Logic and emotion, felt like ranting.

[Jhony5]

So johny, you feared teh loss of your freedoms....

Can we truly seperate logic and emotion in teh human condition?

Why to we seek to survive? Logical need to exist? or fear of not surviving.....



OOO that waskily wabbit

As my nigga Spock would say, "emotion is illogical". Survival is a strong mix of the two. Other aspects of life are going to lean one way or the other. Death for instance. Logic tells us that we are going to die and cease to exist. Emotion is going to try and make us believe that somehow we will live forever. Lets try not bring religion into this cuz we know where that will get us.
Death sparks emotion more than any other occurence. Whether its just the thought of mortality or the pain of losing a loved one.

 

[tizz]

Yes but before society told us death was bad and that there was something to fear in it, it was embraced. All you have to do is look at teh native cultures around the world to see how death is embraced and not feared. It is not religion but culture and society. Logic is that we no longer exist on this plain and that our body returns to the earth and that there is an energy that cannot be explained. Emotions we feel are based on both our experience and our society

 

[Gentilhomme]

Well you'll note that the little native cultures are 'cultures'. this means that they too are conditioned en-masse to not fear death. Fear of death is a curse layed upon humans by the very thing that seperated us form our ancestors; the ability to plan ahead. We know its coming and our main instinct is to survive so it therefore sends that into panic mode, almost as if a tiger were nibbling at our ankles we know that sooner or later time will end us, like the tiger it threatens our life and it is therefore feared. However some people find comfort in their end or rather are comfortable with it. This is where logic, conditioning, comes into play. We don't want to be unhappy and therefore logic dictates that we must give the boot to such fear.

 

[tizz]

I don't know if I fear death from teh tiger or pain.... I think If a tiger were nibbling at my ankles and death were inevitable it would be a reliefe no?

 

[Crispy Critter]

Philosophy is the coldest clinical method of thought and I find this guy intriguing. http://home.nvg.org/~aga/stories/enchiridion.html if you read and can follow the guide you are a better man than me. He helps you pre plan emotion and dismiss things you would usually allow to upset you. Can everyone enjoy this almost 2,000 year old thinking, guess not but it will give you pause.

 

[tizz]

Wait, didn't johny or someone post that the other day????? Or was that another forum?

As for philosophy, without philosophical thinkers, there would be little progress anywhere. It is the ones who live on teh fringe, dreaming up new avenues of thought that push the mainstream to new heights.

 

[Gentilhomme]

I don't know if I fear death from teh tiger or pain.... I think If a tiger were nibbling at my ankles and death were inevitable it would be a reliefe no?

Well when the folks on TV are fleeiing form perile or various knids are they Screaming "NO NO, i don't want to sustain injury!!" or are they screaming "I DON"T WANT TO DIE"

to live is our main drive, hell we've an entire section of the nervous system beyond our control dedicated to sustaining function. (Autonomic, this is where reflexs come from, increased heart rate during stress etc..) so not only is it mental to stay alive, its chemical. Same reason our immune system kicks in during infection, we can't control that even if we want the disease to kill us.

 

[tizz]

Sure there is instinct to live and breathe, but I would personally prefer death to imense pain. Just a personal thing.

OK truth is all of this fear of life and death, abortion death penalty all of it has to do entirely with what you truly believe of after life and souls. So you can allow logic to step in here. If you believe in NOTHING after death then it is logical to fear death at all cost. If you believe in heaven and hell it also makes sense to at least worry a little about it. So dammit I am back to being unable to seperate emotion and logic. Fark i have to go rethink this damn thing again POOPY!!!!!

Well if death sneeks up on you I think you definately go into panic overthe unknown, but if you are terminal then you have a chance at embracing and accepting death without the same effect. Damn I shouldn't try to get deep when making a mess of my shirt with watermellon LOL

 

[Gentilhomme]

If you're covering yourself in Watermelon you're on the wrong site tizz (don't forget to turn on your webcam )

Firstly come Pain again. ok tizz scenerio; Your swiming happily in the ocean when OPPS, a shark is storming at you. Now it's obvious that you don't have a chance in hell of out-swimming it so do you A) Swim towards it because 'better head first then legs first' or B) swim away in a useless effort to survive. Now the choice you make right now may be 'A' but honestly, in the acual situation your gonna try your damnest to stay alive. Hel, rememebr that guy who got is arm pinned by a bolder few years back, he used his dull pocket knife to chopp his arm off and retunr home People are ment to survive.

But like i was saying earlier, many of our instincts can be 'socilized' down/up. So if you've been believing that you're going to go to heaven after you die then as you die then thats going to calm you down a bit because you are so damn convinced that you're not accually dying, so why would you fear it? Also, as one who dosn't believe in Heaven, i'm not exactly scared either. Whys that? Because i'm quite certain that after i die my concisness will end and i couldn't possibly give a damn about being dead now could i? Our concise does have SOME control over instinct (EG: forcing yourself to touch a hot burner, AND HOLD IT THERE!) but the more stressful the siituation the less control we have over these self-sustaining reactions, this is why i Say when you get down to the nitty-griddy, Emotion rules us.

 

[tizz]

I will give you my first thought on your hypothetical there. I am single mom and anytime someone writes me into one of those the first thing that goes through my mind is my daughter being left to grow up with her abusive father. I would beat the crap out of the shark simply for the sake of my daughter. All of my fears of death at this moment in my life lie with my daughter being abandoned and alone. HELL NO that's not gonna happen as long as I can help it!!!! MAn it always surprises me how it effects me to even think about it for one second!!! Of course I would also fight because I have yet to step foot in Ireland or Australia

 

[Gentilhomme]

Ha, indeed. but that comes back to one of my first points; Kids are the untimate emotional controler. Yah my past couple have sadi death, but i don't have kids so i'm usually coming from that perspective but indeed, procreation and survival of offspring is Number One in most books (again, that can be ****ed with thorugh experience) but it is a wrench.

Instinct with others is another supporter of my 'Emotion rules you' argument. EG: Me and my friend Chessie are our for a Pic-Nik. just then A WOLF JUMPS OUT AND DEMANDS OUR PIN-NIC BASKET!!! (and our lives) Now being the male, i just feel the near uncontrolable urge to step up and fight wolfy, like its my duty, but i couldn't help it. (well, if i really wanted to maybe, but i would) Now were it me and my Pal Dave in the same situation then we'd tag-team his ass. Now in reality, Chessie is a Excellent Martial Artist and Dave is a smelly Hippy, so she would really be more effective but since she's a SHE, my 'I am MAN" drive would hold me to protection. Its similar to protecting you mate, or a less extreme version of child defence.

Lastly i'ld like to take note that your especial anger in your situation is an example of Amplified emotion through experience. Not only is it a "My poor kid" but you've a Jackass factor that'll **** with your mind and make you more defensvie.

Sorry to hear about the by the way

 

[tizz]

I definately agree with the jackass factor LOL

Anyway we have to bring this back out of the world of hypotheticals and back to the world of intelligent discussion LOL. I actually forget where we were HEHE