > to > >> > see in the future and he took actions so that his servants avoided > >> > being > >> > injured by that tornado. > > > Would you be telling us this story if her vomiting had kept them in the path > of the tornado? Hello, When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians or the advocates of creation science. Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 In article <1179047597.554263.255620@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, Martin Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > On May 13, 4:45 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <1179031647.035924.274...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, George > > > > Chen <georgech...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > On May 13, 11:38 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > It appears to me (based upon newspaper articles and television news shows) > > > > that crime is more of a problem in the 2000's than it was in the 1950's > > > > and 1960's > > > > > and yet less of a problem than it was in the 1970s, 1980s and 1990s, > > > as born out by actual statistics. > > > > I subscribe to the local newspaper. There are lots of reports of crimes. > > When I read the Los Angeles Times--you would be amazed at the crime rate > > in that city. In my home town in Virginia, there was not hardly any crime > > compared to the crimes in this small town in California. They had a jail > > in my home town in Virginia but on most nights--it was empty. We have over > > 30 people in the county jail and they want to build a larger jail since > > they are overcrowded. > > But actual statistics show that crime rates are falling. Don't forget > that many people are given LIFE in prison. The alternative would be > to arrest no more people (and then they wouldn't have to build any > more jails), but that would only be possible when the crime rate drops > to zero. > > Martin Hello, When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians or the advocates of creation science. Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 In article <kaae43h9ibinnsntkcmtbr8aret1jihjuj@4ax.com>, Free Lunch <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > On Sun, 13 May 2007 01:48:00 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in > <Jason-1305070148010001@66-52-22-70.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: > >In article <1179031222.406540.262970@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, Martin > ><phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > >> On May 13, 11:26 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> > In article <1179019540.936296.309...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, Martin > >> > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> > >> <snip> > >> > >> > > It is racist to to equate all illegal immigrants with gang members. > >> > > There have been white gangs, black gangs and even Asian gangs in > >> > > America too. Most people who come to America looking for work are not > >> > > only not looking for trouble but are going to avoid getting into > >> > > trouble for fear of being sent back to Mexico. > >> > > >> > That is a true statement. Most illegal immigrants do not get involved in > >> > criminal behavior. I have worked with some of those wonderful people. I > >> > did not mean to offend you. > >> > >> I appreciate that. Under the circumstances, I think it would be > >> better to snip what you said above. > >> > >> It is my opinion that US immigration policy is racist. Up until very > >> recently, Canadians could pass into the US from Canada without even > >> having to show their passports but Mexicans were held back with fences > >> and were arrested if they passed into the United States. People from > >> Canada and England have been able to work in the United States without > >> becoming American citizens but the United States still has no guest > >> worker program for Mexicans wanting to work in the US. > >> (Such a program does exist in Canada: a smart, qualified Mexican would > >> make the trek north. Some do.) Americans and Canadians can travel > >> all over the world but people crossing into the United States from > >> Mexico are arrested and deported. In Taiwan, Korea and Japan, a > >> person who can find work within one month of their arrival is given > >> permission to stay. > >> > >> When I lived in the Philippines I was unknowingly an illegal > >> immigrant: in most countries in the world, being married to a local > >> automatically causes one to be granted pernament resident status but > >> apparently the Philippines only grants pernament resident status to > >> people who apply from overseas: I could indeed have been thrown in > >> jail overstaying in the Philippines but instead I found a job here in > >> Taiwan and brought my family with me. I once had to wait in line > >> eight hours to get a work visa to go to Korea and when I complained > >> the girl at the window told me that Koreans have to wait just as long > >> to get visas from the American embassy: when I told her that I was > >> Canadian, not American, she apologized, but it was a bit late for > >> that. I know what it is like to be an illegal immigrant and I know > >> what it is like to be discriminated against so the comments you made > >> before affected me quite personally. > >> > >> <snip> > >> > >> Martin > > > >Martin, > >I have no problem with immigration--as long as people comply with the laws. > > > > And if the laws about immigration are created because the authors of > those laws are racist do you still support the law or the victims of the > law? Hello, When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians or the advocates of creation science. Jason Quote
Guest Free Lunch Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 On Sun, 13 May 2007 12:07:56 -0700, in alt.atheism Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in <Jason-1305071207570001@66-52-22-5.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: .... >Hello, >When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new >messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent >posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. >The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the >members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the >advocates of Creation Science. I have no prejudice. I have knowledge. Creation Science is a fraud. You have been taken in, but are too full of yourself to admit it. You would rather accuse others falsely than admit that you are a victim of these false teachers. >If you do NOT believe me, please read all >of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for >yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT >prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this >newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to >have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation >Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something >that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian >that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. >That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule >Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist >professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the >rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their >hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they >are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They >probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to >say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that >redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check >today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those >people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with >the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians >or the advocates of creation science. Creation science is a lie. Advocates of creation science are liars. That is a fact, not prejudice. Quote
Guest Jason Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 In article <1179076946.566639.31310@y80g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, gudloos@yahoo.com wrote: > On 13 Maj, 09:20, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > In article <8duc431csiubbtc9p1pms7tpko0jutn...@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > > > > > > > > > > > > <ROT13.qxer...@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > > > In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 17:04:51 -0700, J...@nospam.com > > > (Jason) let us all know that: > > > > > >In article <nghc43dkr6g440lgl6fd82t0q80on9k...@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > > > ><ROT13.qxer...@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > > > > > >> In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 11:10:34 -0700, J...@nospam.com > > > >> (Jason) let us all know that: > > > > > >> >Robyn, > > > >> >I fully realize that atheists and members of religions other than > > > >> >Chistianity such as Buddahism do good deeds. > > > >> >Jason > > > > > >> But that contradicts the bible. Remember Psalms 14:1/53:1? > > > > > >Don, > > > >I just read it. It's an interesting scripture. It's great to know that you > > > >own a Bible. > > > > > Don't need to; that's what the internets are for. > > > > > > Check John 3:16. > > > > > I know that one. > > > > > Now then, will you address the fact that you believe something > > > that directly contradicts what the bible teaches? > > > > Not a problem: Those scripture indicates that all people who don't love > > God are corrupt people that have committed "abominable deeds". Let's > > compare it to Romans 3:10 which states: There is none righteous--no not > > one. > > > > There is a doctrine related to the righteousness of God. God (according to > > that doctrine) is the only one that is truly righteous. Any righteousness > > that we develop is no different than filty rags (Isaiah 64:6). The goal is > > to love God and we will be saved and delivered from our sins and gain the > > righteousness of God. > > > > There are wonderful and kind people on this earth that are not Christians > > or Jews. However, as far as God is concerned, they have sins and are > > therefore corrupt people. Of course, if those people became > > Christians--they would be saved and delivered from their sins. > > > > As far as I am concerned, they are wonderful and kind people. > > > > > And they will burn for ever in hell according to your beliefs. Hello, When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians or the advocates of creation science. Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 In article <DipthotDipthot-ABD773.10173213052007@newsclstr02.news.prodigy.com>, 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > In article > <Jason-1105072132340001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > In article > > <DipthotDipthot-C9F689.19484611052007@newsclstr02.news.prodigy.com>, > > 655321 <DipthotDipthot@Yahoo.Yahoo.Com.Com> wrote: > > > > > In article > > > <Jason-1005071716170001@66-52-22-37.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>, > > > Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > > > > > > > If everyone in the world lived by the principles of life that Confucius > > > > established, we would not need to build new prisons. > > > > > > Then you could be wrong about your stick-boy demigod! > > > > If everyone followed the law, we would not need to build new prisons. > > ...whatever the laws may be. I the laws made adultery and kicking cats > mandatory, and everyone committed adultery and kicked cats, no one would > be imprisoned for that. > > So? Hello, When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians or the advocates of creation science. Jason Quote
Guest Jason Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 In article <5aor5qF2pjtdgU1@mid.individual.net>, SeppoP <seppo_pietikainen@xyahoox.com> wrote: > Jason wrote: > > In article <1179042444.374902.200220@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, Martin > > Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > >> On May 13, 3:56 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >>> In article <1179027411.828594.125...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, Martin > >>> > >>> <phippsmar...@hotmail.com> wrote: > >>>> On May 13, 8:20 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >>>>> In article <esgc43h06ki5neitn538nm7s4t7bcq8...@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > >>>>>>> When Einstein > >>>>>> Cite please. > >>>>> Nightline had a special related to a debate between two oupspoken > >>>>> Christians and two outspoken atheists. One of the Christians used the > >>>>> quote from Einstein related to the watch. > >>>> You mean Kirk Cameron when he said Einstein believed in God? He did > >>>> not provide that quote. He just said "I didn't say he was > >>>> Christian". He provided no quote to prove that Einstein believed in > >>>> God. In fact, it is not true. > >>>> "It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious > >>>> convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not > >>>> believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have > >>>> expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called > >>>> religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the > >>>> world so far as our science can reveal it." > >>>> Letter to an atheist (1954) as quoted in Albert Einstein: The Human > >>>> Side (1981) edited by Helen Dukas and Banesh Hoffman > >>> Yes, Kirk Cameron made that statement related to Einstein's watch. I hope > >>> he did not make it up. > >> Are you refering to the part of the debate where he said Einstein > >> believed in god and the crowd groaned (possibly because Einstein > >> himself had dismissed this as "a lie")? He told no such story about > >> Einstein. The debate is still online. Perhaps you should take > >> another look. I'll do likewise. > >> > >> http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=3160774 > >> > >> Martin > > > > Martin, > > He must have made the statement on Fox news while he was promoting the > > debate. My memory is not perfect. I thought that he made it during the > > debate while he was discussing Einstein. Thanks for the clarification. I > > will see if he has a website. > > jason > > > > > > Here's Kirk Cameron's understanding of science in 1m05s: > > < > > You are as dumb as Kirk Cameron... Hello, When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians or the advocates of creation science. Jason Quote
Guest cactus Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 Jason wrote: > In article <5Tx1i.2603$UU.1613@newssvr19.news.prodigy.net>, > bm1@nonespam.com wrote: > >> Jason wrote: >>> In article <1179021006.214437.12380@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, Martin >>> Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: >>> >>>> On May 13, 4:05 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >>>> >>>>> I had some major problems with an atheist psychology professor that >>>>> ridiculed a fellow Christian and myself related to a situational ethics >>>>> class. >>>> Let me make one thing clear: I _never_ initiate a round of personal >>>> attacks, not even in an online debate like this. I fully admit that >>>> there are several regular atheist posters who freely use words like >>>> "moron", "idiot" and "liar". I prefer to say things like "Your >>>> argument is nonsense", "You're being ignorant" or "You are lying" >>>> which is not the same thing because I am responding to a poster's >>>> argument and not attacking them personally. Even if somebody has lied >>>> repeatedly in post after post, it does not justify calling them a >>>> liar: it could just be that you think lying is a valid debating >>>> tactic. In any case, I hope you similarly understand the difference >>>> between "This [argument] is racist" and "You are racist". >>>> >>>>> I have had other athest professors that I respected. I don't >>>>> dislike evolutionists or atheists--I just disagree with them. I don't >>>>> dislike the advocates for abortion--I just disagree with them. >>>> Well then you are different from other fundies who come here because >>>> most fundies who come here gleefully tell us we will "burn in Hell". >>>> There's nothing more hateful than that. >>>> >>>> On a personal note, I admit to feeling outright hatred for all Moslems >>>> after 9/11. The only way I got over that hatred was to realize that >>>> it is religions, not religious people, which are evil. It's like >>>> hating an AIDS patient rather than the virus inside of him. >>>> >>>>> I took a >>>>> debate class in college. We appeared to not like each other during the >>>>> debates but actually we were friends. I once witnessed a trial where the >>>>> lawyers appeared to hate each other and be prejudiced against each other. >>>>> During the noon break, I saw them eating lunch together in the courthouse >>>>> cafeteria. They appeared to be close friends. >>>> They were probably the best of friends. Time and time again, they >>>> would have both worked on the same cases, albiet from different >>>> sides. They may have each known nobody with whom they had more in >>>> common. >>>> >>>> You obviously forget the true purpose of debate: the purpose of debate >>>> is to arrive at the truth by attacking a question from both sides. It >>>> isn't a question of having winners and losers. Lawyers who work on >>>> opposing sides of cases are collegues, not adversaries. >>>> >>>> I admire your gift for observation. I just wish your ability to >>>> actually see the world the way it is could save you from nevertheless >>>> thinking the world is very different from what you see. >>>> >>>> Martin >>> Martin, >>> Actually, Christianity has really helped me to not fear death. I am >>> actually looking forward to it. I have had to deal with elderly people >>> that were near death. Some of them were fearful of death. We have all >>> heard stories about elderly people that have about a dozen different >>> serious medical problems and lots of surgeries. They are afraid to die and >>> are trying their hardest to hang on to life a little while longer. That >>> will never happen to me. It's my guess that many atheists will decide to >>> become Christians when they start getting old or develop a serious disease >>> that could cause them to die--just in case they were wrong and want to >>> cover all bases. >> Do you think that everyone facing death will suddenly become Christian >> because of your coercive eschatology? I've known a fair number of >> people facing death. Without exception Christianity mattered as much to >> them in their final hours as it did in their lives. >> >>> Related to one of your other points--please note that I rarely respond to >>> anyone that is disrespective to me. I believe those people are hoping to >>> impress other people in this newsgroup and don't really want a response. >> I was seriously hoping that you would respond to my comments to you >> about your utterly distorted view of what evolution is. I had sincerely >> hoped that you would provide actual evidence to prove me wrong or maybe >> even changed your views. But thus far my hopes have been in vain. >> >> I >>> once heard a professor say that when people resort to name calling or >>> profanity in a debate--it means they have lost the debate since the name >>> calling and profanity means they have run out of important points. I >>> learned in a debate class to never lose my temper. >> You appear temperate in your debating style. However, you appear to be >> uninfluenced by the responses you receive. This is one of the sterile >> aspects of scholastic debating - one is judged on presentation, so there >> is no requirement for the debater to evaluate the content of his, or his >> opponents, arguments. Discussions with you are starting to appear >> sterile and pointless - mere scholastic debate. Nothing will change. You >> cannot muster arguments to change others' views, and you have shown that >> you are impervious to information. > > And the people that respond to my posts seem to be impervious to change > their points of view. > > Points of view may be difficult to change, but it is possible to exchange information and learn. It distresses me to no end that some people persist in posting misinformation when it has been refuted many times before. Some things will never change. jw will forever regard me as an apostate because I am Jewish. You believe that Jesus of Nazareth is your messiah. I can't change either of those, much as I would like to in jw's case. But I am starting to believe that some Christians regard spreading lies about evolution as a requirement of their particular faith. That bothers me. It angers me more that they spread lies about what evolution actually is about. Quote
Guest Don Kresch Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 In alt.atheism On Sun, 13 May 2007 12:06:17 -0700, Jason@nospam.com (Jason) let us all know that: >In article <dg5e43lqgk5tl2gaeba9vvpjeq4opcap5q@4ax.com>, Don Kresch ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > >> In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 22:39:14 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) let us all know that: >> >> >> >Have you ever considered that you could be wrong? In this case, if you are >> >wrong--you could end up in heaven or hell--the choice is up to you. >> >> Have you ever considered that you could be wring? In this >> case, if you're wrong, you could end up in the hell of someone else's >> religion. You should now believe in every god JUST IN CASE. >> >> If you don't, then you're a hypocrite. >> >> Don >> --- >> aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde >> Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. >> >> "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" >> Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" > >Hello, >When I opened my newsgroup reader, Run away. It's got nothing to do with the volume of posts, and everything to do with the fact that you had no idea what you were doing when you got into this. You're trying to run away as fast as possible. Don --- aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" Quote
Guest Steve O Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 "Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:3cre435bsir2j30uhon2s59meg7aa6ictt@4ax.com... > In alt.atheism On Sun, 13 May 2007 12:06:17 -0700, Jason@nospam.com > (Jason) let us all know that: > >>In article <dg5e43lqgk5tl2gaeba9vvpjeq4opcap5q@4ax.com>, Don Kresch >><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: >> >>> In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 22:39:14 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >>> (Jason) let us all know that: >>> >>> >>> >Have you ever considered that you could be wrong? In this case, if you >>> >are >>> >wrong--you could end up in heaven or hell--the choice is up to you. >>> >>> Have you ever considered that you could be wring? In this >>> case, if you're wrong, you could end up in the hell of someone else's >>> religion. You should now believe in every god JUST IN CASE. >>> >>> If you don't, then you're a hypocrite. >>> >>> Don >>> --- >>> aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde >>> Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. >>> >>> "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" >>> Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" >> >>Hello, >>When I opened my newsgroup reader, > > Run away. It's got nothing to do with the volume of posts, and > everything to do with the fact that you had no idea what you were > doing when you got into this. You're trying to run away as fast as > possible. > We see this kind of thing all of the time here. I don't think Jason is as dumb as he appears. I think he realised that if he stayed here, he would have to seriously think about his beliefs- and that's the worst thing that anyone who wants to hold on to his faith can do. So he ran...fast. -- Steve O a.a. #2240 (Apatheist Chapter) B.A.A.W.A. Convicted by Earthquack "The only problem with Baptists is that they don't hold them underwater long enough" > > Don > --- > aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde > Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. > > "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" > Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" > Quote
Guest Tokay Pino Gris Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 Steve O wrote: > "Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message > news:3cre435bsir2j30uhon2s59meg7aa6ictt@4ax.com... >> In alt.atheism On Sun, 13 May 2007 12:06:17 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) let us all know that: >> >>> In article <dg5e43lqgk5tl2gaeba9vvpjeq4opcap5q@4ax.com>, Don Kresch >>> <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: >>> >>>> In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 22:39:14 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >>>> (Jason) let us all know that: >>>> >>>> >>>>> Have you ever considered that you could be wrong? In this case, if you >>>>> are >>>>> wrong--you could end up in heaven or hell--the choice is up to you. >>>> Have you ever considered that you could be wring? In this >>>> case, if you're wrong, you could end up in the hell of someone else's >>>> religion. You should now believe in every god JUST IN CASE. >>>> >>>> If you don't, then you're a hypocrite. >>>> >>>> Don >>>> --- >>>> aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde >>>> Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. >>>> >>>> "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" >>>> Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" >>> Hello, >>> When I opened my newsgroup reader, >> Run away. It's got nothing to do with the volume of posts, and >> everything to do with the fact that you had no idea what you were >> doing when you got into this. You're trying to run away as fast as >> possible. >> > We see this kind of thing all of the time here. > I don't think Jason is as dumb as he appears. > I think he realised that if he stayed here, he would have to seriously think > about his beliefs- and that's the worst thing that anyone who wants to hold > on to his faith can do. > So he ran...fast. > Well..... maybe his brain will go on on its own for a while... Because if he ran because it looked like he would loose, maybe his subconscious will calculate a little bit.... Maybe worry about that "omniscient/omnipotent/benevolent" stuff.... So maybe, just maybe, he now has some doubts about this... But of course, he does not want to admit it. Not even to himself. But well.... the subconscious is a funny thing.... it will keep nicking at him... Tokay -- The problem with any unwritten law is that you don't know where to go to erase it. Glaser and Way Quote
Guest Steve O Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 "Tokay Pino Gris" <tokay.gris.beau@gmx.net> wrote in message news:f285dg$n4t$03$1@news.t-online.com... > Steve O wrote: >> "Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message >> news:3cre435bsir2j30uhon2s59meg7aa6ictt@4ax.com... >>> In alt.atheism On Sun, 13 May 2007 12:06:17 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >>> (Jason) let us all know that: >>> >>>> In article <dg5e43lqgk5tl2gaeba9vvpjeq4opcap5q@4ax.com>, Don Kresch >>>> <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 22:39:14 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >>>>> (Jason) let us all know that: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Have you ever considered that you could be wrong? In this case, if >>>>>> you are >>>>>> wrong--you could end up in heaven or hell--the choice is up to you. >>>>> Have you ever considered that you could be wring? In this >>>>> case, if you're wrong, you could end up in the hell of someone else's >>>>> religion. You should now believe in every god JUST IN CASE. >>>>> >>>>> If you don't, then you're a hypocrite. >>>>> >>>>> Don >>>>> --- >>>>> aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde >>>>> Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. >>>>> >>>>> "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" >>>>> Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" >>>> Hello, >>>> When I opened my newsgroup reader, >>> Run away. It's got nothing to do with the volume of posts, and >>> everything to do with the fact that you had no idea what you were >>> doing when you got into this. You're trying to run away as fast as >>> possible. >>> >> We see this kind of thing all of the time here. >> I don't think Jason is as dumb as he appears. >> I think he realised that if he stayed here, he would have to seriously >> think about his beliefs- and that's the worst thing that anyone who wants >> to hold on to his faith can do. >> So he ran...fast. >> > > Well..... maybe his brain will go on on its own for a while... Because if > he ran because it looked like he would loose, maybe his subconscious will > calculate a little bit.... Maybe worry about that > "omniscient/omnipotent/benevolent" stuff.... > > So maybe, just maybe, he now has some doubts about this... > > But of course, he does not want to admit it. Not even to himself. But > well.... the subconscious is a funny thing.... it will keep nicking at > him... > I don't know quite how to express this, but, in my work, I have come across some genuinely crazy people. I mean, certifiably insane... literally. One thing I noticed about them - no matter how mad they were- on some, deep, sub conscious level, they seemed to know and understand they were crazy but just couldn't seem to stop themselves. I get exactly the same feeling when I talk to theists with their crazy ideas about virgin mothers, everlasting loaves and fishes, people raising from the dead, wordwide floods and talking snakes. -- Steve O a.a. #2240 (Apatheist Chapter) B.A.A.W.A. Convicted by Earthquack "The only problem with Baptists is that they don't hold them underwater long enough" Quote
Guest John Baker Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 On Sun, 13 May 2007 12:07:56 -0700, Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >In article <kaae43h9ibinnsntkcmtbr8aret1jihjuj@4ax.com>, Free Lunch ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> On Sun, 13 May 2007 01:48:00 -0700, in alt.talk.creationism >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> <Jason-1305070148010001@66-52-22-70.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >In article <1179031222.406540.262970@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, Martin >> ><phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: >> > >> >> On May 13, 11:26 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > In article <1179019540.936296.309...@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, Martin >> >> > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> <snip> >> >> >> >> > > It is racist to to equate all illegal immigrants with gang members. >> >> > > There have been white gangs, black gangs and even Asian gangs in >> >> > > America too. Most people who come to America looking for work are not >> >> > > only not looking for trouble but are going to avoid getting into >> >> > > trouble for fear of being sent back to Mexico. >> >> > >> >> > That is a true statement. Most illegal immigrants do not get involved in >> >> > criminal behavior. I have worked with some of those wonderful people. I >> >> > did not mean to offend you. >> >> >> >> I appreciate that. Under the circumstances, I think it would be >> >> better to snip what you said above. >> >> >> >> It is my opinion that US immigration policy is racist. Up until very >> >> recently, Canadians could pass into the US from Canada without even >> >> having to show their passports but Mexicans were held back with fences >> >> and were arrested if they passed into the United States. People from >> >> Canada and England have been able to work in the United States without >> >> becoming American citizens but the United States still has no guest >> >> worker program for Mexicans wanting to work in the US. >> >> (Such a program does exist in Canada: a smart, qualified Mexican would >> >> make the trek north. Some do.) Americans and Canadians can travel >> >> all over the world but people crossing into the United States from >> >> Mexico are arrested and deported. In Taiwan, Korea and Japan, a >> >> person who can find work within one month of their arrival is given >> >> permission to stay. >> >> >> >> When I lived in the Philippines I was unknowingly an illegal >> >> immigrant: in most countries in the world, being married to a local >> >> automatically causes one to be granted pernament resident status but >> >> apparently the Philippines only grants pernament resident status to >> >> people who apply from overseas: I could indeed have been thrown in >> >> jail overstaying in the Philippines but instead I found a job here in >> >> Taiwan and brought my family with me. I once had to wait in line >> >> eight hours to get a work visa to go to Korea and when I complained >> >> the girl at the window told me that Koreans have to wait just as long >> >> to get visas from the American embassy: when I told her that I was >> >> Canadian, not American, she apologized, but it was a bit late for >> >> that. I know what it is like to be an illegal immigrant and I know >> >> what it is like to be discriminated against so the comments you made >> >> before affected me quite personally. >> >> >> >> <snip> >> >> >> >> Martin >> > >> >Martin, >> >I have no problem with immigration--as long as people comply with the laws. >> > >> >> And if the laws about immigration are created because the authors of >> those laws are racist do you still support the law or the victims of the >> law? > >Hello, >When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new >messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent >posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. >The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the >members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the >advocates of Creation Science. Well, duh! alt.ATHEISM, Skippy. What did you expect? A revival meeting? You've been here before, Jason, and you've had your arse handed to you on a platter for your ignorance and arrogance before. Why would you expect this time to be different? Quote
Guest Ralph Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1205072116220001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <2mmc43hp6t7qofikgd05o38bkap63aq3c9@4ax.com>, Free Lunch > <lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> On Sat, 12 May 2007 17:30:24 -0700, in alt.atheism >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> <Jason-1205071730250001@66-52-22-33.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >In article <ragc43t77bh612omlhsvbtv2oc0s04mdld@4ax.com>, Free Lunch >> ><lunch@nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> > >> >> On Sat, 12 May 2007 15:39:42 -0700, in alt.atheism >> >> Jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote in >> >> <Jason-1205071539420001@66-52-22-50.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net>: >> >> >In article <GrqdnZkQdNyMsdvbnZ2dnUVZ_t3inZ2d@comcast.com>, John >> >> >Popelish >> >> ><jpopelish@rica.net> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> Jason wrote: >> >> >> > In article <hJSdnSrqr5mbn9vbnZ2dnUVZ_gqdnZ2d@comcast.com>, John > Popelish >> >> >> > <jpopelish@rica.net> wrote: >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> Jason wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> I consider God to be omniscient and omnipotent. He is also a >> >dictator but >> >> >> >>> that is not a problem for Christians. God is a loving God and >> >would be a >> >> >> >>> wonderful dictator. >> >> >> >> That is the fear talking. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> This loving hypothetical god also is said to have nearly >> >> >> >> sterilized the planet, because it had a temper tantrum when >> >> >> >> its creation did not perform up to its expectations, yet, >> >> >> >> had been created exactly as it wished it to be and had been >> >> >> >> foreseen to be. How could it have been otherwise if this >> >> >> >> hypothetical loving god was really omniscient and >> >> >> >> omnipotent? That is one crazy and sadistic hypothetical >> >> >> >> demon, you got there. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> You better keep complimenting it and kissing its ass, or it >> >> >> >> might do you and infinite punishment. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> I would not trust a dictator that was human but would >> >> >> >>> trust God since God is perfect. >> >> >> >> (snip) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Kiss kiss (don't hurt me). >> >> >> > >> >> >> > The other alternative is going to hell and being forced to > worship Satan. >> >> >> > I believe my choice is better. >> >> >> >> >> >> Once you understand that the whole story is mythology, other >> >> >> choices open up. >> >> >> >> >> >> In the mean time, you will probably sleep better if you keep >> >> >> sucking up to your imaginary, hypothetical god. >> >> >> >> >> >> I understand. I once feared the same demon. >> >> > >> >> >On judgement day, you will really be shocked. >> >> > >> >> There is no evidence that there will be a judgement day. There is no >> >> evidence that any gods exist. There is no evidence that the god you >> >> worship is the right god. There is no evidence that you won't be the >> >> one >> >> going to hell for worshipping the wrong god. >> > >> >Not true--the WRITTEN evidence is in the Bible. >> >> No, religious writings are absolutely _never_ evidence. You may choose >> to ignore that fact, but it won't change because you ignore it. Your >> religious texts cannot be shown to be more reliable than any other >> religious texts. >> >> >In many courts in America, >> >written evidence such as contracts are deemed very important. >> >> It depends on the purpose to which it is used and the provenance of the >> writing. The Bible fails on both counts and cannot be admitted into >> court except to the extent that it would be used to answer a question >> about what was written in some verse of the Bible. It is not and cannot >> be used for history or science. > > Not true-Many colleges have courses entitled, > The Bible as History > I suggest that you read this book: > "In Six Days" Editor J.F. Ashton > 50 scientists explain their reasons for believing in the Biblical > versionof creation. I suggest you read this list: http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/articles/3697_the_list_2_16_2003.asp Over 800 scientists named Steve agree with the theory of evolution. >> >Josh McDowell wrote a book entitled, "Evidence That Demands A >> >Verdict". I actually saw him preach in a church service. >> >> I actually own his collections of lies. His books are dishonest and >> misleading. I also own this book of lies. Anytime you wish to defend ETDAV I will be more than happy to discuss it with you. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1205072257100001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <1179022831.175165.52020@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, Martin > <phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> On May 13, 6:39 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >> > On judgement day, you will really be shocked. >> >> When exactly is judgement day? Jesus told his disciples it would >> happen in their lifetime. People read this and always assume Jesus is >> talking directly to them and that they will see judgement day before >> they die. >> >> Martin > > It's my understanding that judgement day happens soon after we go to > heaven. There are actually two judgement days. One of the judgement days > is more like an awards ceremony--Christians are given awards (called > "crowns in the original King James Bible) based on their good works. It's > my guess that Mother Theresa received lots of rewards since she spent her > entire adult life helping people. Lots of missionaries will also receive > awards. The disciples were hoping the Rapture would happen in their > lifetimes--they were wrong. > Jason The "Rapture? Now there's a word you won't find in the bible. Jesus made it as plain as possible, he would return soon: MATTHEW 16 (KJV) 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. 16:28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. 1 THESSALONIANS 4:15 (NIV) According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that WE WHO ARE STILL ALIVE, WE WHO ARE LEFT till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. Hebrews 10 (NIV) 36 You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you will receive what he has promised. 37 For in just a VERY LITTLE WHILE, "He who is coming will come and WILL NOT DELAY. JAMES 5:8 (KJV) Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord DRAWETH NIGH. I PETER 4:7 (KJV) But the END OF ALL THINGS IS AT HAND: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer. I JOHN 2:18 (KJV) Little children, it is the LAST TIME: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. REVELATION (KJV) 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must SHORTLY COME TO PASS; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the TIME IS AT HAND. 3:11 Behold, I COME QUICKLY: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. 22:7 Behold, I COME QUICKLY: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book. 22:12 And, behold, I COME QUICKLY; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. 22:20 He which testifieth these things saith, SURELY I COME QUICKLY. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. and finally, these two taken together: MATTHEW 10:23 (NIV) When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. I TELL YOU THE TRUTH, YOU WILL NOT FINISH GOING THROUGH THE CITIES OF ISRAEL BEFORE THE SON OF MAN COMES. COLOSSIANS 1:23 (NIV) if you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from the hope held out in the gospel. This is the gospel that you heard and THAT HAS BEEN PROCLAIMED TO EVERY CREATURE UNDER HEAVEN, and of which I, Paul, have become a servant. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1305071211370001@66-52-22-5.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <5aor5qF2pjtdgU1@mid.individual.net>, SeppoP > <seppo_pietikainen@xyahoox.com> wrote: > >> Jason wrote: >> > In article <1179042444.374902.200220@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, >> > Martin >> > Phipps <martinphipps2@yahoo.com> wrote: >> > >> >> On May 13, 3:56 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >>> In article <1179027411.828594.125...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, >> >>> Martin >> >>> >> >>> <phippsmar...@hotmail.com> wrote: >> >>>> On May 13, 8:20 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >>>>> In article <esgc43h06ki5neitn538nm7s4t7bcq8...@4ax.com>, Don Kresch >> >>>>>>> When Einstein >> >>>>>> Cite please. >> >>>>> Nightline had a special related to a debate between two oupspoken >> >>>>> Christians and two outspoken atheists. One of the Christians used >> >>>>> the >> >>>>> quote from Einstein related to the watch. >> >>>> You mean Kirk Cameron when he said Einstein believed in God? He did >> >>>> not provide that quote. He just said "I didn't say he was >> >>>> Christian". He provided no quote to prove that Einstein believed in >> >>>> God. In fact, it is not true. >> >>>> "It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious >> >>>> convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not >> >>>> believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have >> >>>> expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called >> >>>> religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of >> >>>> the >> >>>> world so far as our science can reveal it." >> >>>> Letter to an atheist (1954) as quoted in Albert Einstein: The Human >> >>>> Side (1981) edited by Helen Dukas and Banesh Hoffman >> >>> Yes, Kirk Cameron made that statement related to Einstein's watch. I >> >>> hope >> >>> he did not make it up. >> >> Are you refering to the part of the debate where he said Einstein >> >> believed in god and the crowd groaned (possibly because Einstein >> >> himself had dismissed this as "a lie")? He told no such story about >> >> Einstein. The debate is still online. Perhaps you should take >> >> another look. I'll do likewise. >> >> >> >> http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=3160774 >> >> >> >> Martin >> > >> > Martin, >> > He must have made the statement on Fox news while he was promoting the >> > debate. My memory is not perfect. I thought that he made it during the >> > debate while he was discussing Einstein. Thanks for the clarification. >> > I >> > will see if he has a website. >> > jason >> > >> > >> >> Here's Kirk Cameron's understanding of science in 1m05s: >> >> < >> >> You are as dumb as Kirk Cameron... > > Hello, > When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new > messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent > posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. > The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the > members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the > advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all > of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for > yourself. Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT > prejudice. I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this > newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to > have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation > Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something > that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian > that hurt them. One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. > That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule > Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist > professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the > rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their > hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they > are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They > probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." Needless to > say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that > redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check > today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those > people are rediculing me in their posts. I will miss exchanging posts with > the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians > or the advocates of creation science. > Jason As the song says, "another one bites the dust" Quote
Guest Ralph Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1305070103180001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <1179034223.273130.45400@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, George > Chen <georgechen2@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> On May 13, 1:43 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> > In article <1179021474.195725.219...@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, >> > Martin >> > >> > Phipps <martinphip...@yahoo.com> wrote: >> > > On May 13, 4:32 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> > > > In article <hJSdnSrqr5mbn9vbnZ2dnUVZ_gqdn...@comcast.com>, John >> > > > Popelish >> > >> > > > <jpopel...@rica.net> wrote: >> > > > > Jason wrote: >> > >> > > > > > I consider God to be omniscient and omnipotent. He is also a >> > dictator but >> > > > > > that is not a problem for Christians. God is a loving God and > would be a >> > > > > > wonderful dictator. >> > >> > > > > That is the fear talking. >> > >> > > > > This loving hypothetical god also is said to have nearly >> > > > > sterilized the planet, because it had a temper tantrum when >> > > > > its creation did not perform up to its expectations, yet, >> > > > > had been created exactly as it wished it to be and had been >> > > > > foreseen to be. How could it have been otherwise if this >> > > > > hypothetical loving god was really omniscient and >> > > > > omnipotent? That is one crazy and sadistic hypothetical >> > > > > demon, you got there. >> > >> > > > > You better keep complimenting it and kissing its ass, or it >> > > > > might do you and infinite punishment. >> > >> > > > > > I would not trust a dictator that was human but would >> > > > > > trust God since God is perfect. >> > > > > (snip) >> > >> > > > > Kiss kiss (don't hurt me). >> > >> > > > The other alternative is going to hell and being forced to worship > Satan. >> > > > I believe my choice is better. >> > >> > > What if neither God nor Satan exist (which is, in fact, the case)? >> > > What then? >> > >> > I will have lost nothing since I will eventally become dust or ashes. >> > However, if God and Satan does exist---you will end up in hell unless >> > you >> > become a Christian. >> >> Feh. On the infinitesimally slim chance that Hell exists it would >> still be better than non-existance. What makes you think I wouldn't >> choose Hell if I had the choice? I'd have plenty of atheists and >> other non-Christians to keep me company. > > I would prefer paradise than to burn in Hell. Hell is a concept invented by Christians to keep the flock in line. Quote
Guest Ralph Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message news:Jason-1205072247530001@66-52-22-47.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... > In article <5cuc43t8jkl86t2oe40uks3retvimo6i6i@4ax.com>, Don Kresch > <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: > >> In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 17:31:38 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >> (Jason) let us all know that: >> >> >In article <l9hc4397k7375tbe40ikt1vfsrm4b9admr@4ax.com>, Don Kresch >> ><ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: >> > >> >> In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 11:49:10 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >> >> (Jason) let us all know that: >> >> >> >> >In article <5alq3oF2oseo3U1@mid.individual.net>, "Steve O" >> >> ><spamhere@nowhere.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> "Tokay Pino Gris" <tokay.gris.beau@gmx.net> wrote in message >> >> >> news:f247a9$n2t$01$2@news.t-online.com... >> >> >> > Jason wrote: >> >> >> >> In article <h21a43tsn3815kcq54g0chgce5tli4prgc@4ax.com>, Don >> >> >> >> Kresch >> >> >> >> <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> In alt.atheism On Fri, 11 May 2007 17:51:48 -0700, >> >> >> >>> Jason@nospam.com >> >> >> >>> (Jason) let us all know that: >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>>> In article <5akd8hF2oeg1dU1@mid.individual.net>, "Steve O" >> >> >> >>>> <spamhere@nowhere.com> wrote: >> >> >> >>>> >> >> >> >>>>> "Jason" <Jason@nospam.com> wrote in message >> >> >> >>>>> > news:Jason-1105071713050001@66-52-22-112.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net... >> >> >> >>>>>> God created people that had free will. Free will is neither > perfect >> >> >> >>>>>> or >> >> >> >>>>>> imperfect. Even the created angels had free will--Satan >> >> >> >>>>>> exercised >> >> >> >> his free >> >> >> >>>>>> will when he started a rebellion. Even Angels have free >> >> >> >>>>>> will. God >> >> >> >> does not >> >> >> >>>>>> want programmed robots that are programmed to say, "I love > God". He >> >> >> >>>>>> wants >> >> >> >>>>>> angels and people to love and worship God because they want > to love >> >> >> >>>>>> and >> >> >> >>>>>> worship God. You don't appear to know much about the >> >> >> >>>>>> doctrine >> >of free >> >> >> >>>>>> will. Books have been written about that subject. >> >> >> >>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>> . >> >> >> >>>>>>> Yet it cannot hold. Since god is omniscient and >> >> >> >>>>>>> created >> >> >> >>>>>>> everything (according to the doctrine of your religion), > there can >> >> >> >>>>>>> be >> >> >> >>>>>>> no free will. It's not possible. >> >> >> >>>>>> I disagree. I have free will--you have free will. >> >> >> >>>>> Then you have just demonstrated why there is no God. >> >> >> >>>>> You aren't listening to what you are being told - if there >> >> >> >>>>> was an >> >> >> >>>>> omniscient, all powerful God who knows exactly what will >> >> >> >>>>> happen >> >in the >> >> >> >>>>> future and is in control of what will happen from the moment >> >> >> >>>>> of >> >> >> >>>>> creation- there can be no free will, as God will already know >> >what you >> >> >> >>>>> will do >> >> >> >> before >> >> >> >>>>> you were even created- IOW, no free will. >> >> >> >>>>> You are quite clear on the fact that there is free will, > therefore, >> >> >> >> by your >> >> >> >>>>> own statement, there is no God. >> >> >> >>>> That debate could go on forever. The bottom line is that we > have free >> >> >> >>>> will. >> >> >> >>> Ok. Then either god is not omniscient or god didn't >> >> >> >>> create >> >> >> >>> everything. Which will it be? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> God is omniscient and omni powerful. God can do anything that he >> >wants to >> >> >> >> do. He can create anything that he wishes to create. If you >> >> >> >> reply, >> >please >> >> >> >> don't snip anything that I stated in these 5 sentences. You done >> >that the >> >> >> >> last time. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > The saying is "omniscient, omnipotent and benevolent". Which > just is not >> >> >> > possible. At least one of the three is a contradiction. Make > your pick. >> >> >> > >> >> >> I don't think he really understands the implications in order to > pick one. >> >> >> He just doesn't seem to have the capacity to understand why free >> >> >> will >> >and an >> >> >> omnipotent, omniscient creator God are contradictory. >> >> > >> >> >I consider God to be omniscient and omnipotent. >> >> >> >> And did god create everything? If so, then there's no free >> >> will. >> > >> >God gave us free will when he created mankind. >> >> Did god create everything? Please answer the question. > > Genesis--chapter 1-6 discusses that God created mankind, lot of plants and > lots of animals. God also created the earth and the solar system. It's my > opinion that after God finished creating mankind, lots of plants and lots > of animals--that evolution took over. Darwin also believed that God > created life. Jason, you've been called on your Darwin assertion several times. Unless you can show where Darwin said this you need to quit saying it. Quote
Guest Tokay Pino Gris Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 Steve O wrote: > "Tokay Pino Gris" <tokay.gris.beau@gmx.net> wrote in message > news:f285dg$n4t$03$1@news.t-online.com... >> Steve O wrote: >>> "Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message >>> news:3cre435bsir2j30uhon2s59meg7aa6ictt@4ax.com... >>>> In alt.atheism On Sun, 13 May 2007 12:06:17 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >>>> (Jason) let us all know that: >>>> >>>>> In article <dg5e43lqgk5tl2gaeba9vvpjeq4opcap5q@4ax.com>, Don Kresch >>>>> <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 22:39:14 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >>>>>> (Jason) let us all know that: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Have you ever considered that you could be wrong? In this case, if >>>>>>> you are >>>>>>> wrong--you could end up in heaven or hell--the choice is up to you. >>>>>> Have you ever considered that you could be wring? In this >>>>>> case, if you're wrong, you could end up in the hell of someone else's >>>>>> religion. You should now believe in every god JUST IN CASE. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you don't, then you're a hypocrite. >>>>>> >>>>>> Don >>>>>> --- >>>>>> aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde >>>>>> Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert. >>>>>> >>>>>> "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another" >>>>>> Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man" >>>>> Hello, >>>>> When I opened my newsgroup reader, >>>> Run away. It's got nothing to do with the volume of posts, and >>>> everything to do with the fact that you had no idea what you were >>>> doing when you got into this. You're trying to run away as fast as >>>> possible. >>>> >>> We see this kind of thing all of the time here. >>> I don't think Jason is as dumb as he appears. >>> I think he realised that if he stayed here, he would have to seriously >>> think about his beliefs- and that's the worst thing that anyone who wants >>> to hold on to his faith can do. >>> So he ran...fast. >>> >> Well..... maybe his brain will go on on its own for a while... Because if >> he ran because it looked like he would loose, maybe his subconscious will >> calculate a little bit.... Maybe worry about that >> "omniscient/omnipotent/benevolent" stuff.... >> >> So maybe, just maybe, he now has some doubts about this... >> >> But of course, he does not want to admit it. Not even to himself. But >> well.... the subconscious is a funny thing.... it will keep nicking at >> him... >> > I don't know quite how to express this, but, in my work, I have come across > some genuinely crazy people. > I mean, certifiably insane... literally. > One thing I noticed about them - no matter how mad they were- on some, deep, > sub conscious level, they seemed to know and understand they were crazy but > just couldn't seem to stop themselves. > I get exactly the same feeling when I talk to theists with their crazy ideas > about virgin mothers, everlasting loaves and fishes, people raising from the > dead, wordwide floods and talking snakes. > I can hope, can't I? ;-) Tokay -- The problem with any unwritten law is that you don't know where to go to erase it. Glaser and Way Quote
Guest Ralph Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 "Martin" <phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:1179049190.870630.14250@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... > On May 13, 5:35 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > >> When I was in college, I asked God to help me pass tests and >> exams. > > Must... resist... temptation... to... make... ad hominem. > > Martin I don't see how you resisted. I couldn't have done it :-). Quote
Guest Jim Burns Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 Jason wrote: > > <snip> > > > >It's more complicated. God knew Adam and Eve would > > >eventually sin so he had a plan prepared. > > > > But if they were created perfect, they wouldn't sin. > > Good point. They were NOT created perfect. God did not want > programmed robots that would be programmed to worship him. (1) Later, in Heaven, when you're perfect and sinless, will God have changed his mind about having robots worshipping Him, or will God have learned how to combine free will and sinlessness? You know, it doesn't matter how you fiddle with the details of the story, it will never make any sense. God is a timeless being, yes? Then whenever he does something /now/, it leaves unanswerable the question of why He did not do it /earlier/. Well, not completely unanswerable. You can always say, God does not like back talk. Sit down and shut up, or I'll paddle you (or, God will torture you for eternity). Of course, that's not an answer. It's an admission you don't have an answer. (2) About this so-called free will: Pretend you were a bank cashier. A robber comes in one day, sticks a gun to your head and says "Fill the sack with cash or you die". Would you agree that you filled that sack "of your own free will"? I doubt it. Everyone I know, theist and atheist, would use that story as a perfect example of an act NOT "of your own free will". But, when we make religion-talk, suddenly all the definitions change, so that telling us "worship or be tortured forever" is "letting us have our own free will". Jim Burns [...] Quote
Guest Michael Gray Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 On Sun, 13 May 2007 08:44:23 -0500, Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote: - Refer: <dg5e43lqgk5tl2gaeba9vvpjeq4opcap5q@4ax.com> >In alt.atheism On Sat, 12 May 2007 22:39:14 -0700, Jason@nospam.com >(Jason) let us all know that: > > >>Have you ever considered that you could be wrong? In this case, if you are >>wrong--you could end up in heaven or hell--the choice is up to you. > > Have you ever considered that you could be wring? In this >case, if you're wrong, you could end up in the hell of someone else's >religion. You should now believe in every god JUST IN CASE. > > If you don't, then you're a hypocrite. He is a hypocrite any way. That would just add one more example to the vast mountain of hypocrital lies that this evil Medieval has dribbled. -- Quote
Guest Michael Gray Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 On Sun, 13 May 2007 20:36:36 -0400, "Ralph" <mmman_90@yahoo.com> wrote: - Refer: <kaO1i.1304$nh.471@bignews3.bellsouth.net> > >"Martin" <phippsmartin@hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:1179049190.870630.14250@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... >> On May 13, 5:35 pm, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: >> >>> When I was in college, I asked God to help me pass tests and >>> exams. >> >> Must... resist... temptation... to... make... ad hominem. >> >> Martin > >I don't see how you resisted. I couldn't have done it :-). He prayed to Minerva for strength. -- Quote
Guest Martin Phipps Posted May 14, 2007 Posted May 14, 2007 On May 14, 3:05 am, J...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote: > When I opened my newsgroup reader, I noticed that there were 53 new > messages and it was my guess that most of them were responses to my recent > posts. I have decided to not reply to any more posts in this newsgroup. > The reason is simple. I have noticed that many (but not all) of the > members of this newsgroup have a prejudice aganist Christians and/or the > advocates of Creation Science. If you do NOT believe me, please read all > of the posts in this newsgroup and you will be able to see it for > yourself. I have. You are the one who has displayed bigotry against both atheists and Mexicans. > Of course, there are members of this newsgroup that are NOT > prejudice. ie all the atheists. > I enjoyed exchanging posts with those members of this > newsgroup. I did not like reading posts from the members that appear to > have some sort of hatred for Christians and/or the advocates of Creation > Science. Perhaps that is because at least one Christian done something > that made them believe all Christians were just as bad as that Christian > that hurt them. You mean like repeatedly lying? It happens a lot. > One person told me that I was prejudice against atheists. > That is only partly true. I am prejudice against atheists that redicule > Christians or redicule me for being a Christian. An example is an atheist > professor that asked for all Christians to raise their hands. He told the > rest of the class to take a close look at the Christians that had their > hands raised. He stated something like this, "See these Christians--they > are so stupid that they believe in a God that does not exist. They > probably also believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny." He would have been right, if such an incident actually happened. > Needless to > say, I am prejudiced against that professor and any other atheist that > redicules Christians or the advocates of Creation Science. Please check > today's posts in this newsgroup and decide for yourself how many of those > people are rediculing me in their posts. Let's see. There's Michael Gray. (He called you an idiot.) That's one. Somebopdy else used bad language but thet's not the same thing. Everybody else? They've been giving you logical arguments and you've ignored them. > I will miss exchanging posts with > the members of this newsgroup that are not prejudiced aganist Christians > or the advocates of creation science. I'm sorry you were never able to get a clue as a result of our exchanges. Martin Quote
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