Ask the Builder...

[Morgan]

I get people that call and dance around the question that they seem to want to ask, so I thought that I would open up a thread about asking the builder questions. I will not answer questions about E85 needles, port widths, bowl percentages, valve angles, cam timing or ignition timing, but other then that I'm pretty much open to answering questions that members have wondered about.

Fire away...

 

[Loud450man]

hey first off great thread should help alot of people. My small question is, do u guys normally wire up the tps when u do the fcr carbs from stock on the 04-05's or do u not run tps? Im not real sure what tps is for but i was thinking you could run without it connected so it cant be to important or is it? thanks morgan

 

[Morgan]

hey first off great thread should help alot of people. My small question is, do u guys normally wire up the tps when u do the fcr carbs from stock on the 04-05's or do u not run tps? Im not real sure what tps is for but i was thinking you could run without it connected so it cant be to important or is it? thanks morgan

We do not run the TPS on FCR carbs.

 

[Loud450man]

so could i just clip mine off and be fine? is it some sort of epa crap?

 

[Morgan]

so could i just clip mine off and be fine? is it some sort of epa crap?

You can just leave it, or clip it off either way.

 

[Loud450man]

thanks

 

[cheapfast450r]

Hey Morgan, I was wondering about the ESR intakes. I've read where shortning/ cutting the intake will help get the air right going into the carb. Is this intakes legnth change with the differant engine combos or is it kinda a standard legnth. How do you tell how much to cut off? I have a modded esr but don't know how much to trim. thanks guy!

 

[Junk94]

I have 4 450's that I have been apart of putting together.

1st quad -
07 CW 477 kit 12.1:1
Stock Stroke
Ported Head (Rage)
HRC jetting and needle
HRC Cam
No Lid on the filter
HRC Head pipe w/White Brothers Exhaust
Rekluse

2nd Quad 2005
Stock Stroke Stock Bore
Weisco 13.1:1 piston
Hot Cams Stage 2
Stock carb other then jetting
Full Dasa Exhaust
Aftermarket Aluminum air box with uni filter
Rekluse

Quad 3 2007
Stock Stroke
CW 477 Kit 12.1:1
Stage 2 Hot Cams
Quadified Ported Head
Port Matched Intake
No lid on filter
HRC jetting and Neddle
Big Gun Full exhaust
Rekluse

4th Quad 2007
+3 Crank
CW +3 cylinder Kit 12.1:1
Hot Cams Stage 3
Stock Head
HRC Head pipe with White Brothers Exhuast
Stock carb other then jetting
Stock Clutched

All 4 quads run side beside each other. Is the carb holding them back from making a big difference in each quad? The 05 is my XC quad so I dont need it to make 60hp and wear me out for 2hrs, but the other three are weekend quads, that get drag raced and beat on through the woods. I really thought we would have saw a noticable difference in one of them with the ported heads VS stock head.

Thoughts?

 

[Morgan]

Hey Morgan, I was wondering about the ESR intakes. I've read where shortning/ cutting the intake will help get the air right going into the carb. Is this intakes legnth change with the differant engine combos or is it kinda a standard legnth. How do you tell how much to cut off? I have a modded esr but don't know how much to trim. thanks guy!

Intake length plays the same roll as moving the carb closer and further away from the head. Generally, the shorter you make the intake, the more over rev the bike will have. But keep in mind 4 strokes like to have a certain amount of stored volume in the intake track. Usually you would cut an intake about an inch at a time.

We do not use the ESR intakes. The 04/05 boot with DASA ring and filter on the 04/05, and the FCI intakes on the 06+. Those combos will yield the most power, and best overall AF curve.

 

[Morgan]

I have 4 450's that I have been apart of putting together.

1st quad -
07 CW 477 kit 12.1:1
Stock Stroke
Ported Head (Rage)
HRC jetting and needle
HRC Cam
No Lid on the filter
HRC Head pipe w/White Brothers Exhaust
Rekluse

2nd Quad 2005
Stock Stroke Stock Bore
Weisco 13.1:1 piston
Hot Cams Stage 2
Stock carb other then jetting
Full Dasa Exhaust
Aftermarket Aluminum air box with uni filter
Rekluse

Quad 3 2007
Stock Stroke
CW 477 Kit 12.1:1
Stage 2 Hot Cams
Quadified Ported Head
Port Matched Intake
No lid on filter
HRC jetting and Neddle
Big Gun Full exhaust
Rekluse

4th Quad 2007
+3 Crank
CW +3 cylinder Kit 12.1:1
Hot Cams Stage 3
Stock Head
HRC Head pipe with White Brothers Exhuast
Stock carb other then jetting
Stock Clutched

All 4 quads run side beside each other. Is the carb holding them back from making a big difference in each quad? The 05 is my XC quad so I dont need it to make 60hp and wear me out for 2hrs, but the other three are weekend quads, that get drag raced and beat on through the woods. I really thought we would have saw a noticable difference in one of them with the ported heads VS stock head.

Thoughts?

Hondas are all about the right combo. In my opinion each bike has 2 it 3 items holding the combo back. Bike #1, the small HRC cam, small carb, pipe are holding it back. Bike #3, I'm not familiar with Quadified, so I can't say if the head is holding it back or not, but the small carb, pipe, and possibly Recluse are. I know the Recluse has its purpose, but as far as making power outside the woods, I'm not a fan of them. Bike #4, we do not use or recommend +3 or any stroker cranks on 06+ motors. They are sprint motors compared to 04-05 motors. The crank, stock head, stock carb, pipe are holding it back.

Did you happen to set the deck height on all the big bore kits? Little things like that start to add up over time. To be honest, all the bikes except your XC bike should be at 60+ HP easily.

 

[Junk94]

Hondas are all about the right combo. In my opinion each bike has 2 it 3 items holding the combo back. Bike #1, the small HRC cam, small carb, pipe are holding it back. Bike #3, I'm not familiar with Quadified, so I can't say if the head is holding it back or not, but the small carb, pipe, and possibly Recluse are. I know the Recluse has its purpose, but as far as making power outside the woods, I'm not a fan of them. Bike #4, we do not use or recommend +3 or any stroker cranks on 06+ motors. They are sprint motors compared to 04-05 motors. The crank, stock head, stock carb, pipe are holding it back.

Did you happen to set the deck height on all the big bore kits? Little things like that start to add up over time. To be honest, all the bikes except your XC bike should be at 60+ HP easily.

On bikes 1 and 3 care to give any advise on what parts to use? None of the bikes have been on a dyno, so I dont have any idea what they are making to be honest.

 

[junkie]

Raptor 700 Desert bike:

Kenz +2 head, Kenz cam
Kenz SB 12:1 CP, SS
+2 TB, FCI w/ box
PCV, Dyna w/ Kenz curve
Slingshot
15/37, 22" tire, +2 axle

I'm coming up short on RPM in 5th. I bounce off the limiter in 1st & 2nd almost as soon as I put it in gear. 3rd and 4th feel pretty good. I feel like I'm leaving something on the table in 5th though. I can't gear it shorter because the first 3 gears will go through too fast. It feels like I'm not pulling more than 5000 in 5th. I can't hit the limiter in 4th either but it revs out to where I'm comfortable with it.

Am I not getting enough fuel, as in a bigger injector might be needed? Is it set-up in the ignition maybe? Anything you'd do differently?

 

[manny530]

looks like morgan is gunna be busy lol

 

[alanbmx]

I have a 08 TRX450er, Dasa, HRC cam, K&N no lid, dyno tuned to 47HP, what would it take to get 55 hp, on pump gas? Can that be done with the HRC cam?

 

[Morgan]

Raptor 700 Desert bike:

Kenz +2 head, Kenz cam
Kenz SB 12:1 CP, SS
+2 TB, FCI w/ box
PCV, Dyna w/ Kenz curve
Slingshot
15/37, 22" tire, +2 axle

I'm coming up short on RPM in 5th. I bounce off the limiter in 1st & 2nd almost as soon as I put it in gear. 3rd and 4th feel pretty good. I feel like I'm leaving something on the table in 5th though. I can't gear it shorter because the first 3 gears will go through too fast. It feels like I'm not pulling more than 5000 in 5th. I can't hit the limiter in 4th either but it revs out to where I'm comfortable with it.

Am I not getting enough fuel, as in a bigger injector might be needed? Is it set-up in the ignition maybe? Anything you'd do differently?

Start with unplugging the speed sensor if you haven't. It will retard timing in 5th gear on the 700s. The sensor is on the down slope of the cases on the left rear.

After that, I would look towards the tuning. Has the bike been dyno tuned?

 

[Morgan]

I have a 08 TRX450er, Dasa, HRC cam, K&N no lid, dyno tuned to 47HP, what would it take to get 55 hp, on pump gas? Can that be done with the HRC cam?

We do not use HRC cams. All of our heads are more biased to more aggressive cams, with the HC2 being the absolute smallest cam we would use. With our CNC head, a HC2, and the rest if your combo it will make 55 on pump gas easily. Closer to 60 with a CP piston, 208 and FCI intake.

 

[Morgan]

On bikes 1 and 3 care to give any advise on what parts to use? None of the bikes have been on a dyno, so I dont have any idea what they are making to be honest.

HC2 is the smallest cam we run, that will give some more over the HRC cams. We run at least 42.5 for size on the FCRs. That will gain throughout the power curve, and will yield more over rev. Setting the deck heights to .040 will gain some. We run DASA pipes on 90% of our builds. The Rage head should be just fine, but again I know nothing of Quadified, first I've heard of them so unsure if that head is holding that build back.

 

[junkie]

Start with unplugging the speed sensor if you haven't. It will retard timing in 5th gear on the 700s. The sensor is on the down slope of the cases on the left rear.

After that, I would look towards the tuning. Has the bike been dyno tuned?

I unplugged it about 4 years ago but I haven't checked it since it came back from Kenz, I'll peep it.

Dyno tuned at Kenz.

 

[yfz450~bence]

^^^ I thought that unplugging the 700 didnt work. Could be wrong about it needing a ground to tell it to rev past a certain speed. but then again i thought the dyna ignition takes care of all that.......

 

[ghott]

Assume 2004/2005 TRX450R for below:

What clutch components (fibers/steels, basket) do you use on an upper 50's/lower 60's HP stock bore bike, without a lock out?

What clutch springs do you use on an upper 50's/lower 60's HP stock bore bike, without a lock out?