timesjoke

Well they passed it, now the Senate gets into the game again, I wonder how many more "goodies" they can insert into it? Now to see if the voters can remember how arrogant all of these guys are in a few months.........I sure hope so.

Well it is obvious that these votes are purchased, it would be funny as hell if someone can figure out how to prosecute these guys for bribery, technically that is what this is, maybe even blackmail if you think about it.

That is the rules as they are at the time you place your vote, you know that only one of two people can win, trying to pretend that the game is something it is not is f'in retarded.

Even if your right that does not make the things Jimmy did dissapear. We have Obama now because of a splintered conservative movement. This healthcare legislation will not go away even if we get another Ronald Reagan. Reagan did not eliminate social security, or welfare, sure he made some cuts and changes but he still increased spending on wellfare overall and after he was gone it was increased some more, and some more, and some more. Once these entitlements get rooted in, we have them for life.

Well I am not sure what calling people names has to do with if your actions helped Obama get elected or not but let me give you another example of why you should get behind the conservative who can win instead of wasting votes that end up actually helping the liberal. I will use Sarah Palin as an example. You guys pound Sarah Palin over very minor crap, she would be way better for the Country than someone like Obama, but you pound and pound and your fellow independents take up the banner and run with it and before you know it, there is a general dislike for the only person who has some conservative values and can win against the liberal. You also discourage other conservatives from running for office because who would want to be ripped apart from both sides? So by being ugly to anyone who is conservative but not perfect, you restrict the choices to someone who has no possibility of gaining enough popularity to win an election. Sure, you preserve your ideology and "purity" but you lose the war and let the liberals do things like pass this healthcare bill. Will feeling good about your "purity" change the fact that the Government has taken over healthcare? IWS, I don't know why you have a problem understanding the football example, this is the game we have "NOW". Wishful thinking and pouting about what "could" be is irrelivent. We have to play the game with the rules at hand. Getting mad and running off to play baseball leaves your side of the football team weakened and allows the other side an easy win. Your being stubborn and refusing to accept that sometimes you can't get 100% of what you want is actually causing you to lose that 100% then add on another 100% for helping the complete opposite to get elected. By refusing to acceopt compramise, you lost it all and much much more. Why can't you understand the concept that splintering helps the liberals?

The real deal is....I like you RO. I like you a lot, just because we dissagree on some things that does not force me not to like you or anyone else. I have said countless times that the world would be a horribly boring place if we all liked the same things and believed the same things. There is nothing for me to get past, I never asked for you to be removed now have I? As always the getting along will be governed by you, not me. For two people to move foward there must be allowances on both sides RO. Give and take, not take and take. I will continue to work on things and in the last few weeks I have been much more careful to be nicer to people. I have had a couple people even comment on how I am doing better. I want to get along and I want to make more friends. I admit that I have been to harsh sometimes and that I need to change. Change will not be overnight but I am honestly trying. My hand has always been out to you RO, but getting along is a two way street. I will gladly and happily meet you half way. I will not comment again, I am not trying to irritate you or any other staff, I was just making an observation and actually willing to accept things as they seemed to be, I was not crying or playing games, I even said goodbye to several people and gave them my e-mail if they ever wanted to say Hi. I am sorry if my concern from what I saw one day prior seemed irresponsible to voice, | did not see it as unfair to make the connection for expectation. I am good with whatever comes RO, I have no problem with you and hold no grudges, not like I could do anything about them even if I did have them right? I wish you a long and prosperious reign my Lord bows deeply placing the back of my right hand to the floor as I back out of the royal chambers

The same reason you post story after story talking about Omaba messes and such, we share similar beliefs. This split discussion came around because we were talking about Ron Paul as a President and I was showing that while we agree on much of these things like pulling back 'some' of our operations around the world. that is not what Ron Paul believes, and yert your willing to support someone who wants to completely isolate America. So, where we agree, Ron Paul does not. And yet your wasted vote for someone who cannot win is instead helping the socialist win and that means we get further away from a balanced budget, more abuse of the private sector, more big brother and even the radio stations taken over by affermative action policies for more brainwashing activities. I understand what you "think" is happening with your vote of principle that allows you to pretend a kind of "purity" in your mind, but I know your smarter than that, I know you understand that any conservative minded person already sits at a disadvantage and splintering the conservative vote only help the liberals who are willing to stick together when we are not willing to stick together. And yet McCain is not meeting Obama in the middle, and Obama is not willing to meet in the middle either, that is the problem, you can't possibly be saying that if McCain had gotten elected we would be facing the takeover of health insurance by the Government. If you are trying to say that your not being fair or reasonable. Sure, each person may have some ideas that you might think are socialist, but my point has always been that humans are complex and refusing to support someone who is not 100% perfect in your mind means you will never support a conservative minded person who can win the election and as such, your really part of the liberal machine, helping them to splinter conservatives and give them an easier time at the election booth. No point in being insulting, we were having a prewtty good discussion and I see no reason you have to try and put me down, if your unable to understand the example I will gladly explain it. The game is football, the teams are on the field one team against another team, consider the superbowl as an example. Everyone knows the rules and the teams are set to play the game, but several players on one tteam suddenly want to play baseball instead of football. Everyone else is looking at these guys like they have lost their minds and send them out of the field to work out their issues on their own.........but.......those few people were key members of the team, they were needed so that team could win but the guys were so stuck on their own internal desire to play baseball that they lost sight of what their team needed so they could win the game at hand. What happened was the other team planted the idea of baseball into the minds of the first team so they could take away some key players. The second team knew that as long as the first team stuck together they could never win so they used other tactics to break apart that first team, to hurt them from division. And the best part, the lost members of the first team who stopped playing football cling to the idea that their team losing is not their fault. That they ran out on them for good reasons and have no problem with helping the second team win instead of the first team they should have been helping. Certainly the titles change, old liberals would today be considered a Republican. I agree that titles are not the answer, but the results, now that is the key. The result of wasting votes on people who cannot win is we get an Obama President that will do things like this healthcare mess. As much as you like to say they are similar, it is not realistic to believe that someone like McCain would do something like that so in reality, when you help Obama get elected your really supporting the exact opposite from what you say you desire for America. Sure, I agree someone like McCain is not going to do as much as what someone else might do for your desired cause, but nobody who believes exactly like you had a chance to get into office, you are a smart guy, you know that to be true. Let me try a new example: You like fighting and you believe only a full offense, constantly pushing foward and throwing hands is the right way to fight. In the fight you see a punch comming for your jaw, you know there is no possible way to dodge the punch but you do have a chance to get your hand up and take the punch on your gloves. You have a choice to make, try to follow your beliefs and keep throwing hands no matter what happens or accept that this punch comming will knock you out and alter your methods long enough to block the knockout punch. Obama is throwing the knockout punch, all because a lot of people refused to toss up a block. If we avoid the knockout punch it will not becausae of what we conservative minded people did but instead because Obama is just too screwed up to finish the blow.

I love the way you guys twist it around, but your Gods right, your not capable of ever holding grudges right? I was not the guy screaming for staff to eliminate me one day then made staff the next, pardon me for "CONSIDERING" that maybe someone who was petitioning for staff to eliminate me one day might continue the belief that staff should do so the next day when he is made a staff member. I am more than willing to move foward, as I remember it was me who was the one asking for a fresh start not long ago. I very much so want new fututres for all of us, so how about we start by not calling me names just because I voiced a valid concern. That is how this stuff gets started. I think anyone would have had the same concern after reading what RO said one day then was made staff the next. Can you guys at least admit that much? Would any human consider that looked bad?

lol, well all I can say is I find it hard to believe one second your screaming for my removal without me ever breaking a rule then the next second your saying all is forgotten, I guess we will both see how things go from this point foward and judge by the actions. I don't take anything personal, just play the cards I am dealt. Congratz on the promotion, your the man now.

Just coincidence that today was the day, lol.

Ya, I noticed he was calling for my being banned from the forum on your profile yeaterday then you said that was up to the mods, then you made him a mod, lol. I suppose my days are numbered, it was good while it lasted

Okay Bender

Why give me sh t? I was just trying to be helpful to someone asking for help and you think you need to give me sh t for that?

Well said, I agree completely.

What does trying to flame me have to do with helping Ren with her problem? You have a serious chip on your shoulder Bender, make a new thread if you want to play this game and I will gladly follow you there, no point in derailing this thread, she was asking for help, not trying to give you an excuse to take shots at me. Your an admin, break this mess your trying to create into a new thread and we will go there.

Might as well ask why everyone in the world does not do their own engine rebuilds or why they don't just build their homes, bake their own bread or make their own clothing from scratch. Making a pair of jeans is very easy Bender, why not just figure it out and do it yourself? Besides, do you have any idea how happy the teenager geek will be to do this? Ren is hot, the geek will be very happy to fix this little issue for her

Preaching to the choir RO, again I agree with you, we need to pull back, but not completely, Ron Paul wants to pull away completely, that was my point. You spoke of gray areas before I did RO, why is it you refuse to see gray area when it comes to helping conservative minded people get elected? You can pretend to be voting "pure", but the system we have is the system we have. When you waste your vote on someone you know has no possibility of winning, your intentionally helping the socialist get into office. Things like this healthcare bill are only possible because of people like you who refuse to help conservatives get elected. As I said in another thread, the game is football, you know the game and still your trying to play baseball rules, it makes no sense to waste all that energy pretending to want conservative policies then settle for the pure socialist. If you really want conservative values, then help the most conservative people who can win get elected, then you will encourage more conservatives to try public office and we can avoid things like this last year of pure liberal agendas.

If your weak in something there is no shame in getting help. I am assuming your talking about me but as far as I know I don't really push the idea of self reliance. I push personal responsibility with a sledge hammer, but I don't recall ever using the words 'self reliance' recently, maybe not ever.

Well Bender, of course what your saying is good, but your speaking as someone who sees all those steps as easy, like walking. I help a lot of friends who know nothing about computers, the funniest thing I have had a call about lately was a friend who was looking at some naked pictures while his wife was gone and accedently set one of the picts as his wallpaper. He was frantic and his wife was on the way home....I just about pissed myself laughing at this guy. Unfortunately most regular people don't understand these things and sitting silently while the computer reformats and add a couple drivers at the end is much, much simpler. As you said, your reformat twice a year anyway, I do that as well, on my kids computers that have a single hard drive I keep a mirror of a zero install (what I call OS and drivers) on a partition of a external drive, I wipe the hard drive on the computer then ghost the partition to their computer, then another partition has all windows updates on it that I run, pop on the antivirus and I am done. Wiping it clean and reinstalling the OS would be for her, the same thing me and you are talking about we do, it is just done in a way she can handle it as being less computer savy. I was asking her about the local teen geek because that guy would have all the disks and updates as we do and could have her up and running in just a couple hours.

Lord knows America never allowed people to just come to America and live before in the past............ Do you have any knowledge of the past hugo? Your doing the same thing on this issue as you did the other, you gloss over all kinds of stuff that are important and blurt out untrue attacks on Palin. That kind of conservative against conservative garbage is actually helping the liberals put people like Obama into office, this is why I mentioned the Lamm speach because the same tactic of keeping us splintered is now being used on conservatives, being as groups like Libertarians supported Obama in the last election, it would not surprise me if these groups were created by the liberals on purpose to help the splintering process get started. In the very interview you quoted Palin says: Palin is clear, no amnesty. Conservatives do not want to stop all Immigration, they want to stop all "illegal Immigration". Providing a path to citizenship is not amnesty, I have no problem with creating a guest workers program and letting people find a path to being a citizen, who else is going to pick the vegtables? Welfare queens? I have a question for you hugo, if tomorrow you could get what you want and have America activate the military and go on a massive rounding up and deport mission, do you think we would get them all? And do you think they will not come back? The draw is jobs hugo, they can find work here, the only way to keep them away (short of full occupation of the border by the military at all times) is to eliminate the jobs, so how do you propose we do that?

But while we are waiting for things to resettle, we are dividing the vote while the liberals are sticking together. "Divided we fall" Really my biggest problem is when people split hairs and go off the deep end saying things like Palin is the same thing as Obama, it serves no useful purpose to be so completely disingenuous if we truly want to stiffen up the Republicans and make them return to conservative values. We should be rewarding real conservatives like her and encouraging people like her to run for office. When the tide of stupid people call her a socialist, that makes all the decent people run for cover and not even consider public office. This is why we have all these 'professional' politicians, people with quality and character don't want to face the mess. Thanks for the compliment.

Just because I do not do it, that does not mean I do not understand it. I completely understand that the person who voted for someone he knows cannot possibly win is doing so as a kind of personal protest, he is unhappy with the two choices that are available and wishes that this other person could win. But wishing does not change reality, the person who casts the vote still cannot escape the fact that they know their vote will not help a conservative canidate win, so that means he is really helping the liberal. This is the system we have. Let me offer another easier example, wasting their vote is like trying to use baseball rules during a football game, sure you wanted to play baseball, but everyone else is playing football so complaining about the reality will not get you very far. You want baseball first you have to talk everyone else into playing baseball, until then your stuck playing football. A new party, a "tea" party would only divide the conservative minded people into two groups, each without the numbers needed to stand against the liberals who stay united. Division among the conservative minded people is actually helping them. That is why I mentioned the speach by Lamm, it is the same concept.

It is possible to win the lottery, but if you spend your dollar, do you think you will win automatically? No.....why? Because knowledge of reality tells you that the odds are against you, so you know that most likely you have wasted your dollar. Voting for someone other than McCain was less likely to produce favorable results than your lottery dollar because of the same knowledge of reality that no other conservative minded person stood any chance of winning against Obama, so the vote was actually for Obama because it was taken away from McCain because of the divisions and inner termoil of conservatives that are encouraged by liberals. This is exactly the same concept as what Richard Lamm warned us about where we are too busy fighting among ourselves as to who is the most "pure' and we waste our votes while the liberals stick together.

As in the Georgia Senator? I don't know him directly but I just looked up his voting record and he missed about 12% of his votes and supported a lot of very liberal legislation. I will give him credit for supporting things like faith based welfare but he also voted for many welfare increases as well. I guess once again I have to qualify my comment, while some are better than others, all the Democrats support welfare programs from one sort to another. Looking at the votes this guy tended to like some welfare reforms but also voted for increases in ohter areas, that is reshuffling the welfare, not reducing it. He voted yes on adding sexual orientation to the hate crimes list, there is another great example of how even this moderate feels it is Governments responsibility to fix society with this kind of 'social justice'.