Holocaust Denial, American Style 29 Nov 2007

"Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
news:qjp9l31qucv9tl2fi75ahbrttm4017u8ns@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:34:01 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
> mumbled:
>
>> Al Qaeda didn't like Saddam
>
> Oh?

Yeah, Saddam and Osama had no use for eachother.
 
"Zeno" <Zeno@home.kom> wrote in message
news:sb89l31rkjhg93qs9q0ibe3at707hsjl16@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:35:04 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
>>news:s4c6l3t69jv99dndbvkf6864tkoglc7o5i@4ax.com...
>>> On Sun, 2 Dec 2007 11:39:08 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>> mumbled:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Zeno" <Zeno@home.kom> wrote in message
>>>>news:neh3l3l87cosb9dc3e0a7sde9nvmkset09@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 14:39:17 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Zeno" <Zeno@home.kom> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:3hjuk3p4h2dot1ul7d028uf1f1sn3ojbps@4ax.com...
>>>>>>> On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:18:44 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"Gatt" <gatt@damnnearwiley00.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>news:13ku5mjtb569pf1@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "cor" <corDEL@exchangenet.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:13ku2rca6dc3742@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But the actual number of people who have been killed is most
>>>>>>>>>> likely
>>>>>>>>>> more than one million.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Enjoy:
>>>>>>>>> http://ia331307.us.archive.org/2/items/tromenter/almoghad.wmv
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I promise you that almost everybody here will lack the courage to
>>>>>>>>> watch
>>>>>>>>> the whole thing.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The next time you accuse America of murdering people there, make
>>>>>>>>> sure
>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>> subtract the number of people you see being beheaded, macheted,
>>>>>>>>> executed
>>>>>>>>> in the name of Islam or Al Qaeda. You're blaming America for that
>>>>>>>>> as
>>>>>>>>> well.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>America is responsible because as the Occupying Power we are
>>>>>>>>responsible
>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>the safety of the citizens of Iraq. Or didn't you know that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You are thinking that america is "responsible" for Iraqis killing
>>>>>>> their fellow Iraqi? Or, are you unaware of the (almost nothing but)
>>>>>>> sectarian violence?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Iraqis have been killed by Americans in massive numbers, which is our
>>>>>>responsibility. Iraqis have been able to kill eachother because we
>>>>>>haven't
>>>>>>established control over most of the country. As the occupying power,
>>>>>>we
>>>>>>are
>>>>>>responsible for the safety of the people.
>>>>>>Are you unaware of that?
>>>>>
>>>>> One day you will realize that al Qaeda is a criminal gang.
>>>>
>>>>What an odd dodge.
>>>
>>> Accurate too.
>>
>>But nobody was denying that Al Qaeda was a criminal terrorist
>>organization.
>>It's as relevant as saying "one day you're realize that kittens are
>>cuddly"
>
> When you think up a response that supports your position post back...

One day you'll realize that Kittens are cuddly.
 
"Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
news:1np9l31gn2db1c8qqbtqfgh4a64g6aouts@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:35:04 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
> mumbled:
>
>>
>>"Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
>>news:s4c6l3t69jv99dndbvkf6864tkoglc7o5i@4ax.com...
>>> On Sun, 2 Dec 2007 11:39:08 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>> mumbled:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Zeno" <Zeno@home.kom> wrote in message
>>>>news:neh3l3l87cosb9dc3e0a7sde9nvmkset09@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 14:39:17 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Zeno" <Zeno@home.kom> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:3hjuk3p4h2dot1ul7d028uf1f1sn3ojbps@4ax.com...
>>>>>>> On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:18:44 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"Gatt" <gatt@damnnearwiley00.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>news:13ku5mjtb569pf1@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "cor" <corDEL@exchangenet.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:13ku2rca6dc3742@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But the actual number of people who have been killed is most
>>>>>>>>>> likely
>>>>>>>>>> more than one million.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Enjoy:
>>>>>>>>> http://ia331307.us.archive.org/2/items/tromenter/almoghad.wmv
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I promise you that almost everybody here will lack the courage to
>>>>>>>>> watch
>>>>>>>>> the whole thing.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The next time you accuse America of murdering people there, make
>>>>>>>>> sure
>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>> subtract the number of people you see being beheaded, macheted,
>>>>>>>>> executed
>>>>>>>>> in the name of Islam or Al Qaeda. You're blaming America for that
>>>>>>>>> as
>>>>>>>>> well.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>America is responsible because as the Occupying Power we are
>>>>>>>>responsible
>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>the safety of the citizens of Iraq. Or didn't you know that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You are thinking that america is "responsible" for Iraqis killing
>>>>>>> their fellow Iraqi? Or, are you unaware of the (almost nothing but)
>>>>>>> sectarian violence?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Iraqis have been killed by Americans in massive numbers, which is our
>>>>>>responsibility. Iraqis have been able to kill eachother because we
>>>>>>haven't
>>>>>>established control over most of the country. As the occupying power,
>>>>>>we
>>>>>>are
>>>>>>responsible for the safety of the people.
>>>>>>Are you unaware of that?
>>>>>
>>>>> One day you will realize that al Qaeda is a criminal gang.
>>>>
>>>>What an odd dodge.
>>>
>>> Accurate too.
>>
>>But nobody was denying that Al Qaeda was a criminal terrorist
>>organization.
>>It's as relevant as saying "one day you're realize that kittens are
>>cuddly"
>>
> Your point is?????

There was no dispute that AL Qaeda was a criminal organization, so his point
had nothing to do with the discussion.
 
"Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
news:2pp9l3tjv4docuhsa1s7uc6c6q6ogmdjiu@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:36:45 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
> mumbled:
>
>>
>>"Mavisbeacon" <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> wrote in message
>>news:c%Y4j.61$lt.52@amsnews12...
>>>
>>> "Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
>>> news:a5c6l3trilg9u3n4eemv67o5f7kmqoj67t@4ax.com...
>>>> On Sun, 2 Dec 2007 11:39:28 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>> mumbled:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
>>>>>news:p9s3l35s0uicbfp06h9sj3ta8tjbhnceoe@4ax.com...
>>>>>> On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 14:39:17 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>>> mumbled:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Zeno" <Zeno@home.kom> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:3hjuk3p4h2dot1ul7d028uf1f1sn3ojbps@4ax.com...
>>>>>>>> On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:18:44 -0500, "abracadabra"
>>>>>>>> <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>"Gatt" <gatt@damnnearwiley00.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>news:13ku5mjtb569pf1@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "cor" <corDEL@exchangenet.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>> news:13ku2rca6dc3742@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> But the actual number of people who have been killed is most
>>>>>>>>>>> likely
>>>>>>>>>>> more than one million.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Enjoy:
>>>>>>>>>> http://ia331307.us.archive.org/2/items/tromenter/almoghad.wmv
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I promise you that almost everybody here will lack the courage to
>>>>>>>>>> watch
>>>>>>>>>> the whole thing.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The next time you accuse America of murdering people there, make
>>>>>>>>>> sure
>>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>>> subtract the number of people you see being beheaded, macheted,
>>>>>>>>>> executed
>>>>>>>>>> in the name of Islam or Al Qaeda. You're blaming America for
>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>> as
>>>>>>>>>> well.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>America is responsible because as the Occupying Power we are
>>>>>>>>>responsible
>>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>>the safety of the citizens of Iraq. Or didn't you know that?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You are thinking that america is "responsible" for Iraqis killing
>>>>>>>> their fellow Iraqi? Or, are you unaware of the (almost nothing
>>>>>>>> but)
>>>>>>>> sectarian violence?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Iraqis have been killed by Americans in massive numbers,
>>>>>> Tough.
>>>>>
>>>>>Your post is certainly idiotic.
>>>>>
>>>> You are a witless simp.
>>>
>>> when you cant deal with the actual topic do you always resorting to
>>> attacking the other person?
>>
>>He can also quote conservative rags
>
> And you can lie, so?

Anyone can lie, but I don't.
 
"Mavisbeacon" <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> wrote in message
news:Cea5j.4$eF.1@amsnews12...
>
> "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:47547780$0$2397$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>>
> [snip]
>>>>
>>> You are a witless simp.
>>
>> Name calling only proves the emptiness of your arguments and mind. Better
>> luck next time idiot.
>
> Hmmm. Who is "name calling " now?
> I really think you should withdraw that remark and see if the other person
> is big enough to accept the apology/correction.
>
> I suspect he won't. In which case you have proven your point all the more.

I thought "idiot" was an observation rather than an insult. One guess the
only ones indulted would be the National Association of Idiots, who have a
higher standard than Ivan does.
 
On Tue, 4 Dec 2007 19:07:03 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
mumbled:

>
>"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
>news:8bval3hpr9qr296ibobtt8ih7duhnr2af5@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 10:52:36 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
>> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>>
>>>al quad were NOT in any way prevalent in Iraq under
>>>Saddam
>>
>> LIAR!
>>
>> http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/003/033jgqyi.asp
>>
>
>
>Weakly Standard is

NO FACTUAL REBUTTAL!
 
On Tue, 4 Dec 2007 19:08:03 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
mumbled:

>
>"Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
>news:2pp9l3tjv4docuhsa1s7uc6c6q6ogmdjiu@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:36:45 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>> mumbled:
>>
>>>
>>>"Mavisbeacon" <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> wrote in message
>>>news:c%Y4j.61$lt.52@amsnews12...
>>>>
>>>> "Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
>>>> news:a5c6l3trilg9u3n4eemv67o5f7kmqoj67t@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Sun, 2 Dec 2007 11:39:28 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>> mumbled:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:p9s3l35s0uicbfp06h9sj3ta8tjbhnceoe@4ax.com...
>>>>>>> On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 14:39:17 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>>>> mumbled:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"Zeno" <Zeno@home.kom> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>news:3hjuk3p4h2dot1ul7d028uf1f1sn3ojbps@4ax.com...
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:18:44 -0500, "abracadabra"
>>>>>>>>> <abra@hotmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>"Gatt" <gatt@damnnearwiley00.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>news:13ku5mjtb569pf1@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "cor" <corDEL@exchangenet.net> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>> news:13ku2rca6dc3742@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> But the actual number of people who have been killed is most
>>>>>>>>>>>> likely
>>>>>>>>>>>> more than one million.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Enjoy:
>>>>>>>>>>> http://ia331307.us.archive.org/2/items/tromenter/almoghad.wmv
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I promise you that almost everybody here will lack the courage to
>>>>>>>>>>> watch
>>>>>>>>>>> the whole thing.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The next time you accuse America of murdering people there, make
>>>>>>>>>>> sure
>>>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>>>> subtract the number of people you see being beheaded, macheted,
>>>>>>>>>>> executed
>>>>>>>>>>> in the name of Islam or Al Qaeda. You're blaming America for
>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>> as
>>>>>>>>>>> well.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>America is responsible because as the Occupying Power we are
>>>>>>>>>>responsible
>>>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>>>the safety of the citizens of Iraq. Or didn't you know that?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> You are thinking that america is "responsible" for Iraqis killing
>>>>>>>>> their fellow Iraqi? Or, are you unaware of the (almost nothing
>>>>>>>>> but)
>>>>>>>>> sectarian violence?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Iraqis have been killed by Americans in massive numbers,
>>>>>>> Tough.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Your post is certainly idiotic.
>>>>>>
>>>>> You are a witless simp.
>>>>
>>>> when you cant deal with the actual topic do you always resorting to
>>>> attacking the other person?
>>>
>>>He can also quote conservative rags
>>
>> And you can lie, so?
>
>Anyone can lie, but I don't.
>
Yes you do.
 
On Tue, 4 Dec 2007 19:04:00 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
mumbled:

>Saddam and Osama had no use for eachother.
Wrong.
 
On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 14:39:17 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>
>"Zeno" <Zeno@home.kom> wrote in message
>news:3hjuk3p4h2dot1ul7d028uf1f1sn3ojbps@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:18:44 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Gatt" <gatt@damnnearwiley00.com> wrote in message
>>>news:13ku5mjtb569pf1@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>
>>>> "cor" <corDEL@exchangenet.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:13ku2rca6dc3742@corp.supernews.com...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> But the actual number of people who have been killed is most likely
>>>>> more than one million.
>>>>
>>>> Enjoy: http://ia331307.us.archive.org/2/items/tromenter/almoghad.wmv
>>>>
>>>> I promise you that almost everybody here will lack the courage to watch
>>>> the whole thing.
>>>>
>>>> The next time you accuse America of murdering people there, make sure
>>>> you
>>>> subtract the number of people you see being beheaded, macheted, executed
>>>> in the name of Islam or Al Qaeda. You're blaming America for that as
>>>> well.
>>>
>>>America is responsible because as the Occupying Power we are responsible
>>>for
>>>the safety of the citizens of Iraq. Or didn't you know that?
>>
>> You are thinking that america is "responsible" for Iraqis killing
>> their fellow Iraqi? Or, are you unaware of the (almost nothing but)
>> sectarian violence?
>
>Iraqis have been killed by Americans in massive numbers, which is our
>responsibility. Iraqis have been able to kill eachother because we haven't
>established control over most of the country. As the occupying power, we are
>responsible for the safety of the people.

You might be surprised. I have discovered something that profoundly
reinforces your position and drastically reduces mine, LOL. Here it
is:

"
One day you'll realize that Kittens are cuddly.
"


>Are you unaware of that?
>
>
 
"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
news:ifobl3du82egk9gku9109f4qto6n19l56p@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 20:50:55 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>
> Dublin, Ireland
>
> 89.100.47.254 = [ 089-100-047254.ntlworld.ie ]
> inetnum: 89.100.0.0 - 89.101.127.255
[snip]
[snip]
> descr: NTL Ireland

NTL Ireland does not exist anymore! You should have checked that before you
posted.

What are you trying to prove? When you lose the argument do you always try
to attack the person? LOL!
 
"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
news:siobl358uv70vuvpmn7t5ps4a02s0skt5n@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 20:59:24 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>
>>Anyway at best a single meeting a decade ago whiuch IS NOt evidence of
>>planning world terror
>
> LIAR!
>
> http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?Page=\Nation\archive\200410\NAT20041011a.html
> When CNSNews.com published an article Monday, Oct. 4, entitled,
[snip - news spin article]

Read the actual report by the CIA. Well you can read the declassified
version anyway.
Here:

http://intelligence.senate.gov/phaseiiaccuracy.pdf


They examined MILLIONS of pages! It is strange that your 42 pages are not
there because they only report ONE meeting with Al Khyda operatives and they
say NO EVIDENCE OF LINKS between al Quaeda and Iraq.

Thats MILLIONS of pages examined by the CIA not by a media spindoctor.

What have you to say about the actual findings of you own security services?
the don't seem to list your media spin piece do they?
 
"abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4755ebb8$0$8677$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>
> "Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
> news:qjp9l31qucv9tl2fi75ahbrttm4017u8ns@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:34:01 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>> mumbled:
>>
>>> Al Qaeda didn't like Saddam
>>
>> Oh?
>
> Yeah, Saddam and Osama had no use for eachother.

Why would a religious zealot bent on introducing Islamic Law into Arabia
like a whisky drinking dictator who wanted to rule a country himslef rather
than allow Islamists run the place?
 
"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
news:ugtbl3pdg04j6nlssgriovr0hfmodsgra1@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 4 Dec 2007 19:07:03 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
> mumbled:
>
>>
>>"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
>>news:8bval3hpr9qr296ibobtt8ih7duhnr2af5@4ax.com...
>>> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 10:52:36 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
>>> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>>>
>>>>al quad were NOT in any way prevalent in Iraq under
>>>>Saddam
>>>
>>> LIAR!
>>>
>>> http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/003/033jgqyi.asp
>>>
>>
>>
>>Weakly Standard is
>
> NO FACTUAL REBUTTAL!

Here is factual rebuttal:

In 2003 Jan 26 on page 11 of a Report entitled "CIA: Iraqi support for
Terrorism" (which you can find referred to - ref 160- on page 64 of the
following reference) "Saddam Hussain and Uasama Bin Liden are far from
being natural partners"


I use an official report to the US congress
http://intelligence.senate.gov/phaseiiaccuracy.pdf

For the Iraq intel links you will note that have gone through 30 million
pages of Iraqi documents!

On page 65-66 you will note that GEORGE TENET (know him? The HEAD of CIA)
stated there is no confirmation of links to al quaeda!

It goes on about the lack of links and no supstantial proof of such links.

On page 71 you will note the Answer Al Islam (Zawharis group) is mentioned
as being linked to al Quaeda but NOT to Iraqi authorities!

They then go through links to al quaeda and planning operations withthem.
NOWHERE is any Philipnes attack mentioned.
Ther is one document in the whole 30 million which mentions people meeting
Al Quaeda and leavinf the door open for the POSSIBILITY of working together
(not actually working with them like the US did with the MuJIHADeen) -
bottom of page 73 where you note Bin Laden called Saddam an "unbeliever".

You may also have read the actual transcripts of Bin Ladens videos from the
cave in which he decries Saddam?

Skip on to page 82 for information on Salman Pak. On page 83 you will note
the OFFICIAL US POSITION of NO TRAINING of terrorists at Salman Pak after
1991!

On poage 84 the DIA states NO LINKS between Al Quaeda and Salman Pak!

Actually on page 85 you will note that far from training for terrorism it
was for training for COUNTER TERRORISM! In fact why would terrorists need to
train outdoors using an airplane? all they would need is a mockup of the
INSIDE of the Airplane! It is the COUNTER terrorists who want to take
control of the Airplane from the terrorists who need an Airplane to train
on?


On page 88 note the reference to Iraq not controlling the Kiurdis North and
that Al Zakawi'sd Anser Al Islam group operated there!

from 88-page 93 you will note that Iraq viewed Anser Al islam and Al Zawhari
as t THREAT and not as an Ally!

On page 94 they nmove on to the Prague meeting.

By the end of page 96 - reference 264 you will note that the US intelligence
service authotities are "Skeptical" whether Atta travelled to Prague!

The real meat however comes from page 105 - conclusions:

Conclusion 1: Saddam distrusted Al quaeda and refused ALL requests to work
with them!

2. There was ONE meeting between Saddams regime and Al Quaeda. There were
possibly two more where the Al Quaeda were rebuffed by Saddam.

3. No links on chemical and bio weapons

4. NO training by Saddams regime of Al Quaeda at Salman Pak OR ANYWHERE ELSE
in Iraq!

5. Saddam tried but failed to capture Zawahi and Anser al Islam. He did not
harbour them or co operate with them or even turn a blind eye to them!

6. Anser al Islan operated since 1991 in Kurdish controlled Northern Iraq
outside of Saddams reach.

7. No involvement in Sept 11 attacks.

8. No intention to work with terrorrists

That gets you to page 111.

THAT IS THE WORD fromn CIA DIA FBI and NSA and Homeland Security based on
what they now know!
 
"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
news:vombl3t4edn70vn8t0rdtogpsppm4b7dva@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 18:02:10 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>
>
> rubbish....
>
[snip claims without any supporting evidence]

Here is the OFFICIAL report which you call reuubis:
I
n 2003 Jan 26 on page 11 of a Report entitled "CIA: Iraqi support for
Terrorism" (which you can find referred to - ref 160- on page 64 of the
following reference) "Saddam Hussain and Uasama Bin Liden are far from
being natural partners"

http://intelligence.senate.gov/phaseiiaccuracy.pdf

For the Iraq intel links you will note that have gone through 30 million
pages of Iraqi documents!

On page 65-66 you will note that GEORGE TENET (know him? The HEAD of CIA)
stated there is no confirmation of links to al quaeda!

It goes on about the lack of links and no supstantial proof of such links.

On page 71 you will note the Answer Al Islam (Zawharis group) is mentioned
as being linked to al Quaeda but NOT to Iraqi authorities!

They then go through links to al quaeda and planning operations withthem.
NOWHERE is any Philipnes attack mentioned.
Ther is one document in the whole 30 million which mentions people meeting
Al Quaeda and leavinf the door open for the POSSIBILITY of working together
(not actually working with them like the US did with the MuJIHADeen) -
bottom of page 73 where you note Bin Laden called Saddam an "unbeliever".

You may also have read the actual transcripts of Bin Ladens videos from the
cave in which he decries Saddam?

Skip on to page 82 for information on Salman Pak. On page 83 you will note
the OFFICIAL US POSITION of NO TRAINING of terrorists at Salman Pak after
1991!

On poage 84 the DIA states NO LINKS between Al Quaeda and Salman Pak!

Actually on page 85 you will note that far from training for terrorism it
was for training for COUNTER TERRORISM! In fact why would terrorists need to
train outdoors using an airplane? all they would need is a mockup of the
INSIDE of the Airplane! It is the COUNTER terrorists who want to take
control of the Airplane from the terrorists who need an Airplane to train
on?


On page 88 note the reference to Iraq not controlling the Kiurdis North and
that Al Zakawi'sd Anser Al Islam group operated there!

from 88-page 93 you will note that Iraq viewed Anser Al islam and Al Zawhari
as t THREAT and not as an Ally!

On page 94 they nmove on to the Prague meeting.

By the end of page 96 - reference 264 you will note that the US intelligence
service authotities are "Skeptical" whether Atta travelled to Prague!

The real meat however comes from page 105 - conclusions:

Conclusion 1: Saddam distrusted Al quaeda and refused ALL requests to work
with them!

2. There was ONE meeting between Saddams regime and Al Quaeda. There were
possibly two more where the Al Quaeda were rebuffed by Saddam.

3. No links on chemical and bio weapons

4. NO training by Saddams regime of Al Quaeda at Salman Pak OR ANYWHERE ELSE
in Iraq!

5. Saddam tried but failed to capture Zawahi and Anser al Islam. He did not
harbour them or co operate with them or even turn a blind eye to them!

6. Anser al Islan operated since 1991 in Kurdish controlled Northern Iraq
outside of Saddams reach.

7. No involvement in Sept 11 attacks.

8. No intention to work with terrorrists

That gets yo to page 111.

THAT IS THE WORD fromn CIA DIA FBI and NSA and Homeland Security based on
what they now know!
 
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 01:30:20 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
<Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:

>
>"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
>news:ifobl3du82egk9gku9109f4qto6n19l56p@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 20:50:55 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
>> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>>
>> Dublin, Ireland
>>
>> 89.100.47.254 = [ 089-100-047254.ntlworld.ie ]
>> inetnum: 89.100.0.0 - 89.101.127.255
>[snip]
>[snip]
>> descr: NTL Ireland
>
>NTL Ireland does not exist anymore!

Oh?
 
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 01:30:20 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
<Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:

>
>"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
>news:siobl358uv70vuvpmn7t5ps4a02s0skt5n@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 20:59:24 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
>> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>>
>>>Anyway at best a single meeting a decade ago whiuch IS NOt evidence of
>>>planning world terror
>>
>> LIAR!
>>
>> http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?Page=\Nation\archive\200410\NAT20041011a.html
>> When CNSNews.com published an article Monday, Oct. 4, entitled,
>[snip - news spin article]
>
>Read the actual report by the CIA.

Read what they found AFTER the invasion - fool.
 
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 01:30:20 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
<Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:

>
>"abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:4755ebb8$0$8677$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>>
>> "Ivanhoe Martin" <cliff@rasta.man> wrote in message
>> news:qjp9l31qucv9tl2fi75ahbrttm4017u8ns@4ax.com...
>>> On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:34:01 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>>> mumbled:
>>>
>>>> Al Qaeda didn't like Saddam
>>>
>>> Oh?
>>
>> Yeah, Saddam and Osama had no use for eachother.
>
>Why would a religious zealot bent on introducing Islamic Law into Arabia
>like a whisky drinking dictator who wanted to rule a country himslef rather
>than allow Islamists run the place?
>
The enemy of my enemy...etc...
 
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 01:42:05 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
<Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:

>
>"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
>news:vombl3t4edn70vn8t0rdtogpsppm4b7dva@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 18:02:10 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
>> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>>
>>
>> rubbish....
>>
>[snip claims without any supporting evidence]
>
>Here is the OFFICIAL report

That is the official whitewash.
 
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 01:42:05 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
<Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:

>
>"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
>news:ugtbl3pdg04j6nlssgriovr0hfmodsgra1@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 4 Dec 2007 19:07:03 -0500, "abracadabra" <abra@hotmail.com>
>> mumbled:
>>
>>>
>>>"Sir Sam" <nite@cru.sade> wrote in message
>>>news:8bval3hpr9qr296ibobtt8ih7duhnr2af5@4ax.com...
>>>> On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 10:52:36 GMT, "Mavisbeacon"
>>>> <Mavisbeacon@nospam.forme> mumbled:
>>>>
>>>>>al quad were NOT in any way prevalent in Iraq under
>>>>>Saddam
>>>>
>>>> LIAR!
>>>>
>>>> http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/003/033jgqyi.asp
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Weakly Standard is
>>
>> NO FACTUAL REBUTTAL!
>
>Here is factual rebuttal:
>
>In 2003 Jan 26 on page 11 of a Report entitled "CIA: Iraqi support for
>Terrorism" (which you can find referred to - ref 160- on page 64 of the
>following reference) "Saddam Hussain and Uasama Bin Liden are far from
>being natural partners"
>
>
> I use an official report to the US congress

Politician spin, hardly the final say.
 

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