Fighting teen pregnancy

[timesjoke]

So typical.

Yes Ali, you do keep dragging men into any discussion about anything you see as negative negative concerning women in general.

Your like the drowning person who desperately grabs at someone else in the water and you drown them too. Men do not control your actions in any way, shape, or form so why do you keep trying to drag men into the discussion? Women are not blind robots, I know you do not see women in that way so your attempt to say men are just as responsible as women for controlling a woman's reproductive system is lame, very lame.

You refuse to answer that question becuase you do not have an answer, so you turn to this,,,,,,well whatever you want to call this out of control explosion your so fond of performing whenever someone is not intimidated by you enough to drop a line of discussion you find difficult to talk about.

If you find it difficult to answer a simple question of why some girls/women have difficulty controling their reproductive system fine, just don't respond, but if your only trying to distract and force attention away from that question then I will simply keep asking the question until it reaches this point of you being ******.

Anger stops your ability to think, you cannot get me angry so I will keep in mind my original question that you have never answered.

At the end of the day we agree on many subjects and I find you to be a very smart and funny person. You just have a thorn in your paw on subjects like this and you do not use logic or reason in these discussions.

These subjects are WAR for you. I understand this but I will not run away in fear of your anger, if you find it impossible to control yourself in discussions of this nature maybe you should avoid them.

As far as my pm goes you know darn well I was talking about your trend to make personal attacks and even attack my family with lies when your upset. You called Tami all sorts of nasty names in your attempt to strike out at me. You made up all sorts of lies just to try and bother me.

I can bother you without ever telling a lie as you love to do when your striking out but I also told you I wanted to avoid that arena if possible.

I guess it is up to you, as usual I will simply follow your lead and respond accordingly.

Remember, I have reached out to you over and over again, I compliment you on things we agree on and even offer you my respect and well wishes when your involved in something bad you share. Between the two of us, I am the only one trying to show you some kidness as well.

You have only ever showed me neutral and bad, never one shread of good.

 

[eddo]

blah blah blah, same old TJ crappola

Maybe if you would stop speaking for everyone else and focus on what you have to offer the discussion, things wouldn't get so **** frustrating.

just something to think about.

 

[timesjoke]

Maybe if you would stop speaking for everyone else and focus on what you have to offer the discussion, things wouldn't get so **** frustrating.
just something to think about.

I don't eddo, but I do ask the hard questions and make valid points.

Look at any discussion involving women taking responsibility for themselves and there is also Ali trying to attach men to the problem.

I will keep this simple, why is **** relivant? Ali decided to bring that into the conversation why? How many teen girls are watching professional ****? Then ask how many of these same girls are exposed to women's magazines that are pushing these attitudes?

With Ali she tries to 'muddy the water' with things that have no real impact on the conversation just to keep her from admitting that there has been a fundamental degrading of attitudes with the average female tword controlling their reproductive functions.

Look at all the things she has posted, do you see anywhere where she says a woman is responsible for her own body without also mentioning something negative about males?

Now boys don't feel that pressure so they remain free to impregnate another girl...and another...and another...

Here is an example of how Ali deflects, she says boys are just going from girl to girl getting them pregnant, like the girls are just helpless victims of boys.

I am the guy saying girls are not just victims, that they are strong enough to stand on their own feet and be responsible for themselves. I do not believe for a second any boy can get a girl pregnant unless the girl wants to get pregnant.

 

[RoyalOrleans]

Grass on turf... PLAY BALL!

 

[Ahhlee]

So typical.
Yes Ali, you do keep dragging men into any discussion about anything you see as negative negative concerning women in general.

Your like the drowning person who desperately grabs at someone else in the water and you drown them too. Men do not control your actions in any way, shape, or form so why do you keep trying to drag men into the discussion? Women are not blind robots, I know you do not see women in that way so your attempt to say men are just as responsible as women for controlling a woman's reproductive system is lame, very lame.

You refuse to answer that question becuase you do not have an answer, so you turn to this,,,,,,well whatever you want to call this out of control explosion your so fond of performing whenever someone is not intimidated by you enough to drop a line of discussion you find difficult to talk about.

If you find it difficult to answer a simple question of why some girls/women have difficulty controling their reproductive system fine, just don't respond, but if your only trying to distract and force attention away from that question then I will simply keep asking the question until it reaches this point of you being ******.

Anger stops your ability to think, you cannot get me angry so I will keep in mind my original question that you have never answered.

I've answered your questions a thousand times over. You're simply not getting the response you want to hear. Well guess what, TJ...I have a different opinion than you do and that's not going to change any time soon.

At the end of the day we agree on many subjects and I find you to be a very smart and funny person. You just have a thorn in your paw on subjects like this and you do not use logic or reason in these discussions.

Oh really? I believe I was doing just fine as far as logic and reason are concerned. Perhaps if you would stop insulting people's intelligence, beliefs and personal values rather than discussing the topic at hand, you might garner better results.

These subjects are WAR for you. I understand this but I will not run away in fear of your anger, if you find it impossible to control yourself in discussions of this nature maybe you should avoid them.

Maybe you should avoid being such a complete and utter douchebag. Just a thought.

As far as my pm goes you know darn well I was talking about your trend to make personal attacks and even attack my family with lies when your upset. You called Tami all sorts of nasty names in your attempt to strike out at me. You made up all sorts of lies just to try and bother me.

What is it with you and your "lies". Everybody is telling "lies". You're like the little boy who cried "LIES!".

You really need to learn the difference between a disagreement and a lie. Until then, you're just making yourself look dumb and overly dramatic.

And I don't know d!ck about your personal life other that what you've openly shared on the boards. Frankly, TJ, I don't find you or yours interesting enough to sit around and dream up elaborate lies about you. Sorry to disappoint.

I can bother you without ever telling a lie as you love to do when your striking out but I also told you I wanted to avoid that arena if possible.

Oh now it's "bother me". Before it was "break me". Interesting.

I guess it is up to you, as usual I will simply follow your lead and respond accordingly.

Go fukk yourself. How's that for a lead? Now feel free to follow.

Remember, I have reached out to you over and over again, I compliment you on things we agree on and even offer you my respect and well wishes when your involved in something bad you share. Between the two of us, I am the only one trying to show you some kidness as well.
You have only ever showed me neutral and bad, never one shread of good.

What the fukk do you want from me? Romantic weekends at a B&B? Tickle fights? Tea parties?

We're not meant to be friends, TJ. Again, sorry to disappoint.

........

TJ - What you don't realize about me, because you aren't willing to see beyond what you THINK I am, is that I believe in fairness. If it's a woman being put down unfairly, I will stand up for the women. If it's a man being put down unfairly, I will stand up for the men. Young, old, fat, thin, blonde, brunette...if I truly think you're getting the short end of the stick, I'll stand up for you.

I don't ALWAYS portray women as victims. I don't ALWAYS portray men in a negative light. Stating things in such absolutes just turns people off from discussing things from you. Do you seriously not see that?

You know, I have been hurt in the past. Badly. I have been neglected, hit, shook, shoved, stolen from, verbally abused, and even raped....all at the hands of men. But do I hate men? NO!!!! After all of that, I still love men and prefer to judge them on an individual basis rather than lumping them all into the "fukken jerk" pile. My best friend is male. Many of my close friends are male. I see no reason to demonize the majority based on the deplorable actions of the few. In fact, if you knew me at all, you would know that when a group of my female co-horts start in on a heated man bashing session, I am one of the first to speak up and defend men with a "hey, hey now....they're not all bad!".

Please, for the love of ***, stop saying I think ALL men are negative!!!!!! I don't!

So now all we've accomplished is this thread is completely derailed and you and I are at eachother's throats again.

Ehhh....whatever. Anything I say will be falling on deaf ears anyway so I have nothing further to add to this particular discussion.

 

[ImWithStupid]

I still love men and prefer to judge them on an individual basis rather than lumping them all into the "fukken jerk" pile.

Can I be in the "fukken jerk" pile, please?

My best friend is male. Many of my close friends are male. I see no reason to demonize the majority based on the deplorable actions of the few. In fact, if you knew me at all, you would know that when a group of my female co-horts start in on a heated man bashing session, I am one of the first to speak up and defend men with a "hey, hey now....they're not all bad!".

That doesn't sound like the language of a man hating banshee, to me.

 

[timesjoke]

I've answered your questions a thousand times over. You're simply not getting the response you want to hear. Well guess what, TJ...I have a different opinion than you do and that's not going to change any time soon.

No you have not, let me give you one example out of the many:

Q - What man tells you what to do?

A - None, but I'm not a teenager. Isn't that what we're debating here? Teenage pregnancy?

Q - True, and again, when you were a teenager were you a brainless robot doing anything a boy told you to do even not using birth control because a boy told you not to?

A - ................NO ANSWER....................

You rarely answer a direct question, you dodge and change the subject instead.

Oh really? I believe I was doing just fine as far as logic and reason are concerned. Perhaps if you would stop insulting people's intelligence, beliefs and personal values rather than discussing the topic at hand, you might garner better results.

No not really, again I admit your a very smart girl and you use that to twist and turn topics away from the intended discussion, but I keep you on track and when you do not successfully derail me away from the questions you do not want to answer.....we get this.

Again, why is anyone besides a women responsible for a woman's reproductive system? You have not made the case as to why you feel men are just as responsible for controlling women as the women themselves.

Maybe you should avoid being such a complete and utter douchebag. Just a thought.

Well there you are again with the name calling, good way to make my point for me.

If your angry, your the one with the problems, not me. These are just words over a computer world, nothing personal in either direction. Why do you feel you have to pound me into submission?

What is it with you and your "lies". Everybody is telling "lies". You're like the little boy who cried "LIES!".

You really need to learn the difference between a disagreement and a lie. Until then, you're just making yourself look dumb and overly dramatic.

And I don't know d!ck about your personal life other that what you've openly shared on the boards. Frankly, TJ, I don't find you or yours interesting enough to sit around and dream up elaborate lies about you. Sorry to disappoint.

Oh bull Ali, you have been just as involved in calling Tami a *****, brainless bimbo, etc as anyone else. You take what I have shared, twist it into a lie and spout it out for only one reason, to try and hurt me.

You have gone out of your way to strike out at me hundreds of time and yet here I am, still trying to figure out how to get you to stop these nasty tactics. I do not hold grudges or anger but I do remember.

Oh now it's "bother me". Before it was "break me". Interesting.

Do we get into what you have called me? You want to compare nasty comments Ali?

The pm you sent me in reply to my pm was fairly nice, clearly then you did not think my pm was a threat but "NOW" you need a crutch for some sympathy or something so your using that. Why are you so weak and needing protection from the big bad Times now?

All I am saying is be consistent, if you thought it was okay enough to send me a pretty nice pm in return, obviously I was not threatening you, you would not have held back if you saw it that way then.

Go fukk yourself. How's that for a lead? Now feel free to follow.

Well there is a nasty comment right there, how many times have I said that kind of thing to you in comparison Ali? I believe you have me at about 10,000/1.

What the fukk do you want from me? Romantic weekends at a B&B? Tickle fights? Tea parties?

We're not meant to be friends, TJ. Again, sorry to disappoint.

No Ali, you know what my point was.

I try very hard to show you I do not hold grudges and to treat you with respect, you do not do the same thing tword me. You have never shown me one speck of respect.

TJ - What you don't realize about me, because you aren't willing to see beyond what you THINK I am, is that I believe in fairness. If it's a woman being put down unfairly, I will stand up for the women. If it's a man being put down unfairly, I will stand up for the men. Young, old, fat, thin, blonde, brunette...if I truly think you're getting the short end of the stick, I'll stand up for you.

Ya, I saw that from you both here and at the jungle when I was being **********.......wait that was you in the middle running the *********, and it was you running the ******** against other people as well...........how fair is that Ali?

Was it fair for you to call Tami bad names Ali? Fair?

I don't ALWAYS portray women as victims. I don't ALWAYS portray men in a negative light. Stating things in such absolutes just turns people off from discussing things from you. Do you seriously not see that?

You don't?

Now boys don't feel that pressure so they remain free to impregnate another girl...and another...and another...

What specific 'boys' were you talking about then being as you never use general blanket statements against males?

My point to you is you make up excuses instead of casting blame, you rarely say anything negative about actions of girls/women without figuring out a way to drag men into the blame. You even tried to drag in **** and claim men were horrible for "the objectification of women" and it was a mans business. Teen girls are not exposed to professional ****, but they are exposed to millions of women's magazines and women's shows that effect them greatly.

You know, I have been hurt in the past. Badly. I have been neglected, hit, shook, shoved, stolen from, verbally abused, and even raped....all at the hands of men. But do I hate men? NO!!!! After all of that, I still love men and prefer to judge them on an individual basis rather than lumping them all into the "fukken jerk" pile. My best friend is male. Many of my close friends are male. I see no reason to demonize the majority based on the deplorable actions of the few. In fact, if you knew me at all, you would know that when a group of my female co-horts start in on a heated man bashing session, I am one of the first to speak up and defend men with a "hey, hey now....they're not all bad!".

You never defended me even once.

But I fall into the jerk category right? Anything done to me is justified because I do not conform to what Ali deems is the 'right' frame of mind for a man?

I get the feeling that while you may not hate all men, only certain men who conform are allowed to be around you, are you the Alpha?

Again, I have not said you always blame men for everything, just that if there is any discussion concerning the decline in moral standards with women you "ALWAYS" drag men into it with excuses of how men are equally at fault for what women do.

And, I ask again, how is it a man must be responsible for a woman's reproductive system?

Please, for the love of ***, stop saying I think ALL men are negative!!!!!! I don't!

Easy request, because I have never said that, I said you drag men into these conversations to direct attention away from women and diminish blame placed on women for their actions.

So now all we've accomplished is this thread is completely derailed and you and I are at eachother's throats again.

I am not at your throat.

Where have I lost my cool?

Where is my name calling and flames Ali?

What has been accomplished is you once again losing "YOUR" cool and going after my throat. How many times did you invite me to the flame forum at the jungle and call me coward before I decided to give you your shot Ali? 3, 4, 5 times? I do not like this stuff, but clearly you do.

I wrote you that pm asking for peace, I say in the open forum I want peace and I back that desire for peace with not behaving in an out of control and hate driven way. I again ask you to do the same.

Ehhh....whatever. Anything I say will be falling on deaf ears anyway so I have nothing further to add to this particular discussion.

Deaf ears Ali?

I listen more to your words than you would believe. I see our situation as a strange one because I really do respect you in many ways but this element of never allowing a discussion about women without dragging men into it so you can cast some blame on men for what women do is a tad confusing to me when I know how smart you really are.

Women are not robots to men, why do you keep trying to paint women as weak brainless victims of men?

I see women as independant of men in all ways.

Your not a victim Ali......why are you so fast to claim other females are?

If they are victims then I would have to say it is from other women, not men.

 

[emkay64]

Well then TJ...if you do believe men have no responsibility and women are 100% responsible for their "reproductive systems" and men hold no blame or responsibility because of their high *** drives...then they should have zero responsibility in the care of a child, or choice in their general well being. If it's all up to the women in the conception arena, then basically you are saying men are just glorified sperm donors. I respect men more than that. Enough to include them in the decision making process. If a man should be considered at all, there needs to be some responsibility before the fact too.

It's a contradiction. In the post about the casual *** encounter you felt the man needed to be told about the child (as did I)...but if it's all up to her in the *** department...in my mind he shouldn't expect to be included in any decisions regarding the female "reproductive system" after the fact either.

BTW I'm playing devil's advocate here...don't get all preachy and in an attack mode. I'm just needing you to clarify how you reason this out.

You are correct though. Women are responsible for using birth control and not getting pregnant..their bodies..need to be protected etc. I'm just saying the pressures exerted on teen females with hormones etc...do not make the best decision makers. Boys need to be take some responsibility too. I agree in adulthood...sure I'll bring the protection cause I know better. However teenage girls...oy vey....I'm amazed that some can count...never mind make appropriate decisions regarding ***.

 

[timesjoke]

Well then TJ...if you do believe men have no responsibility and women are 100% responsible for their "reproductive systems" and men hold no blame or responsibility because of their high *** drives...then they should have zero responsibility in the care of a child, or choice in their general well being. If it's all up to the women in the conception arena, then basically you are saying men are just glorified sperm donors. I respect men more than that. Enough to include them in the decision making process. If a man should be considered at all, there needs to be some responsibility before the fact too.

As usual my points are in responsibility.

Even Snaf agreed women flaunt their sexuality in extremes sometimes, let's consider the thong bikini for example.

I am not saying men are not part of the situation, but most are not informed enough about the woman's body to be making an informed decision. How does a man know if the woman is on the pill or not? If he asks and she says yes, should he trust her? There are complicated issues like where is she on her cycle, how can a man possibly know enough about the woman to be making an informed decision?

I hold men responsible for their part, they decided to not use a johnny hat and they deserve to be held responsible for the creation of the life just like the woman, but each have different results of their responsibility. Equally responsible, but their on different ends of the same teeter totter.

Only a woman can get pregnent, so the larger responsibility for controlling that falls on her, the man must be ready to offer support for the child should one get created.

It's a contradiction. In the post about the casual *** encounter you felt the man needed to be told about the child (as did I)...but if it's all up to her in the *** department...in my mind he shouldn't expect to be included in any decisions regarding the female "reproductive system" after the fact either.

Well that is the way it is now, men have zero say in the abortion process, women have said they do not want men to have any rights in the child creating process. Even the legal system forces men to get court orders to have the right to visit their own children but women are given custody on the spot.

Right now, by laws and the attitudes of the average woman, men are nothing more than sperm donors and ATM machines.

I said the woman had a responsibility in telling the man he created a life and I also said the lady had a responsibility to her child to tell the child the truth and to offer the most support possible in raising the child, I never, not once said the man had any rights, so no contradiction.

The only possible contradiction claim you may be able to come up with is my possition of abortion where I believe a man should be allowed to block the murder of his child, but I have never said a man should be in control of a woman's reproductive prevention, that system belongs to the woman and she has 100% of the choice in how that system functions and if she wants to protect it or not.

BTW I'm playing devil's advocate here...don't get all preachy and in an attack mode. I'm just needing you to clarify how you reason this out.

There is nothing wrong with your questions emkay, I love this kind of give and take, I only have issues when people like Ali have to make personal attacks. Did you see how she turned the saying my grandmother had about giving away the milk into a chance to again take a shot at Tami? She asked about my "cow", but again, I expect that out of her.

You are correct though. Women are responsible for using birth control and not getting pregnant..their bodies..need to be protected etc. I'm just saying the pressures exerted on teen females with hormones etc...do not make the best decision makers. Boys need to be take some responsibility too. I agree in adulthood...sure I'll bring the protection cause I know better. However teenage girls...oy vey....I'm amazed that some can count...never mind make appropriate decisions regarding ***.

Okay, now finally a woman without a huge chip on her shoulder and not afraid to say women have some responsibility in controlling their own internal functions, thank you very much emkay.

Really, thanks.

Now, if we compare girls of 100 years ago to girls of today can we agree that both had the exact same hormones? I would say we can agree that as a given so that should not be an element to consider what the change is in behaviors.

So what is it?

Protection today is ten times better and more widely available, education of girls is a million times better, my older sisters said their only source of information was our mother and other girls, sometimes other mothers of her friends but today we have very specific *** classes in all schools starting in elementary school. There is products on all the shelves in almost every store and there is the internet for very detailed information for all girls to see if they have questions they do not want to ask friends or family.

So better educated, better and more reliable methods of protection are available, but girls today get pregnant more often.......I place it mostly on attitude, what do you think it is?

 

[emkay64]

As usual my points are in responsibility.
Even Snaf agreed women flaunt their sexuality in extremes sometimes, let's consider the thong bikini for example.

I am not saying men are not part of the situation, but most are not informed enough about the woman's body to be making an informed decision. How does a man know if the woman is on the pill or not? If he asks and she says yes, should he trust her? There are complicated issues like where is she on her cycle, how can a man possibly know enough about the woman to be making an informed decision?

I hold men responsible for their part, they decided to not use a johnny hat and they deserve to be held responsible for the creation of the life just like the woman, but each have different results of their responsibility. Equally responsible, but their on different ends of the same teeter totter.

Only a woman can get pregnent, so the larger responsibility for controlling that falls on her, the man must be ready to offer support for the child should one get created.

Well that is the way it is now, men have zero say in the abortion process, women have said they do not want men to have any rights in the child creating process. Even the legal system forces men to get court orders to have the right to visit their own children but women are given custody on the spot.

Right now, by laws and the attitudes of the average woman, men are nothing more than sperm donors and ATM machines.

I said the woman had a responsibility in telling the man he created a life and I also said the lady had a responsibility to her child to tell the child the truth and to offer the most support possible in raising the child, I never, not once said the man had any rights, so no contradiction.

The only possible contradiction claim you may be able to come up with is my possition of abortion where I believe a man should be allowed to block the murder of his child, but I have never said a man should be in control of a woman's reproductive prevention, that system belongs to the woman and she has 100% of the choice in how that system functions and if she wants to protect it or not.

There is nothing wrong with your questions emkay, I love this kind of give and take, I only have issues when people like Ali have to make personal attacks. Did you see how she turned the saying my grandmother had about giving away the milk into a chance to again take a shot at Tami? She asked about my "cow", but again, I expect that out of her.

Okay, now finally a woman without a huge chip on her shoulder and not afraid to say women have some responsibility in controlling their own internal functions, thank you very much emkay.

Really, thanks.

Now, if we compare girls of 100 years ago to girls of today can we agree that both had the exact same hormones? I would say we can agree that as a given so that should not be an element to consider what the change is in behaviors.

So what is it?

Protection today is ten times better and more widely available, education of girls is a million times better, my older sisters said their only source of information was our mother and other girls, sometimes other mothers of her friends but today we have very specific *** classes in all schools starting in elementary school. There is products on all the shelves in almost every store and there is the internet for very detailed information for all girls to see if they have questions they do not want to ask friends or family.

So better educated, better and more reliable methods of protection are available, but girls today get pregnant more often.......I place it mostly on attitude, what do you think it is?

I agree girls are the same. I agree with everything you said. I feel the responsibility lies with parents in the teaching of values anyways. I just think that boys need some tutoring too. Ehh in actuality teens are hard to gauge...some do well with the pressure and some just buckle. Instilling confidence is key...being comfortable to say no. I agree men have stronger *** drives absolutely...but when I was a teen...*** was not mental...I mean...it felt good and I didn't really care where we did it. It's definitely more mental as an adult though.

Girls haven't changed...but times sure have. Family isn't as important. I don't agree with throwing money at a problem. Never will. If it's going to get better it starts at the roots. Until parents take more responsibility in the parenting arena instead of letting magazines, boys, peers and the media in general do the value instilling....then teen pregnancy will only get worse. I don't believe that society as a whole can do much to change any of that unfortunately. Yes birth control is more accessible, but when some teens are embarrassed to buy a box of tampons, they probably won't be so comfortable going for the other stuff. BTW I would never trust a gas station condom either lol.

Bottom line...strong core values, confidence and self-worth...most don't have them. I think that's it.

BTW...your last post is pretty much exactly what Ali meant I'm sure of it. It had a lot more tact and was not accusatory. It's a welcome form of debate

 

[RoyalOrleans]

What were we talking about?

 

[emkay64]

What were we talking about?

Is it true that cannibals won't eat clowns because they taste funny?

Discuss.

 

[eddo]

Is it true that cannibals won't eat clowns because they taste funny?
Discuss.

I brought this up to my friend, Pete, who is a cannibal, and he just threw his arms up in disgust and walked off.

leaving them there....

 

[emkay64]

I brought this up to my friend, Pete, who is a cannibal, and he just threw his arms up in disgust and walked off.







leaving them there....

Awww...must be a sore spot .

Maybe we should discuss what kind of an idiot puts an "s" in the word "lisp"?

 

[Ahhlee]

BTW...your last post is pretty much exactly what Ali meant I'm sure of it. It had a lot more tact and was not accusatory. It's a welcome form of debate

Spot on. This is why we're soul mates.

What were we talking about?

Thumbtacks?

Is it true that cannibals won't eat clowns because they taste funny?
Discuss.

Clowns are evil and seek to enslave and molest us all! What is it with this clown kick you folks are on lately?

ICKY!!!!

I brought this up to my friend, Pete, who is a cannibal, and he just threw his arms up in disgust and walked off.
leaving them there....

Is his real name Peter? Do you giggle when you say "Peter"?

Cuz I do.

 

[timesjoke]

I agree girls are the same. I agree with everything you said. I feel the responsibility lies with parents in the teaching of values anyways. I just think that boys need some tutoring too. Ehh in actuality teens are hard to gauge...some do well with the pressure and some just buckle. Instilling confidence is key...being comfortable to say no. I agree men have stronger *** drives absolutely...but when I was a teen...*** was not mental...I mean...it felt good and I didn't really care where we did it. It's definitely more mental as an adult though.

In the perfect world yes parents do everything right and stay together so there are two loving and attentive parents raising a child and that child is filled with confidence and support to make good decisions.....but that is not reality and we need to sometimes look past what we would like to see and see what is really there.

We have working single moms trying to handle the responsibility of two parents all by herself.........good intentions or bad, that does not leave much time to raise a child.

Girls haven't changed...but times sure have. Family isn't as important. I don't agree with throwing money at a problem. Never will. If it's going to get better it starts at the roots. Until parents take more responsibility in the parenting arena instead of letting magazines, boys, peers and the media in general do the value instilling....then teen pregnancy will only get worse. I don't believe that society as a whole can do much to change any of that unfortunately.

Well I do not agree with just giving up. We are going to throw money at the problem no matter what we do. If we do nothing we have massive increases in Welfare, if we instead offer incentives for things like paid college.....well maybe we can get a taxpayer out of the deal.....

Maybe?

Yes birth control is more accessible, but when some teens are embarrassed to buy a box of tampons, they probably won't be so comfortable going for the other stuff. BTW I would never trust a gas station condom either lol.

I do not agree, my son just got married and I have been debating this topic with them and some of their friends. I am considered a "cool" dad and accepted by the group because I tell them from the start I have responsibilities as a parent but I still remember what it was like to be a teenager.

They all agree that there is no embarassment in *** anymore. They all buy condoms and pills without any negative feelings at all. When I ask these teens why so many girls get pregnant to the girls do you know what every girl has told me?

Because they want to get pregnant. This is not me talking, it is 15 to 19 year old girls all saying that they know what causes pregnancy and how to prevent it and any girl getting pregnant is doing so on purpose.

Bottom line...strong core values, confidence and self-worth...most don't have them. I think that's it.

And we do not instill these things into our girls by making excuses for their behaviors and lack of responsibility. Pretty soon they fall into the mindset of the victim, blaming everything they do wrong on someone else.

"It's not my fault, men produce **** and that makes me get pregnant......."

BTW...your last post is pretty much exactly what Ali meant I'm sure of it. It had a lot more tact and was not accusatory. It's a welcome form of debate

That is the way I was posting until Ali tried to insert a bunch of excuses for the girl's behavoirs, blaming **** and saying boys just run around from one girl to the next getting them pregnant trying to attach as much blame on men as possible.

I do not have a problem with Ali, in fact in many ways I like her a lot. My only issue with her is her need to make excuses for anything that paints what she feels is a negative picture of women. When this happens she goes into counter accusation mode trying desperately to drag men into the mess and blame them for what women do.

Still up to this moment Ali has never said women are 100% responsible for controlling their own reproductive system. I asked Ali what man tells her what to do for a reason, she dodged the question because she knows the answer supports my point that no man can stop a girl from using protection.

I like to say how both men and women are equals but men do not possess the skills of manipulation that women do. Men are like clay in the hands of women and pretty much do whatever our women want us to do with few exceptions, and even then I still believe those times are set up by the women too, to let us feel like we revolted when it was really just another form of manipulation by our women, lol.

I do not say this out of bitternes or anything, I simply accept the way things are and how easily men are controlled, but men are just geared to be this way.

 

[emkay64]

"I like to say how both men and women are equals but men do not possess the skills of manipulation that women do. Men are like clay in the hands of women and pretty much do whatever our women want us to do with few exceptions, and even then I still believe those times are set up by the women too, to let us feel like we revolted when it was really just another form of manipulation by our women, lol.

I do not say this out of bitternes or anything, I simply accept the way things are and how easily men are controlled, but men are just geared to be this way."

__________________

I don't agree with this....but I'm not interested in debating it either. This is the sort of statement that can be inflammatory. Lucky for me I'm in a good mood today so I'm relatively unaffected by it, but maybe you could re-read that statement and maybe understand why women get annoyed with your techniques. Sorry TJ...We were doing so good...you just paint a really unflattering picture of women in general. It's difficult not to take offense and argue with you.

You must have really been fukked over by a woman or women in general to hate us all so much. I feel bad for you in that regard. Really...not all of us are manipulative, greedy, man-haters with no values.

 

[ImWithStupid]

I like to say how both men and women are equals but men do not possess the skills of manipulation that women do. Men are like clay in the hands of women and pretty much do whatever our women want us to do with few exceptions, and even then I still believe those times are set up by the women too, to let us feel like we revolted when it was really just another form of manipulation by our women, lol.
I do not say this out of bitternes or anything, I simply accept the way things are and how easily men are controlled, but men are just geared to be this way.

Ah, yes. The old, "It's not my fault because the devil made me do it", defense.

 

[timesjoke]

You must have really been fukked over by a woman or women in general to hate us all so much. I feel bad for you in that regard. Really...not all of us are manipulative, greedy, man-haters with no values.

lol, well yes I have been seriously screwed over by a couple women, and men too, what does that have to do with manipulation?

Are you seriously going to say men are equals to women in that department?

What is the purpose of cutting a man off from *** then emkay?

"Sleeping on the couch" is what?

 

[emkay64]

lol, well yes I have been seriously screwed over by a couple women, and men too, what does that have to do with manipulation?
Are you seriously going to say men are equals to women in that department?

What is the purpose of cutting a man off from *** then emkay?

"Sleeping on the couch" is what?

I've never done the cutting off from *** thing...seriously. I don't believe in that...mostly because that's just punishing me and making me have to get my own hands dirty. Why would I do that? If I'm ******...I'll take the couch...but mostly those things get resolved before bed time.

I refuse things like haircuts, laundry or meal prep...but never ***.